Skywatcher explorer 130 f900, which EP to view planets?

[fullmoon]

I've had a quick look back through my posts and can't see that I've asked this. So as the title says really. Is there an EP recommended for viewing planets that might help me see some detail? I'm Specifically drawn to Jupiter right now. And when I look at it through my scope, I am amazed and love it. But I do crave a bit of detail or more focus.

So I was hoping that someone could advise me on which EP would be best suited. And also, can I change the focuser on this scope?

I've had a play around with my current eyepieces. I've got the standard 10mm and 25mm that came with the scope and I've also purchased an 8mm starguider.

I did a bit of observing tonight and at the end of it I snapped a few shots with just my phone held up to the EP, just to show you what results I'm currently getting(of Jupiter). Personally, I actually prefer the 10mm view. But I would love to see some shading of the planets.

Is that even possible with my scope?

Look forward to your input.

 

Oh, 1 last thing. Is my scope good enough to be able to see the galaxies or is that a bit beyond it?

 

Cheers

 

Rich

Edited February 16, 2023 by fullmoon
Planet info

[malc-c]

You might be expecting too much.  To view planets in great detail you need a long focal length scope, short focal length eyepiece and aperture.  Magnification is a product of  the scopes focal length divided by the eyepiece focal length.  Assuming you had a decent 4mm eyepiece the max magnification for your scope would be 225x... but at that magnification the image will be very dark and grainy as the aperture of the 130 is small at around 5".  Using barlow lenses does effectively double the magnification, but also dims the image further.

It's for these reasons that people opt for large, long focal length scopes like Cassergrain Schmitt telescopes, or similar, where you have 8" or more aperture and a 2000mm + focal length. 

You're scope is more suited for some of the brighter DSO's, where a wider field of view with the low magnification eyepiece (the 25mm for example) could show a nice defined smudge of say the Andromeda galaxy, or the Orion Nebula.  Under really dark skies and with good seeing you should be able to see quite a lot of the globular clusters and open clusters.

Hope that helps 

[fullmoon]

6 hours ago, malc-c said:

You might be expecting too much.  To view planets in great detail you need a long focal length scope, short focal length eyepiece and aperture.  Magnification is a product of  the scopes focal length divided by the eyepiece focal length.  Assuming you had a decent 4mm eyepiece the max magnification for your scope would be 225x... but at that magnification the image will be very dark and grainy as the aperture of the 130 is small at around 5".  Using barlow lenses does effectively double the magnification, but also dims the image further.

It's for these reasons that people opt for large, long focal length scopes like Cassergrain Schmitt telescopes, or similar, where you have 8" or more aperture and a 2000mm + focal length. 

You're scope is more suited for some of the brighter DSO's, where a wider field of view with the low magnification eyepiece (the 25mm for example) could show a nice defined smudge of say the Andromeda galaxy, or the Orion Nebula.  Under really dark skies and with good seeing you should be able to see quite a lot of the globular clusters and open clusters.

Hope that helps 

Thank you so much. That's really helpful. 1, to manage my expectations and 2 to give me targets to focus on. 

With that in mind, you said my scope would be more suited to bright DSO's. Is there an eyepiece that I would benefit from? Or do you think the wide 25mm that came with the scope would be sufficient?

I also would like to emit the Barlow lense. So not sure if that would effect my choice.

 

Thanks again

 

Rich

[Justin richens]

I brought a celestron 8-24mm zoom and I find myself not using anything else as its so easy to work with

[malc-c]

6 hours ago, Justin richens said:

I brought a celestron 8-24mm zoom and I find myself not using anything else as its so easy to work with

Rich, Justin has made a good suggestion.  There are some excellent tools on the internet that can give you some idea of the field of view for any telescope aperture, and focal length when used with various objects  Here's one for example  Now you may not see the detail in the image it uses, but you will get some idea of how much an object might fill the view.

One thing that often disappoints newcomers is that they see a picture of a distant galaxy in a magazine or book that has all the dust lanes in and lots of colour, and then when they look through a scope at the same galaxy all they see is a faint, slightly smudged thing with a slightly brighter centre, and sometimes have to use averted vision (looking to the left or right, top or bottom of the view) so the eye can pick out some detail....  Again a lot depends on your location.  In a dark site away from light pollution, and with good seeing conditions you'll see more than from a garden in a town.   

[fullmoon]

9 hours ago, Justin richens said:

I brought a celestron 8-24mm zoom and I find myself not using anything else as its so easy to work with

That's been mentioned to me before actually and is a really good point. Cheers

3 hours ago, malc-c said:

Rich, Justin has made a good suggestion.  There are some excellent tools on the internet that can give you some idea of the field of view for any telescope aperture, and focal length when used with various objects  Here's one for example  Now you may not see the detail in the image it uses, but you will get some idea of how much an object might fill the view.

One thing that often disappoints newcomers is that they see a picture of a distant galaxy in a magazine or book that has all the dust lanes in and lots of colour, and then when they look through a scope at the same galaxy all they see is a faint, slightly smudged thing with a slightly brighter centre, and sometimes have to use averted vision (looking to the left or right, top or bottom of the view) so the eye can pick out some detail....  Again a lot depends on your location.  In a dark site away from light pollution, and with good seeing conditions you'll see more than from a garden in a town.   

Thanks for that resource link, it was super helpful. Think I may opt for a zoom lens..... for now. Just so many to choose from.

All of my viewing so far has either been from my back garden or lounge window. And to add we are pretty low down, Venus is out of view by 7pm. Would love to get it to a dark site.

[Littleguy80]

Hi. I had that scope as my first telescope. I was able to see the GRS on Jupiter with it using both the 8mm BST and a 6mm Baader Genuine Ortho. Orthos are fantastic planetary eyepieces but have short eye relief (not suitable if you wear glasses to observe) and quite a small field of view. I think the 6mm Baader Classic Ortho quite often comes up second hand for around £30-£40. The Baader Neodymium Moon and Skyglow filter can help with Jupiter too. 

One thing to keep in mind with planetary observing is that the seeing (atmospheric disturbance) can have a big impact on your views which you can’t control. Things you can do to maximise your views include making sure you scope is well collimated and cooled before observing. When you get an evening of good seeing then you’ll see the benefits of all these things. 

[Nyctimene]

Your Skywatcher Explorer 130 is, IMO, well suited for both target groups - planetary/moon and DSO's. Most important is, that it comes with a parabolic primary mirror. I'm owning the Skywatcher Heritage 130 P Flextube (same aperture, but shorter focal length of 650 mm), and can make out a lot of planetary detail with it, e.g. Jupiter's Great Red Spot (as Neil already mentioned above), several  cloud bands and zones, sometimes with details, shadow transits of the moons. The Cassini division of Saturn's ring is obvious; three moons should be in reach. And you will, under a dark sky, spot a lot of DSO's. All the Messier and Caldwell objects will be accessible, as well as many NGC ones; the aperture is large enough.

I'm using the 130 P with the same 8-24 mmf zoom (Seben clone) as Justin, which is astonishingly good, and crank up the magnification with the Baader Turret 2.25x Barlow (a shorty Barlow) up to 183x without problems. Have a look:

https://www.teleskop-express.de/shop/product_info.php/info/p5503_Baader-1-25--Q-Turret-Barlow-and-photo-converter---2-25x-und-1-3x.html

The supplied standard Barlow often seems to be the weak point. The Baader Orthos always get excellent reviews; so the choice will depend on your preferences and budget.

Just looked up your location Congleton here; there seem to exist some smaller dark areas 20 kms to the W; and ,of course, Wales, not too far away:

https://www.lightpollutionmap.info/#zoom=8.48&lat=53.0173&lon=-1.9697&layers=B0FFFFFFTFFFFFFFFFFFF

Enjoy the journey, and keep asking and reporting!

Stephan

[Stu]

I can only agree with Neil and Stephan, your scope should be more than capable of showing you some enjoyable detail on planets.

I shan’t give any advice as you’ve already received some great stuff from them. Just to say that I’ve owned a Heritage 130p and seen very good detail on Jupiter and Mars with it. Get the collimation and cooling right, and when the skies are nice and stable the detail will come. If you are only seeing the same through your scope as your pictures then don’t worry, there is much more to see.

These are hand held single smartphone shots admittedly not taken through the same scope, but they are through smallish scopes (100mm and 150mm) and show that you can see detail with them.

Do bear in mind that both Jupiter and Mars are past their best for the year now so best views will need to wait until their next oppositions.

[malc-c]

Thanks guys for giving examples of what the OP could expect to get under ideal seeing conditions.  What I was trying to get across was that the OP should not be expecting the scope to give images like this which uses a 14" scope with a 7.5m focal length at f20.

 

 

 

 

(example taken via google)

[Stu]

11 minutes ago, malc-c said:

Thanks guys for giving examples of what the OP could expect to get under ideal seeing conditions.  What I was trying to get across was that the OP should not be expecting the scope to give images like this which uses a 14" scope with a 7.5m focal length at f20.

 

 

 

 

(example taken via google)

I don’t believe anyone was implying that Malc. The images I posted are worse than the view through the scope and whilst I had reasonable seeing, they are views which are quite achievable with patience and practise. No need for a 14” scope!

[fullmoon]

1 hour ago, Littleguy80 said:

Hi. I had that scope as my first telescope. I was able to see the GRS on Jupiter with it using both the 8mm BST and a 6mm Baader Genuine Ortho. Orthos are fantastic planetary eyepieces but have short eye relief (not suitable if you wear glasses to observe) and quite a small field of view. I think the 6mm Baader Classic Ortho quite often comes up second hand for around £30-£40. The Baader Neodymium Moon and Skyglow filter can help with Jupiter too. 

Thanks for the recommendation,  I will definitely look those up. 

1 hour ago, Nyctimene said:

Your Skywatcher Explorer 130 is, IMO, well suited for both target groups - planetary/moon and DSO's. Most important is, that it comes with a parabolic primary mirror. I'm owning the Skywatcher Heritage 130 P Flextube (same aperture, but shorter focal length of 650 mm), and can make out a lot of planetary detail with it, e.g. Jupiter's Great Red Spot (as Neil already mentioned above), several  cloud bands and zones, sometimes with details, shadow transits of the moons. The Cassini division of Saturn's ring is obvious; three moons should be in reach. And you will, under a dark sky, spot a lot of DSO's. All the Messier and Caldwell objects will be accessible, as well as many NGC ones; the aperture is large enough.

I'm using the 130 P with the same 8-24 mmf zoom (Seben clone) as Justin, which is astonishingly good, and crank up the magnification with the Baader Turret 2.25x Barlow (a shorty Barlow) up to 183x without problems. Have a look:

https://www.teleskop-express.de/shop/product_info.php/info/p5503_Baader-1-25--Q-Turret-Barlow-and-photo-converter---2-25x-und-1-3x.html

The supplied standard Barlow often seems to be the weak point. The Baader Orthos always get excellent reviews; so the choice will depend on your preferences and budget.

Just looked up your location Congleton here; there seem to exist some smaller dark areas 20 kms to the W; and ,of course, Wales, not too far away:

https://www.lightpollutionmap.info/#zoom=8.48&lat=53.0173&lon=-1.9697&layers=B0FFFFFFTFFFFFFFFFFFF

Enjoy the journey, and keep asking and reporting!

Stephan

Thanks Stephan, unfortunately mine doesn't have the parabolic mirror. But you have all given me hope, that I will see better detail. I'm torn between a zoom eyepiece or maybe a 6mm as mentioned by Neil. And I definitely think you're right about the standard Barlow!

22 minutes ago, Stu said:

I can only agree with Neil and Stephan, your scope should be more than capable of showing you some enjoyable detail on planets.

I shan’t give any advice as you’ve already received some great stuff from them. Just to say that I’ve owned a Heritage 130p and seen very good detail on Jupiter and Mars with it. Get the collimation and cooling right, and when the skies are nice and stable the detail will come. If you are only seeing the same through your scope as your pictures then don’t worry, there is much more to see.

 

Thanks for the examples Stu, I will be over the moon if I can get close to them views. And yeah, what the pictures show is exactly what I'm seeing. 

Should I try a filter maybe?

Also how often do I collimate? The scope is only a few weeks old. Although it has bounced off a few door frames transporting to and from outside to the lounge window.

[jetstream]

Our Heritage 130 showed Mars as a blurry, seething mess dancing all over the place last night However I know this scope well and it provides sharp, crisp views of the planets and moon- strikingly so actually.

What was happening was very poor seeing and when its very bad nothing is going to punch through it.

@fullmoon I think one of the things degrading your view could have been poor seeing and possibly the scope wasnt temp equalized either. Throw a hint of miscollimation in there and all you would see is a blurry seething mess.

I'm sure that your scope will show shading on Mars and some detail on Jupiter, seeing considered, cooling considered and collimation considered.👍

The stock 10mm SW I found to be lacking, a nice 10mm BCO/Baader Q barlow could help things out once the things mentioned above are taken care of.

Gerry

[fullmoon]

8 minutes ago, jetstream said:

 

What was happening was very poor seeing and when its very bad nothing is going to punch through it.

@fullmoon I think one of the things degrading your view could have been poor seeing and possibly the scope wasnt temp equalized either. Throw a hint of miscollimation in there and all you would see is a blurry seething mess.

I think you're probably right, there was a thin slither of low cloud, virtually transparent but cloud nonetheless. 

And also I don't know if its collimated correctly. (Another 1 for me to research ha)

 

[Stu]

40 minutes ago, fullmoon said:

Thanks for the examples Stu, I will be over the moon if I can get close to them views. And yeah, what the pictures show is exactly what I'm seeing. 

Should I try a filter maybe?

Also how often do I collimate? The scope is only a few weeks old. Although it has bounced off a few door frames transporting to and from outside to the lounge window.

Well, as said, it that’s what you are seeing then there should be a lot more to come when things come good.

I wouldn’t bother with a filter for now. Concentrate on getting the scope cooled and collimated well, and avoiding observing over houses, heating flumes etc. observe for as long and as often as you can, so that you catch the times of best seeing. With some better eyepieces giving you higher mag, the planet will show larger and a bit dimmer in the eyepiece which helps the detail show through.

Collimation is key to the best views as well. Banging against door frames will certainly challenge it, so I would absolutely give it a check each time. Often once the secondary is setup well it tends to stay out, but the primary normally needs a tweak just to keep it spot on. Planetary contrast drops off quickly off your collimation is off.

[dweller25]

Hello @fullmoon,

You have been given lots of good advice above.

I find to get best planetary views you need…..

Good seeing - that is down to luck.

A fully cooled telescope.

A well collimated telescope.

A magnification of around x180 - so a 5mm in your scope.

Hope that helps

[Nyctimene]

16 minutes ago, fullmoon said:

I don't know if its collimated correctly. (Another 1 for me to research

Astro Baby's Collimation Guide will help you; have a look:

https://www.astro-baby.com/astrobaby/help/collimation-guide-newtonian-reflector/

Stephan

[fullmoon]

Thanks everyone for all your replies, you've all been really helpful. 

Will take a look at that collimation guide, thanks Stephan👍.