Rowan belt improvement?

[Pitch Black Skies]

Am I expecting too much?

My mount doesn't sound any quieter with the belt mod.

I haven't had a chance to check the guiding performance yet.

 

 

[AstroAdam]

Mine was far quieter following modding, but to be fair it's not about that, it's about the accuracy and guiding performance anyway.  Both of those were also much improved.  Who cares if it still sounds like an old coffee grinder, as long as it's guiding like a champ . 

Edited April 6, 2022 by AstroAdam

[Anne S]

I had my eq6 belt modded years ago. Afterwards is was mostly a high pitched wine, a bit like yours. Is yours quieter with the cover on?

[Pitch Black Skies]

3 minutes ago, AstroAdam said:

Mine was far quieter, but to be. fair it's not about that, it's about the accuracy and guiding performance anyway.  Both of those were also much improved.  Who cares gif it still sounds like an old coffee grinder, as long as it's guiding like a champ . 

Hopefully it will guide like like a champ. If it does, happy days.

Was expecting a reduction in the noise level too though as others have claimed.

But yeah, accuracy is the priority.

I never had the coffee grinder noise to begin with as I removed the gear backlash the first day I received the mount.

[Pitch Black Skies]

4 minutes ago, Anne S said:

I had my eq6 belt modded years ago. Afterwards is was mostly a high pitched wine, a bit like yours. Is yours quieter with the cover on?

It's a bit quieter with the cover on, but essentially the noise hasn't changed with the addition of the mod.

Fingers crossed it guides better.

[Anne S]

My eq6 was a lot noisier before I had it done but it was an old eq6. Your heq5 may have been quieter to start with.

[Pitch Black Skies]

26 minutes ago, Anne S said:

Your heq5 may have been quieter to start with.

It's exactly the same.

See the video comparison.

[malc-c]

It's not designed to improve the sound quality.....

What you won't get is the graunch of the gears as they take up the backlash between them.  The motors still sing and you still hear the stepping of the motors through the drive train.  Often it depends on the individual mount and is subjective to ones own hearing, but on most occasions a difference was noted.

What you should notice is better accuracy in goto and tracking.

[AstroAdam]

45 minutes ago, Pitch Black Skies said:

Hopefully it will guide like like a champ. If it does, happy days.

Was expecting a reduction in the noise level too though as others have claimed.

But yeah, accuracy is the priority.

I never had the coffee grinder noise to begin with as I removed the gear backlash the first day I received the mount.

Sounds like you tuned out some of the row previously anyway then.  Also, mine was an older HEQ5, even when I got it, so was probably louder due to wear by the time I modded it...

[Pitch Black Skies]

5 minutes ago, AstroAdam said:

 

13 minutes ago, malc-c said:

It's not designed to improve the sound quality.....

Indeed, but you often hear of people complimenting how much better there mount sounds after the mod.

Could they not just simply adjust the gears to remove the backlash and rectify that grinder sound and also improve performance?

If the backlash is already removed in the gears, do you think adding the kit will make much of difference?

[Pitch Black Skies]

7 minutes ago, AstroAdam said:

Sounds like you tuned out some of the row previously anyway then.  Also, mine was an older HEQ5, even when I got it, so was probably louder due to wear by the time I modded it...

What kind of numbers are you achieving on guiding now?

[malc-c]

18 minutes ago, Pitch Black Skies said:

Indeed, but you often hear of people complimenting how much better there mount sounds after the mod.

Could they not just simply adjust the gears to remove the backlash and rectify that grinder sound and also improve performance?

If the backlash is already removed in the gears, do you think adding the kit will make much of difference?

I started all this belt modding of the HEQ5 over a decade ago, and the first thing I found was that the sound had changed.  No matter how much I adjusted the gearing to reduce the backlash between the central gear and both the worm and motor gears, or how much lithium grease I used, there would still be that graunching sound as the motors spooled up and down at the start and end of a slew.  As soon as the belt was fitted the sound changed and all I could hear was the spooling of the motors.

Here is a video I made in 2012 demonstrating the testing and experiments using off the shelf parts.  This was before Dave form Rowan engineering developed the kit idea and used CNC components that suited the stock gear ratios so the handset could be used

The mount isn't a great deal quieter, but it sounds a lot sweeter just hearing the steppers spooling rather than the gears meshing / graunching!

[Pitch Black Skies]

7 minutes ago, malc-c said:

I started all this belt modding of the HEQ5 over a decade ago, and the first thing I found was that the sound had changed.  No matter how much I adjusted the gearing to reduce the backlash between the central gear and both the worm and motor gears, or how much lithium grease I used, there would still be that graunching sound as the motors spooled up and down at the start and end of a slew.  As soon as the belt was fitted the sound changed and all I could hear was the spooling of the motors.

Here is a video I made in 2012 demonstrating the testing and experiments using off the shelf parts.  This was before Dave form Rowan engineering developed the kit idea and used CNC components that suited the stock gear ratios so the handset could be used

The mount isn't a great deal quieter, but it sounds a lot sweeter just hearing the steppers spooling rather than the gears meshing / graunching!

That's really cool, didn't realise you were behind it, excellent work!

It's probably because my mount is practically new. Had I of waited another few months, the graunching sound would more than likely have crept in.

Like you said anyway, it's the numbers that matter.

I'll be able to test it tonight and give an update.

[malc-c]

4 hours ago, Pitch Black Skies said:

That's really cool, didn't realise you were behind it, excellent work!

 

Well I was inspired by a few guys who were converting EQ6's to belt drive, and to me the HEQ5 was a much simpler option, so I purchased a set of pulleys, had them machined down and bored out to fit and with Chris working out the maths for using 4:1 , 5:1 and even 6:1 ratios in EQMOD I ended up with a viable prototype.  Around a dozen SGL members asked for kits so I had a batch of pulleys machined and sourced someone to make the spacers and sold a few kits.  The full thread is here although some images may be missing given the age of the thread.  My reward for my efforts and claim to fame  was the conversion was featured in Astronomy Now some ten years ago now !

Seeing a gap in the market Dave from Rowan stepped in and produced the now standard HEQ5 and EQ6 belt conversion kits with CNC motor pulleys that maintain the stock ratio and thus could be used with the handset rather than having to be hooked up to a computer and use EQMOD and software to control the mount.   It was fun and exciting at the time, but I lacked the funds to patent the concept and at the time none of us ever thought that belt drive would be so popular... and to this day no one at Rowan have offered to buy me a beer

 

[Pitch Black Skies]

Pity about the patent, however you're obviously very mechanically and inventively minded so maybe you can come up with another clever concept some time?

Thanks for sharing your interesting story.

[Louis D]

38 minutes ago, malc-c said:

It was fun and exciting at the time, but I lacked the funds to patent the concept and at the time none of us ever thought that belt drive would be so popular

Since your work was published in Astronomy Now well before the Rowan kit was offered, it is now prior art; and Rowan would have to limit the scope of any patent because of your prior work.  Kudos to you for keeping your efforts in the public domain.

[Padraic M]

10 hours ago, malc-c said:

offered to buy me a beer

@malc-c I'll buy you a beer anytime! But if everyone who fitted a belt-mod bought you a beer I'd worry about your liver. 🙂

My HEQ5 was noisy from day one but the mod fixed that and halved my guiding RMS.

Edited April 7, 2022 by Padraic M

[wookie1965]

13 hours ago, Pitch Black Skies said:

Pity about the patent, however you're obviously very mechanically and inventively minded so maybe you can come up with another clever concept some time?

Thanks for sharing your interesting story.

Yes a EQ5 belt mod would be greatly appreciated so I can still use the handset. 

[david_taurus83]

Is that a new HEQ5? As already pointed out, may be quite than an older one to start with. My AZEQ6 sounds different to the one I had 3 years ago. I just figured they put different motors in the newer ones.

[Pitch Black Skies]

1 hour ago, david_taurus83 said:

Is that a new HEQ5? As already pointed out, may be quite than an older one to start with. My AZEQ6 sounds different to the one I had 3 years ago. I just figured they put different motors in the newer ones.

Yeah it's only couple of months old. Not sure what I was expecting really. It's my motors that are noisy. The belt mod can't help that.

[Pitch Black Skies]

Just to give an update..

The mount is actually a bit quieter. It's not a huge difference but it does sound smoother.

Guiding numbers seem to have improved slightly too.

Edited April 8, 2022 by Pitch Black Skies