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Starsense HC issue


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I bought a used Starsense Autoalign recently for my AVX mount and noticed that the firmware version is from 2016 so I want to update it. The hand controller has a mini USB b connector on it, when I connect it to my PC the PC does not recognise it, neither does CFN. I have tried the Starsense hand controller on my Nexstar SLT mount with the same issue (So must be the HC and not the mounts). My old SLT mount HC has a RJ22 jack, I have a convertor cable so that I can connect with USB and it works just fine. I assumed the newer hand controller's with mini USB b connectors would be more simple.........obviously not.

Anyone had the same issue?

Cheers

Edited by DougQuaidHauser
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You may want to check this elsewhere, but this may be the same issue as with the Sky-watcher Synscan handsets, where the newer ones have a USB port, but if you want to use the USB port for firmware updates and such, you still need a serial chip driver loaded on your laptop or PC.

If your Starsense software dates from 2016, yes, you really ought to update it, as IIRC this fixes various issues.

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27 minutes ago, Cosmic Geoff said:

You may want to check this elsewhere, but this may be the same issue as with the Sky-watcher Synscan handsets, where the newer ones have a USB port, but if you want to use the USB port for firmware updates and such, you still need a serial chip driver loaded on your laptop or PC.

If your Starsense software dates from 2016, yes, you really ought to update it, as IIRC this fixes various issues.

Yes I've seen mention of Prolific PL2303 drivers, after installing they just never appear in my Device Manager ports tab, tried on a windows 7, 10, and 11 laptop and just never works like stated. Plugging in the HC to PC, it just gets treated like a faulty unknown USB device. Ive thought of bypassing the HC with the Celestron wifi module but I've heard that you cant update the firmware over wifi with older versions so would be wasting £160+ for nothing?

 

PS Where would be a better area of the forum to post this? Thanks

Edited by DougQuaidHauser
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10 hours ago, DougQuaidHauser said:

Yes I've seen mention of Prolific PL2303 drivers, after installing they just never appear in my Device Manager ports tab, tried on a windows 7, 10, and 11 laptop and just never works like stated. Plugging in the HC to PC, it just gets treated like a faulty unknown USB device. Ive thought of bypassing the HC with the Celestron wifi module but I've heard that you cant update the firmware over wifi with older versions so would be wasting £160+ for nothing?

 

PS Where would be a better area of the forum to post this? Thanks

Can I just check - when you are connecting the handset to the PC you also have the handset connected to the mount (and the mount powered on)? I don't recall installing any specific drivers for my Starsense handset, but I mostly control my AVX using CPWI and skyportal these days. I can check my astronomy laptop later to see if I have anything special installed.

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8 hours ago, Shimrod said:

Can I just check - when you are connecting the handset to the PC you also have the handset connected to the mount (and the mount powered on)? I don't recall installing any specific drivers for my Starsense handset, but I mostly control my AVX using CPWI and skyportal these days. I can check my astronomy laptop later to see if I have anything special installed.

Hello, I connect the HC to my PC with the AVX turned on or off, same story, the HC is treated like a faulty unknown USB device. I can plug the HC into the PC and it is powered by the PC via USB with the mount off even.

I can't connect to CPWI or anything mount related as it stands.

Thanks

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If you open Device Manager and right-click on the unknown device, then select properties it may tell you what driver it needs (most likely Prolific). If you have installed a Prolific driver then choose the Update driver option when right-clicking on the device and find the driver(s) on your PC - you may have several but you can test them one at a time.  I have found that it pays to restart the PC each time as the driver can be cached by the OS.

 

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5 hours ago, StevieDvd said:

If you open Device Manager and right-click on the unknown device, then select properties it may tell you what driver it needs (most likely Prolific). If you have installed a Prolific driver then choose the Update driver option when right-clicking on the device and find the driver(s) on your PC - you may have several but you can test them one at a time.  I have found that it pays to restart the PC each time as the driver can be cached by the OS.

 

Greetings, I think the issue is that the Prolific PL2303 chip in the HC is simply not doing what it is supposed to do, possibly broken/faulty?

An example would be my pre 2016 Nexstar+ HC that has a RJ22 connector. To connect it to my PC I purchased a cable with a RJ22 to USB and the housing contains a chip (FTDI) which creates a virtual com port (USB serial port) via USB. So when I plug just the unit into my PC a com port will appear in device manager.

I am sure for newer mini USB b HC's this chip is in the HC (It is because I opened the HC to check) instead removing the need for a special cable, so plugging in the HC should trigger a virtual com port on my PC. For my HC this is not happening, the PC just detects it as an unknown USB device.

I am getting the impression over the last day that this is not a one off problem for me alone.

Edited by DougQuaidHauser
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14 hours ago, malc-c said:

I have a serial device(serial camera shutter release) that needs a prolific 2303 driver, and the attached works on both windows 7 and 10 (the observatory PC is old but does the job).  Worth a try 

PL2303_64bit_Installer.zip 431.24 kB · 3 downloads

Thanks, I tried it but no luck. I have no way of making changes in device manager as no USB serial port is being detected when the HC is plugged into the PC. I think if it was then could update it with the PL2303 software.

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A few more things to try:

1. Are you using 32 or 64 bit windows and the driver for the correct version

2. You may be able to add a driver to the 'unknown device' by right-clicking - can't verify as I have no unkown devices to check this.

3. The newer PL2303 drivers had issues with Win 10 - see this NexStar related web page note it says the PL2303 is the chip in the handset

 

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Ignore the fact this is an ardiuo (it's the easiest thing on hand I could use to show you that opens a new com port).  When you connect the handset via the USB cable are you saying that you get no indication at all in device manager or does it create a new com port but it has a yellow exclamation mark against it ?  - If you are getting an indication that windows detected the hardware with the normal audio bing-bong sound, but device manager is unchanged then try connecting the handset to a different computer to rule out your computer or windows installation as being the reason you are having this trouble.

If you manage to get the com port to show up but it has no driver installed, open up properties and navigate to the tab shown, and select hardware ID  - copy the fist line in the box below and google that string - this will identify the correct chipset used and driver required

Untitled.png.6ea68079ebb47e12c2da9b235bda5056.png

If on connecting the handset to two computers you get the same result of hardware being detected but not showing up in Device manager then  check you haven't enabled to option to hide devices.  Click on View Tab and then Select View hidden devices and see if it is then made visible

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17 hours ago, DougQuaidHauser said:

Hello, I connect the HC to my PC with the AVX turned on or off, same story, the HC is treated like a faulty unknown USB device. I can plug the HC into the PC and it is powered by the PC via USB with the mount off even.

I can't connect to CPWI or anything mount related as it stands.

Thanks

My mistake on the Power on/off - I think I was getting mixed up with my Meade LX90 which needs a USB/serial cable adapter so definitely needs power on at the mount. I've just run through the process on my AVX and it works fine with the mount off.

On my PC I have the prolific driver installed - version 3.8.39 - Prolific did change the chip some years back and my Meade (circa 2004) would not work with the new driver - I had to buy a new cable (with a new chip) for connection to the handset. The 3.8.39 driver works fine with the Starsense hand controller. You can download it from the links below (Microsoft) or a slightly newer 3.8.41 (Prolific) 

Microsoft 3.8.39

Prolific 3.8.41

When I connect the handset to the PC and start CFM (version 2.7.9144) it detects the handset and shows it is on COM5

image.png.5761bbbe1bd70b062db1a3d3a71abc32.png

If you don't find anything initially, check the connections settings in CFM (Options menu, connections....) and make sure the connection type and discovery method are set correctly.

image.png.4c769c56e9d869f8847fd5c6833defe6.png

If I navigate to device manager I can see the port settings - if you can see the port at this point it is worth checking the port communication settings are the same as those below

image.png.792723294886ccf72124bff9d1fc2c0d.png

 

image.png.e08691dfd6502bd29c8f8121fca529f0.png

 

It's also worth trying a different USB port on your computer - I have two front mounted USB ports neither of which will detect the handset, but everything works fine when connected to a hub driven by a direct motherboard USB port. Possibly power related. I have the same thing on my laptop - it has two USB 3.2 ports but only one will drive my astro-camera, the other just keeps disconnecting each time I try to take an image.

Hopefully this gives you a couple of things to try and check, one of which will get you a connection!

Edited by Shimrod
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On 28/08/2022 at 11:19, malc-c said:

Ignore the fact this is an ardiuo (it's the easiest thing on hand I could use to show you that opens a new com port).  When you connect the handset via the USB cable are you saying that you get no indication at all in device manager or does it create a new com port but it has a yellow exclamation mark against it ?  - If you are getting an indication that windows detected the hardware with the normal audio bing-bong sound, but device manager is unchanged then try connecting the handset to a different computer to rule out your computer or windows installation as being the reason you are having this trouble.

If you manage to get the com port to show up but it has no driver installed, open up properties and navigate to the tab shown, and select hardware ID  - copy the fist line in the box below and google that string - this will identify the correct chipset used and driver required

Untitled.png.6ea68079ebb47e12c2da9b235bda5056.png

If on connecting the handset to two computers you get the same result of hardware being detected but not showing up in Device manager then  check you haven't enabled to option to hide devices.  Click on View Tab and then Select View hidden devices and see if it is then made visible

Hello, when I connect the starsense HC windows detects it as an unknown USB device (see diagram 2), as far as I can make out this should not happen when using a device via a PL2303 chip, windows should detect it as a serial com port, if it was detected the correct  way (as a com port) then I am sure any driver would be accessible etc.

I can plug the Starsense HC in via USB and even unplugged from the AVX mount it will be powered by the USB cable. I have tried it on 2 laptops, and my PC, all running different versions of windows and get the same result.

I have a cable I use for my Nexstar SLT mount with an inline PL2303 chip and when connected to windows it triggers a com port (see diagram 1). When I try the same thing using my Nexstar HC via PL2303 cable when unplugged from the mount it is not powered by the USB cable.

I am convinced its the PL2303 chip in the HC giving the problem.

 

1.jpg

2.jpg

Edited by DougQuaidHauser
Missing info.
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On 28/08/2022 at 11:15, StevieDvd said:

A few more things to try:

1. Are you using 32 or 64 bit windows and the driver for the correct version

2. You may be able to add a driver to the 'unknown device' by right-clicking - can't verify as I have no unkown devices to check this.

3. The newer PL2303 drivers had issues with Win 10 - see this NexStar related web page note it says the PL2303 is the chip in the handset

 

Hello and thanks, all my windows systems are 64bit these days. I tried adding a driver by right clicking with no luck unfortunately, just always tells me windows is using the best driver already.

I think my next plan is to use the cable to connect my non-USB Nexstar HC to PC and see if that works, it has a built in serial adapter. First I need to do a bit of jerry rigging as the end of the cable has a RJ22 connecter, and obviously this will not fit in a mini USB b port of the starsense HC. Need to buy a few parts first. And if that doesnt work, will have to bite the bullet and get the Celestron WIFI module and hope that works.

Edited by DougQuaidHauser
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7 minutes ago, DougQuaidHauser said:

Hello and thanks, all my windows systems are 64bit these days. I tried adding a driver by right clicking with no luck unfortunately, just always tells me windows is using the best driver already.

I think my next plan is to use the cable to connect my non-USB Nexstar HC to PC and see if that works, it has a built in serial adapter. First I need to do a bit of jerry rigging as the end of the cable has a RJ22 connecter, and obviously this will not fit in a mini USB b port of the starsense HC. Need to buy a few parts first.

You need to run the setup for the older drivers to add them to the list of loaded drivers (including what windows says is the best). I've plugged an old PL2303 adapter in and used the update driver to show what drivers are on my system. If you have tried that already sorry for the misunderstanding. The com port it selected is hidden but it did set one and can be seen under properties|port settings|advanced

driver_version.jpg.386a66ab97e1be7623422a2374d2c2ec.jpg 

I would not think the jerry rigging of a serial adpater cable to feed into the usb input of another serial adapter (inside the handset) is a good idea.  I may be wrong but not something I'd expect to work.

 

 

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1 hour ago, DougQuaidHauser said:

Hello and thanks, all my windows systems are 64bit these days. I tried adding a driver by right clicking with no luck unfortunately, just always tells me windows is using the best driver already.

I think my next plan is to use the cable to connect my non-USB Nexstar HC to PC and see if that works, it has a built in serial adapter. First I need to do a bit of jerry rigging as the end of the cable has a RJ22 connecter, and obviously this will not fit in a mini USB b port of the starsense HC. Need to buy a few parts first. And if that doesnt work, will have to bite the bullet and get the Celestron WIFI module and hope that works.

I have read on Cloudy Nights that some people have resolved this issue (device descriptor request failed) by performing a factory reset on their handset (Hold down 0 while powering on the handset). It is starting to sound like a handset failure. I'm guessing this is the first time you have connected the handset to a PC and have not previously used it with a laptop to control the mount?

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38 minutes ago, Shimrod said:

I have read on Cloudy Nights that some people have resolved this issue (device descriptor request failed) by performing a factory reset on their handset (Hold down 0 while powering on the handset). It is starting to sound like a handset failure. I'm guessing this is the first time you have connected the handset to a PC and have not previously used it with a laptop to control the mount?

Yes it is the first time I have tried to connect it to my PC for autoguiding last week (first attempt for autoguiding), is when I noticed it will not connect to my PC and the relevant software, I hadn't tried previously as the AVX and Starsense appeared to be working normally, other than not amazing tracking, but put it down to my probable amateur polar alignment. I am more used to connecting my Nexstar SLT mount to my PC with no real issues.

I will be honest, currently I am scared to do a factory reset as Ive heard that you need HC firmware later than 01.15 or later to update using WIFI (if I have to get a Celestron WIFI module to update), and it says its currently 01.16 so worried I may lose that ability. Saying that I dont have a clue what it would revert to as not familiar.

Edited by DougQuaidHauser
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1 hour ago, StevieDvd said:

You need to run the setup for the older drivers to add them to the list of loaded drivers (including what windows says is the best). I've plugged an old PL2303 adapter in and used the update driver to show what drivers are on my system. If you have tried that already sorry for the misunderstanding. The com port it selected is hidden but it did set one and can be seen under properties|port settings|advanced

driver_version.jpg.386a66ab97e1be7623422a2374d2c2ec.jpg 

I would not think the jerry rigging of a serial adpater cable to feed into the usb input of another serial adapter (inside the handset) is a good idea.  I may be wrong but not something I'd expect to work.

 

 

I think I've tried, no matter what I do or what drivers I install, it just never appears in device manager, no com port is shown, its like there is no com port to be found, even if I search for hidden, or legacy?

Yes its probably a wacky idea to try, can do it cheaply as well, just have a hunch the PL2303 chip in the HC is faulty, so on the off chance a serial signal is still being sent out the HC, might work, slim chance.

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18 minutes ago, DougQuaidHauser said:

Yes it is the first time I have tried to connect it to my PC for autoguiding last week (first attempt for autoguiding), is when I noticed it will not connect to my PC and the relevant software, I hadn't tried previously as the AVX and Starsense appeared to be working normally, other than not amazing tracking, but put it down to my probable amateur polar alignment. I am more used to connecting my Nexstar SLT mount to my PC with no real issues.

I will be honest, currently I am scared to do a factory reset as Ive heard that you need HC firmware later than 01.15 or later to update using WIFI (if I have to get a Celestron WIFI module to update), and it says its currently 01.16 so worried I may lose that ability. Saying that I dont have a clue what it would revert to as not familiar.

I am not certain, but I think the Starsense HC with usb port only shipped with 1.16 firmware, as it was only released mid 2016 - the 1.1.6 firmware was released around March 2016 and 1.15 was released August 2015. So I definitely don't think your firmware would go back beyond 1.15 - assuming it restores firmware and doesn't just clear all the settings. I don't use my handset so I will try later and see what happens!

 

https://www.celestron.com/pages/firmware-update-history

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1 hour ago, Shimrod said:

I am not certain, but I think the Starsense HC with usb port only shipped with 1.16 firmware, as it was only released mid 2016 - the 1.1.6 firmware was released around March 2016 and 1.15 was released August 2015. So I definitely don't think your firmware would go back beyond 1.15 - assuming it restores firmware and doesn't just clear all the settings. I don't use my handset so I will try later and see what happens!

 

https://www.celestron.com/pages/firmware-update-history

My HC states:

Ver: 01.16.16055

Bld: Feb 24 2016.

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28 minutes ago, DougQuaidHauser said:

My HC states:

Ver: 01.16.16055

Bld: Feb 24 2016.

I've just done the factory reset on my handset - you need to have it connected to the mount. Hold down the zero key while powering on the mount - it only takes a few seconds and does not restore to an earlier firmware version - just clears all settings (more so than just using the 'restore defaults' option of the handset menu).

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5 hours ago, DougQuaidHauser said:

Hello, when I connect the starsense HC windows detects it as an unknown USB device (see diagram 2), as far as I can make out this should not happen when using a device via a PL2303 chip, windows should detect it as a serial com port, if it was detected the correct  way (as a com port) then I am sure any driver would be accessible etc.

I can plug the Starsense HC in via USB and even unplugged from the AVX mount it will be powered by the USB cable. I have tried it on 2 laptops, and my PC, all running different versions of windows and get the same result.

I have a cable I use for my Nexstar SLT mount with an inline PL2303 chip and when connected to windows it triggers a com port (see diagram 1). When I try the same thing using my Nexstar HC via PL2303 cable when unplugged from the mount it is not powered by the USB cable.

I am convinced its the PL2303 chip in the HC giving the problem.

 

1.jpg

2.jpg

So what do you get when you right click on the entry and select properties.  And what's listed under the hardware ID  on the DETAILS tab.

For info, Prolific drivers are not built into Windows since Win7 was released.   The story went that as part of the development of windows Microsoft wanted hardware vendors to provide drivers under licence.  Prolific didn't want to sign up for whatever contractual reasons so drivers for prolific devices  were not built into to windows from that day forward.  So when your PC is detecting the hardware it can not obtain any descriptor as the driver is missing.  If using the option to update driver fails you can always try to install the driver manually as a legacy device, navigating to the INF file if the driver installs one 

Alternatively try the current drivers from prolifics website

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On 27/08/2022 at 00:11, DougQuaidHauser said:

Yes I've seen mention of Prolific PL2303 drivers, after installing they just never appear in my Device Manager ports tab, tried on a windows 7, 10, and 11 laptop and just never works like stated. Plugging in the HC to PC, it just gets treated like a faulty unknown USB device. Ive thought of bypassing the HC with the Celestron wifi module but I've heard that you cant update the firmware over wifi with older versions so would be wasting £160+ for nothing?

 

PS Where would be a better area of the forum to post this? Thanks

Don't know if you've made any progress with this, but I've been having another play around with my handset and windows drivers. I've tried some older drivers (like the one given above) as well as the current drivers from Prolific and each time I get the Prolific driver and port showing without any issues. For interest I downloaded the chip checker utility to see what version chip was in my handset. I don't think this will help you as the tool wants a com port for checking. Of interest is the chip - PL-2303SA is not supported in windows 11. I know you said you've tried a variety of windows machines, but if you have just done your latest testing on windows 11 it might be worth going back and trying again on a windows 7 or 10 machine (of course not supported does not mean the same as will not work).

 

image.png.0ce12ecfad15cfec5db09b177fef2ae5.png

https://www.prolific.com.tw/US/ShowProduct.aspx?p_id=225&pcid=41

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Apologies if this is a bit off the wall, but is there any dust in the usb port? This is the most common reason I've had usb devices fail to detect on my PC. Usually a small amount of dust gets compacted inside the port, that needs a dig around with the wire from a paperclip to remove it.

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  • 1 year later...

Same problem, solved by connecting the handcontroller via an USB hub to the same computer. Have no idea why this makes it work. Same cable and drivers. Hub is not even powered externaly, only by computer usb port. 

Edited by Giert_T
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