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Appropriate guide cam/scope for CGEM 9.25 EdgeHD


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Finally my 9.25 HD is coming after waiting forever because of backorders and whatnot.

What’s an appropriate accompanying guide scope + cam for this particular scope? I’m expecting to use my ASI224MC as my imaging cam.

Since I don’t yet have experience with this model scope, does it have the necessary mounting brackets for whatever I choose? I suspect since I only have 2 USB ports on my laptop I’m going to need something that can handle all of these extra inputs so I imagine a USB splitter of some kind is needed here. Power too I’d imagine. I have a Talentcell I’m planning to use but it might not be enough.

Trial and error I suppose!

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15 hours ago, Maideneer said:

Finally my 9.25 HD is coming after waiting forever because of backorders and whatnot.

What’s an appropriate accompanying guide scope + cam for this particular scope? I’m expecting to use my ASI224MC as my imaging cam.

Since I don’t yet have experience with this model scope, does it have the necessary mounting brackets for whatever I choose? I suspect since I only have 2 USB ports on my laptop I’m going to need something that can handle all of these extra inputs so I imagine a USB splitter of some kind is needed here. Power too I’d imagine. I have a Talentcell I’m planning to use but it might not be enough.

Trial and error I suppose!

Your Starsense will take power from the mount, so you will need usb ports for both cameras plus connection to the mount. You could get a USB hub (but it may need to be powered) or you could get the Celestron wifi module for your mount which should mean no need for a hub.

I think your bigger problem is going to be imaging with the ASI224 on a telescope with a FL of 2350mm - it's a small sensor and it may be difficult to get the target on sensor - most recommendations are to start imaging with a shorter focal length and having started with an EdgeHD 8" and moved to a 80mm refractor I would agree with that!

You might want to consider getting a camera with a larger sensor to use as your imaging camera and retain the ASI224 as your guide camera. At this FL most would recommend an off axis guider rather than a guidescope - if you want to go down the guidescope route you will need one with a longer focal length (600mm) - to mount this you would get a dovetail and some mounting rings.

For power I have the Celestron Powertank Pro and that is enough to get me through two or three nights  -although a 'night' for me is around 4 hours. I've not yet had any issues running out of power.

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4 hours ago, Shimrod said:

Your Starsense will take power from the mount, so you will need usb ports for both cameras plus connection to the mount. You could get a USB hub (but it may need to be powered) or you could get the Celestron wifi module for your mount which should mean no need for a hub.

I think your bigger problem is going to be imaging with the ASI224 on a telescope with a FL of 2350mm - it's a small sensor and it may be difficult to get the target on sensor - most recommendations are to start imaging with a shorter focal length and having started with an EdgeHD 8" and moved to a 80mm refractor I would agree with that!

You might want to consider getting a camera with a larger sensor to use as your imaging camera and retain the ASI224 as your guide camera. At this FL most would recommend an off axis guider rather than a guidescope - if you want to go down the guidescope route you will need one with a longer focal length (600mm) - to mount this you would get a dovetail and some mounting rings.

For power I have the Celestron Powertank Pro and that is enough to get me through two or three nights  -although a 'night' for me is around 4 hours. I've not yet had any issues running out of power.

Do I need a guide cam with an OAG? If so, maybe I could use the 224 for that purpose.

I bought my 224 for my little Travelscope 70 so I definitely have some experience now.

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3 minutes ago, Maideneer said:

Do I need a guide cam with an OAG? If so, maybe I could use the 224 for that purpose.

I bought my 224 for my little Travelscope 70 so I definitely have some experience now.

You will still need a guide cam with the OAG. I was advised (on here) to get an ASI290MM if I went with an OAG as the larger and more sensitive sensor would make it easier to pick up stars for guiding. The ASI224MC should work but may struggle to lock on to a guide star depending on the object being imaged - hopefully someone will be along shortly to give you a more definitive answer. I have no experience of using an OAG so can't give any real world advice.

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6 hours ago, Shimrod said:

Your Starsense will take power from the mount, so you will need usb ports for both cameras plus connection to the mount. You could get a USB hub (but it may need to be powered) or you could get the Celestron wifi module for your mount which should mean no need for a hub.

I think your bigger problem is going to be imaging with the ASI224 on a telescope with a FL of 2350mm - it's a small sensor and it may be difficult to get the target on sensor - most recommendations are to start imaging with a shorter focal length and having started with an EdgeHD 8" and moved to a 80mm refractor I would agree with that!

You might want to consider getting a camera with a larger sensor to use as your imaging camera and retain the ASI224 as your guide camera. At this FL most would recommend an off axis guider rather than a guidescope - if you want to go down the guidescope route you will need one with a longer focal length (600mm) - to mount this you would get a dovetail and some mounting rings.

For power I have the Celestron Powertank Pro and that is enough to get me through two or three nights  -although a 'night' for me is around 4 hours. I've not yet had any issues running out of power.

One thing that confused me here was the wifi module / USB hub thing.  What does one have to do with the other?

I'm trying to count out how many USB ports I'll need on my PC, I only have two.

1x external hard drive
1x mouse (yes I need this lol)
1x imaging camera
1x guide camera

What else? So I'll def need a USB Hub anyway.  I've been thinking about that PowerTank but not sure yet, I kind of want to try my Talentcell first but at the same time hesitant because I don't want to damage anything.  I am CLUELESS about electricity/amps/volts etc - literally cannot absorb what any of that means lol

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Are these usb2? If so you are already limiting what your Asi224 can do speed wise. 

I'll b trying a similar setup for jupiter, but I Wouldnt try it for dso. For me c8, Asi224, 240mm guidescope.

For dso I think trying to keep that setup stable might not be possible with any mount under 10k?

If it's your only ota, I'd suggest getting a bigger sensor camera as @Shimrod says. Basically you've got a setup that has an FOV about the same size as a knat's chuff. 😁

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24 minutes ago, Maideneer said:

One thing that confused me here was the wifi module / USB hub thing.  What does one have to do with the other?

I'm trying to count out how many USB ports I'll need on my PC, I only have two.

1x external hard drive
1x mouse (yes I need this lol)
1x imaging camera
1x guide camera

What else? So I'll def need a USB Hub anyway.  I've been thinking about that PowerTank but not sure yet, I kind of want to try my Talentcell first but at the same time hesitant because I don't want to damage anything.  I am CLUELESS about electricity/amps/volts etc - literally cannot absorb what any of that means lol

Depending on what camera you get for imaging it may have a USB hub within it (the ZWO PRO cooled cameras for example). You could connect the guide cam through the imaging camera hub which also makes for less trailing cables. You have missed out the connection to the mount in your list - again you should be able to connect through the camera hub, but I prefer a direct connection.

How big is the hard drive in the laptop - is the external drive really necessary?

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5 minutes ago, Shimrod said:

Depending on what camera you get for imaging it may have a USB hub within it (the ZWO PRO cooled cameras for example). You could connect the guide cam through the imaging camera hub which also makes for less trailing cables. You have missed out the connection to the mount in your list - again you should be able to connect through the camera hub, but I prefer a direct connection.

How big is the hard drive in the laptop - is the external drive really necessary?

I have a 220GB usable PC hard drive, half of which is already used.  So I need something bigger...I have a 1TB external drive.  I guess this is going to be some trial and error...my scope arrives on Wednesday and I'm sure clouds with it, so I'll have time to visually chart out my plan.  I'm definitely a visual person so sometimes all this info gets jumbled in my head and I can't make sense of it until I can see it.

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26 minutes ago, Maideneer said:

I have a 220GB usable PC hard drive, half of which is already used.  So I need something bigger...I have a 1TB external drive.  I guess this is going to be some trial and error...my scope arrives on Wednesday and I'm sure clouds with it, so I'll have time to visually chart out my plan.  I'm definitely a visual person so sometimes all this info gets jumbled in my head and I can't make sense of it until I can see it.

You might be overestimating your space requirements while imaging. If you have a camera that is producing 20Mb images and you are doing 3 minute subs, you will only be using 400Mb an hour, or 2Gb in a 5 hour session. You can transfer files elsewhere when you are done. I capture images on a low-power laptop with a 256mb ssd, and transfer to my desktop for processing.

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I am noticing that each image file is extremely large.  Example - 500 FITS subs equals around 3.75 GB.  A 3 SECOND AVI vid capture equals 373 MB.
 

When I was first starting, I tried all different file formats too...AVI, JPG, TIFF, FITS, SER, PNG you name it.  Now I know I can nail it down to AVI for vid and FITS or TIFF for pics.  Not really sure how much difference it all makes really.  Problem is, I'm still not done utilizing the rest of the space of my PC hard drive - I've got other stuff to install since it's a new laptop and I'm still migrating stuff off my old PC to it.  So I think I need my external drive.

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2 hours ago, powerlord said:

Are these usb2? If so you are already limiting what your Asi224 can do speed wise. 

I'll b trying a similar setup for jupiter, but I Wouldnt try it for dso. For me c8, Asi224, 240mm guidescope.

For dso I think trying to keep that setup stable might not be possible with any mount under 10k?

If it's your only ota, I'd suggest getting a bigger sensor camera as @Shimrod says. Basically you've got a setup that has an FOV about the same size as a knat's chuff. 😁

Nope, USB3 🙂

What’s a knat’s chuff lol? Sorry I’m not from around the UK. I’m guessing small.

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3 hours ago, Maideneer said:

I am noticing that each image file is extremely large.  Example - 500 FITS subs equals around 3.75 GB.  A 3 SECOND AVI vid capture equals 373 MB.
 

When I was first starting, I tried all different file formats too...AVI, JPG, TIFF, FITS, SER, PNG you name it.  Now I know I can nail it down to AVI for vid and FITS or TIFF for pics.  Not really sure how much difference it all makes really.  Problem is, I'm still not done utilizing the rest of the space of my PC hard drive - I've got other stuff to install since it's a new laptop and I'm still migrating stuff off my old PC to it.  So I think I need my external drive.

My ASI533 produces image files around 17Mb. If you are doing DSO imaging you will not be doing very many images per hour hence my calculations above. You should really use .ser for video - brief explanation here:  video formats I'm surprised a 3 second video consumes nearly 400Mb on an ASI224

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23 minutes ago, Shimrod said:

My ASI533 produces image files around 17Mb. If you are doing DSO imaging you will not be doing very many images per hour hence my calculations above. You should really use .ser for video - brief explanation here:  video formats I'm surprised a 3 second video consumes nearly 400Mb on an ASI224

Wow great explanation of the formats! Yep the file sizes are humongous…I’m guessing that’s not typical

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