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Beginner - Heritage v Startravel 80


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I'm hoping to get a new scope for teenager (and myself), and we're complete beginners.  Always loved stargazing, and live in an area with little/no light pollution, so wanting to invest in a beginner scope.  Budget is up to £200 all-in.  Have been looking at the Heritage 100p (though, this may not be delivered before Christmas), Heritage 130p, or Startravel 80.  Any advice on which might be best?

Many thanks.

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I've owned both (Newt was technically not a Heritage but same optics) .

Startravel 80 has a lot less aperture also but less fiddly (no collimation) and can be used later for guiding should you get the astrophotography bug. Very good for widefield but less hot on planets for all the well-quoted reasons, although far from useless. Really nice widefield views for starfields. Scope sits quite happily on a decent camera tripod. It's Ryanair-compatible as well.

The Skywatcher 130mm Newtonians are quite good. Almost a 6" with a lot less weight. Performance on planets  was very acceptable. 

If I knew this was the only instrument I'd  intend to have then I'd go for the Heritage, but the ST80 is more futureproof as it can be used either as a big finder or a guidescope if you do decide to move on to something bigger. 

Both work best with eyepieces that cope well with fast optical systems; you may want to factor this in for future budgeting. The stock 10 and 25mm can be a bit underwhelming. 

Ease of use and the steadiness of the mount will be a big factor in how often it gets used...

Either way you're not losing too much cash if you sell it on later.

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A 130-ish newtonian on whatever mount is a good all round scope.
With the right eyepieces you can get wide views or tight planetary viewing.
The down side you hear about is collimation. Which in reality is far less bother than many imply.
If/when you do collimate this type of scope, you don't need the expensive tools and the skills are easy enough to pick up.

The ST80 is a low cost refractor which gives good performance for the price.
The downer here is colour fringing on bright objects - caused by the objective. Reflectors do not suffer this.

A 130 type newt is more bulky to store. But not that big.
It has much more light gather than the 80mm, allowing you to view dimmer objects.

Both are good choices. But different. One is not better than the other.

Where in the country are you? I'm wondering about you visiting an astro retailer.

A firm recommendation is to NOT NOT NOT buy from ebay, amazon, currys, etc.
Always use a specialist astro retailer. He can help you afterwards.

Keep asking the questions.

David.

 

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Just a note: the 100p has a fixed primary mirror so that won't need collimating. It does have very good optics but only a 400mm focal length (F/4) meaning it needs well-corrected, short f/l eyepieces (even a 5mm EP will only give 80x magnification). It is, however, very small and light, making it a doddle to store and carry.

The 130p has a 650mm f/5 focal length, so the same 5mm EP gives 130x mag. Its optics are also very good but will need occasional collimation. Please don't be put off by this: after a couple of tries, this becomes a routine, five-minute job.

I've never used the ST80, so unlike the other scopes, nothing I say is based on first-hand experience. I will note, though, that it has a smaller aperture, the same short f/l as the 100p and will also suffer from colour fringing on any bright targets like Jupiter at higher magnifications.

If it were my money, I'd go for the 130p - the best all-rounder giving the best views.

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I have the ST80 and heritage 130p. The two telescopes are both f5 (400/80 is 5 but I see now the ST80 is listed as f4.9), the heritage 100p is f4. They both have strong points and both are good from a storage point. The ST80 comes in two flavours A for astronomical with rings and a 80 degree diagonal, the T for terrestrial with a short fitted dovebar with tripod threads and a 45 degree erect image diagonal. Both ST80 flavours and the heritage 130p telescope can be fitted on other tripods. I saw a moon shadow transit on Jupiter as a tiny black dot with the heritage 130p but there's something lovely about how stars look with the ST80. For me from a dark sight it would be a tough call as there's some observing reports using the ST80 from dark sights but deep space objects are generally grey smudges but with the thrill of how far away and how old it is that you're seeing.

Edit. My Jupiter observing was not with the supplied eyepiece

Edited by happy-kat
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1 hour ago, Carbon Brush said:

Where in the country are you? I'm wondering about you visiting an astro retailer.

A firm recommendation is to NOT NOT NOT buy from ebay, amazon, currys, etc.
Always use a specialist astro retailer. He can help you afterwards.

 

 

I'm in N. Ireland with not too many specialists nearby, so was going to buy online (probably FLO)...had read enough to know now to buy from chain electrical stores.

 

Thanks everyong for the advice....I'm potentially none the wiser, or at least now of the opinion, that no matter which I go with, I can't really go wrong (for the money).  I'm veering towards the 130p, but given I'm intrigued by astrophography, the ST80 is still in the running.  Stupid question, but can a camera phone be used with either down the line?  Or do you need specialised camera? 

And if I were to go with 130p, Given I'm going to be paying for shipping, are there any other accessories worth getting at the same time, e.g. upgraded eyepiece, and if so which one?

Sorry for all the questions!

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I've owned a Short Tube 80 as they used to be known for over 20 years.  It rarely gets any use due to spherical aberration decreasing contrast and sharpness.  My sharpest views with it are with a light green filter to cut out the red and blue ends of the spectrum where the light isn't focused very well.  It turned me off to refractors for years.  Then, about a decade ago, I bought a 72mm ED refractor and absolutely love it.  Very sharp optics and practically no false color.

While stars aren't as crisp in a parabolic mirror Newtonian as in an APO refractor, they're definitely better than in an unfiltered ST80.  You can also resolve DSOs more easily in a 130mm Newtonian.

I bring the ST80 on road trips as for the 2017 solar eclipse because I don't really care if it gets stolen from my car.  That's how little I think of it.

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Astrophotography can be as simple as a phone held up to the scope eyepiece for a moon close up.
It can occupy your evenings and mean you spend hours not looking at the sky. Chasing goto issues, tracking errors, power supply problems.....😡
Been there done that and got the T shirt.
It can drain your wallet, and your savings accounts! Still doing this🤣

For what it is worth (remember it is free advice) the 130P with a phone up to the eyepiece is really as far as you should go for now.
The scope should (cloud permitting) produce 'wow' views of Jupiter and Saturn.
A wander around Orions belt and the nebula will produce 'I never realised'. Though the light levels mean it is still grey - unlike the pics posted on scope boxes!
Lots to enjoy, and importantly share, just with visual.

Before going out, set up the scope indoors and make sure everything is right and ready to go.
Dark and cold stop the brain from handling problems.🤔🥶
Don't push to the limits. Start with easy targets and enjoy the sights. Then work up.

Enjoy!

 

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Hey there, make sure you look second hand as well. Potentially a lot more bang for your buck. Both my 'proper' scopes came off Facebook marketplace for less than half what they would have cost new. 

Of course you don't get a warranty or FLOs excellent return policy, but if you're able to be patient (may be hard if you're trying to get something by Christmas) there are excellent deals to be had.

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4 minutes ago, Gaffie said:

Hey there, make sure you look second hand as well. Potentially a lot more bang for your buck. Both my 'proper' scopes came off Facebook marketplace for less than half what they would have cost new. 

Of course you don't get a warranty or FLOs excellent return policy, but if you're able to be patient (may be hard if you're trying to get something by Christmas) there are excellent deals to be had.

Thanks, had a look, but the only 130p on marketplace in N. Ireland is only about £30 less than what it is new, so not worth the saving given the peace of mind of buying from FLO.

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16 minutes ago, OMCK said:

Thanks, had a look, but the only 130p on marketplace in N. Ireland is only about £30 less than what it is new, so not worth the saving given the peace of mind of buying from FLO.

And you'd have your fuel cost to collect it. Ah well. 

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Sorry I forgot to include the local facebook, gumtree, etc. in the avoid list.

Fine if you know what you are looking at. But a minefield for a beginner.
Maybe a genuine who doesn't realise parts are missing/broken. Maybe just hoping to get rid.
A giveaway being photos showing scopes on tripods pointing to the ground, finders the wrong way around, etc.🤣

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