First Light on used ST80

[happy-kat]

There are two main flavours

ST80A - A astronomical. tube rings, right angle diagonal

ST80T - T terrestrial. fixed short dove bar with camera tripod thread holes, 45 degree erect image diagonal

 

 

 

[SuburbanMak]

Follow up - have got out with the ST80 twice in the last few days - especially when the session is short or motivation to set up low it's a great option. Have been really impressed with its optical capability, here are notes from those sessions which given the full moon  have focussed on double stars - but also got a lovely unexpected view of M13! Am finding that the ST80 is great for figuring out where stuff is, then I can revisit later with the Mak for a higher power view. Took it out on the AZ GTi and its a great pairing, the scope's light weight seemed to tax the mount less than the 127 Mak + finders and that, coupled with the wider field (& some wise alignment tips from @ScouseSpaceCadet, thank you sir), meant that goto performed beautifully. Can see its only a matter of time (and money) before mounting them side by side... anyhoo, for what its worth here are some slightly random observing notes from my first real sessions with this amazing value piece of kit...

25.2 - 8-9.30pm 

ST80, BH Zoom, Steady seeing. 97% moon transparency: occasional high-level milkiness. 

N. Aligned Sirius Aldebaran

Goto Mars, accurate - nice gibbous disc but tiny.

Goto Uranus - probably, faint, greenish, maybe - not a point, not a disc. 

M45 - bit disappointed then realised I still had the Barlow on from Mars/Uranus - gorgeous view without, fantasised I might be seeing nebulosity... 

M42 - got stuck here for a while, wasn’t in the plan but crisp trapezium & loved the wide field. 

Mintaka - double-ish, very wide. 

Sigma Orionis - fantastic system. Double + a cluster. 

CM145/H3945 - Winter Albireo a bit moon/LP washed but clear orange- blue colour contrast. Felt good to find using RDF & star map. 

Sirius - no split. 

Beta Monoceros clean split triple at 50x - ST80 looks like a very good 96 quid 

Almach - lovely view at 12mm  (33x). Orange primary, white close secondary. 

M40 - I think, check the chart. Bit non-descript. 

Eta Cassiopeia  - split-ish, one for more mag/app. 

Went back to the night’s highlights: M42 - Sigma Orionis - CM145.  

Very satisfying hour and a half & home in time to be sociable. ST80 is going to get a lot of use! Crisp wide fields, scanning slowly up the sword of Orion from M42 to Sigma Orionis stunning. 

 

27/2  00:30 - 02:30 . ST80, Baader Zoom 8-24mm, moon if anything more dominant than earlier. 

Trudged back out to the park for  second session, late/early with an ST80 quick set-up. Skyscape radically changed from earlier evening session - lots of constellations in the “wrong” place. 

ETA Cassiopeia.  Yellow Orange spikes, clean white 2nd. Lovely. 

Fruitless searching in Cass for Sigma & Struve 173 . Got a bit lost. 

Retreated to Mirphac. Hopped to Double Cluster - lovely in wide view. Fantastic frame at 14mm (28x) , cheered me up. 

Castor - split but only at 50x.  Tried for Algieba but lost in the moonlight, looked at Regulus against backwash of moon. 

Thought about jacking it in, cold, moon obliterating Leo, Cancer & then some, got a bit aimless - figured may as well complete a 360 by star hopping. 

Back to Arcturus then Vega. 

Checked Safari & confirmed Hercules keystone.  Orientation very unfamiliar compared to summer! 

Brainwave: Hit Goto on M13 - perfect! A fuzzy at last despite the moon & a first for me, wanted to see M13 for ages.  Occupied more space in keystone than I’d expected. Got the Barlow out and looked at all mags - thought I saw the odd hint of a star/twinkle mid lower left with averted vision. Best view though at about 40x  - nice glow and framed by keystone stars.  This is going to be fantastic in the Mak. Looked for a long time! Spent a bit of time orienting naked eye between Vega & Arcturus so I can locate easily again. 

Had a punt at M57 the ring nebula but no chance, all moon washed + now 2.30 am, getting cold & tired. 

Finished night, appropriately , on Alberio - stunning pair, gold & green/blue both quite bright.  Wrapped up warm and looked for a long while. 

Walked home cold & happy through friendly, silent moonlit streets to a big Laphroaig. Amazing couple of evenings. 

Edited February 28, 2021 by SuburbanMak

[John]

Great report again !

"See the Universe for under 100 quid"

 

[ScouseSpaceCadet]

10 hours ago, John said:

Great report again !

"See the Universe for under 100 quid"

 

... and Ed Ting recommends the ST80

 

 

Thanks for this thread @SuburbanMak A reminder astronomy doesn't have to be expensive. 👍

[SuburbanMak]

This weekend I will mostly be stripping, blacking, flocking, polishing, greasing, fettling & re-mounting.... (no sniggering at the back.)

[Tiny Clanger]

On 23/02/2021 at 15:06, SuburbanMak said:

I absolutely stand corrected.  No intention of starting an international Moose vs. Elk incident! 

Dear lord, and international moose/elk incident would be a serious thing , those perishers are large and somewhat likely to kick back , as quite a few random hikers and idiots attempting to hand feed or acquire a selfie with the 'cute' creature have painfully discovered.

But they do have a place in the history of astronomy , search out 'Tycho Brahe's moose' online ...

[Tiny Clanger]

I've really enjoyed the brief forays outside I've managed with the st80, it is ideal for swift deployment when an unanticipated break in the clouds happens and doesn't look as if it will last long : carry it out, extend the tripod legs , whip off the caps and go. I've left a 17mm 'super plossl' more or less permanently in it  I'm rather attached to that plossl, it was my first supplementary EP purchase, and really pretty darn good for £20, but not getting much use in my other 'scopes now I have some BSTs .

I've also used the 2x barlow (which I simply dislike using in the mak or dob for no reason I can put my finger on ) and found it good with the 17mm in the st80 , so along with recycling the stock RDF and diagonal from the mak (which I upgraded from asap) and using a photo tripod and head, the st80 feels like thrifty virtuous recycling rather than just yet another new toy .  

So far I've tried most of my medium & high power eyepieces (mainly BST starguiders) with the '80, and they feel like overkill, heavier than seems right (not that the 'scope or focuser  can't cope, just physically out of scale) and no improvement on the plossl .I want to compare the BST 25mm with the 25mm stock MA 'long eye relief' one and my 32mm plossl at some point, but not got round to it yet. The strongest EP I have is a 6mm TMB clone, which pushes my 127 mak to the edge of 'floater' territory for me but in the 1500 mak gives amazing lunar close ups .... but with the 6mm in the ST80 , the full Moon doesn't even fill the FOV 🙂 

The little frac.showed a neat line of CA all around the edge of the Moon, which changed from green to magenta depending on my eye placement, the famous (or possibly notorious) C.A. Can't say it bothered me, but whether it will become annoying or not when the novelty wears off, only time will tell. Despite the relatively low magnification, I got decent views tiny but distinct views of mountains on the western limb (Montes Cordillera and the Montes Rook I think)

Deeply unimpressive views of Mars as a pinky-orange pinhead , but decent enough views of the Orion Nebula, the inevitable Pleiades (all in one 17mm plossl view !) and sharp little pin point stars . I'm not enormously bothered to look for double stars, but did notice the Plough was peeping up above my house roof, so had a quick look at Mizar and could see A and B clearly.

On the 22nd of February there was a clear evening with a near full Moon rising around 7:30, so I went out for a short early look with my 150 dob, spent half an hour on the three clusters in Auriga (M 36, M37 & M38) high in my southern sky. With a very short time to go before moonrise, had a sudden 'I wonder' thought, nipped indoors, fetched the ST80, plonked it down by the dob, and managed to see all three clusters in the little frac : nothing like as distinct as in the dob, but certainly there .

I am rather impressed with the ST80 as a widefield , quick set up instrument. It's not going to make someone happy of they are hoping for detail on the planets , but it is fast and easy to set up and a doddle to aim.

Heather

[happy-kat]

Nice user report.

I did make out the main bands on Jupiter when I looked with mine but it was small.

 

[Tiny Clanger]

As it may be useful to someone else, what with this tiddler of a 'scope being so eminently portable, I thought I'd post a couple of photos and a link to the bag I bought for mine. The photos are of the bag on top of the packaging it came in, with the st80 not even properly closed down for safe transport : the focuser wound part out, diagonal & EP still in place ...I just wanted to see if it would fit or should it go straight back. The RDF had to come off, but it fits in the bag lying on the focus tube.

The bag handles are well sewn in and strong, a continuous band running under the bag, they also velcro together. The D rings for the detachable shoulder strap are well set , the weakest point is probably the zip, but being on top it is not under any stress . There's a tiny zip  pocket inside, maybe big enough for an eyepiece cap, I may stick some duct tape over it if I think it may scratch the paintwork !

Note that this is an ST80 with a dovetail rail, not rings, you'd need to measure to ensure they fit the bag internal diameter (which is given on the amaz. listing.

          

 

Goodness knows how much this bag would cost if marketed for telescopes , but as it is intended for photo tripods , it was under £12 . There are several to choose from on the page , mine is the 50cm x 12 cm one.

Heather

[Tiny Clanger]

Oh, forgot to say, there is some padding to the bag , maybe a couple of mm of closed cell foam, it does afford some protection from knocks.

[ScouseSpaceCadet]

Clanger from the 25mm MA, BST 25mm and 32mm plossl, I imagine the BST will be the best compromise of clarity, field of view and contrast. Report back please. 😀

Low power is where these scopes excel. My ST120 was brilliant with a 2" 30mm 68° eyepiece whether urban or rural observing.

[Tiny Clanger]

14 minutes ago, ScouseSpaceCadet said:

Clanger from the 25mm MA, BST 25mm and 32mm plossl, I imagine the BST will be the best compromise of clarity, field of view and contrast. Report back please. 😀

Low power is where these scopes excel. My ST120 was brilliant with a 2" 30mm 68° eyepiece whether urban or rural observing.

Will do. In early autumn I  compared the SW 32mm plossl to the 25mm BST in my 150 heritage dob (which is a quite fast f5), and find I actually prefer the plossl ,it seems to give better shaped stars at the edges, and the apparent field of view the two EPs offer is practically the same . I've not repeated the exercise in the far faster mak or the st80 yet , too busy enjoying finding new objects in the sky to look at in the short clear spells on offer over this winter !

Heather

[wibblefish]

16 hours ago, Tiny Clanger said:

The little frac.showed a neat line of CA all around the edge of the Moon, which changed from green to magenta depending on my eye placement, the famous (or possibly notorious) C.A. Can't say it bothered me, but whether it will become annoying or not when the novelty wears off, only time will tell. Despite the relatively low magnification, I got decent views tiny but distinct views of mountains on the western limb (Montes Cordillera and the Montes Rook I think)

I use an ND filter when observing the moon primarily to reduce the glare (moon blinded the other night when I was trying without it!) and it seems to reduce the CA to if it bothers you (which never really worried me anyway on the moon) to fairly minimal levels  

Edited March 9, 2021 by wibblefish

[Tiny Clanger]

2 hours ago, wibblefish said:

I use an ND filter when observing the moon primarily to reduce the glare (moon blinded the other night when I was trying without it!) and it seems to reduce the CA to if it bothers you (which never really worried me anyway on the moon) to fairly minimal levels  

Thanks for that. I have a twin polariser type Moon filter (and a straightforward ND one as well ) , had no need of either for the sake of brightness reducing with the ST80 , my 127 mak is right on the edge .... I can manage a short time using it without filtering the Moon, but find it too bright for prolonged unfiltered viewing. With the 150mm aperture dob though, the Moon dazzles me to the point of making me reflexively look away, so that's when I really need an ND filter !

I guess an ND filter might make the CA less obtrusive, and the Celestron Moon filter I bought certainly isn't a proper ND by photographic standards : it has a slight green tinge so it could perhaps cut slightly more green light . I know there are 'fringe killer' filters which suggest they will do the job ( for instance https://www.firstlightoptics.com/achromat-semi-apo-filters/baader-fringe-killer-filter.html but £60 seems a bit steep to (possibly ) sort a problem in a second hand  'scope that cost me not much more than that ...

So, now I have another thing to check out , one Moonlit night : budget strategies  vs CA in the ST80  🙂  ... I have the Moon filter, a plain pale yellow filter (which may do the job) , a pair of polarising ND's and (drum roll please) the little cap within a cap thingummy which is actually calculated to be an anti CA device ( see vlaiv's recent thread on the subject here https://stargazerslounge.com/topic/373391-want-to-use-achromat-for-planetary-observing-but-ca-is-bugging-you/?tab=comments#comment-4051798

I don't find the CA a problem, I know what it is, and why it happens (if you are interested, this explains it very well, look near the end of the extract )  and I appreciate it is a compromise that has to be made to get a refractor 'scope in this sort of bargain price range. The human mind is a great , free filter , if people can mentally filter out a guy in a gorilla suit walking behind some people chucking a basketball around because he is irrelevant to the task they were given , I really should be able to train myself to concentrate on my target whilst ignoring a predictable and pretty coloured rim  🙂

Heather

 

[wibblefish]

11 minutes ago, Tiny Clanger said:

Thanks for that. I have a twin polariser type Moon filter (and a straightforward ND one as well ) , had no need of either for the sake of brightness reducing with the ST80 , my 127 mak is right on the edge .... I can manage a short time using it without filtering the Moon, but find it too bright for prolonged unfiltered viewing. With the 150mm aperture dob though, the Moon dazzles me to the point of making me reflexively look away, so that's when I really need an ND filter !

I guess an ND filter might make the CA less obtrusive, and the Celestron Moon filter I bought certainly isn't a proper ND by photographic standards : it has a slight green tinge so it could perhaps cut slightly more green light . I know there are 'fringe killer' filters which suggest they will do the job ( for instance https://www.firstlightoptics.com/achromat-semi-apo-filters/baader-fringe-killer-filter.html but £60 seems a bit steep to (possibly ) sort a problem in a second hand  'scope that cost me not much more than that ...

So, now I have another thing to check out , one Moonlit night : budget strategies  vs CA in the ST80  🙂  ... I have the Moon filter, a plain pale yellow filter (which may do the job) , a pair of polarising ND's and (drum roll please) the little cap within a cap thingummy which is actually calculated to be an anti CA device ( see vlaiv's recent thread on the subject here https://stargazerslounge.com/topic/373391-want-to-use-achromat-for-planetary-observing-but-ca-is-bugging-you/?tab=comments#comment-4051798

I don't find the CA a problem, I know what it is, and why it happens (if you are interested, this explains it very well, look near the end of the extract )  and I appreciate it is a compromise that has to be made to get a refractor 'scope in this sort of bargain price range. The human mind is a great , free filter , if people can mentally filter out a guy in a gorilla suit walking behind some people chucking a basketball around because he is irrelevant to the task they were given , I really should be able to train myself to concentrate on my target whilst ignoring a predictable and pretty coloured rim  🙂

Heather

 

Yeah I thought I'd gone blind when I tried it without and a high mag lens recently (massive black shadow in the middle of my vision for a few mins), stuck to the ND filter I got from FLO for the moon since  

https://www.firstlightoptics.com/moon-neutral-density-filters/astro-essentials-nd96-0-9-1-25-moon-filter.html

I have tried the wratten #8 (light yellow) when attempting to reduce halo'ing on double stars like Rigel but I didn't find it did very much in that scenario.

https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B08QZNXSKD/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o09_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

I did read the thing about the end cap to reduce the aperture, I am so trying it next time I am out, I always wondered about it!

I decided to try and combat the skyglow primarily and allow for some more double star work the other day and have a Baader Semi Apo on order to stick into the diagonal (my short tube does not focus if you have an EP + Barlow and add a filter :() will let you know if it makes a difference, it seems to vary by person when you read about them!

https://www.firstlightoptics.com/achromat-semi-apo-filters/baader-semi-apo-filter.html

Honestly CA has never really worried me and its kinda what you expect with archromat refractors, they are awesome within the limitations of what they can do like all scopes. 

I am currently debating the merits of different scopes for my next one already, so far we are down to bigger achromat (probably go up to 120mm), skymax 127 or just go for the 8" dob with the last one being most likely as I don't have to spend any extra money on a new tripod and mount head.

 

Edited March 9, 2021 by wibblefish

[Pixies]

Mine should be arriving tomorrow!..😇

 

[AstroNebulee]

1 hour ago, Pixies said:

Mine should be arriving tomorrow!..😇

 

Exciting times ahead 😁, saw the st80 thread here last night (including mods video bt astronomy shed I think) and just how versatile they are and the little mods that can be done on them to make a relatively cheap frac a worthwhile piece of equipment, hope you enjoy this beaut, clear skies

[Pixies]

2 hours ago, LeeHore7 said:

Exciting times ahead 😁, saw the st80 thread here last night (including mods video bt astronomy shed I think) and just how versatile they are and the little mods that can be done on them to make a relatively cheap frac a worthwhile piece of equipment, hope you enjoy this beaut, clear skies

Thanks. yes - I think a little fettling might be in order. I was sold a while ago with the coverage of this scope from the Actual Astronomy podcast. I might sell my little SW Mak90 to cover this, as it doesn't get a lot of use just now.

 

[BCN_Sean]

I'm getting a bit green with envy with you lot with the ST80's!  Seems to be a fair old drought on the AZ3 kits at the moment, but a local spot may have a shipment of Omegon badged ones in next week; keeping the fingers crossed for that, as either importing from the UK or part hunting would soon have the cost in to something that isn't a sit on the balcony with a pot of tea type scope.

[Tiny Clanger]

Not a chance of any stargazing tonight, cloud, high wind and rain , delightful .

So as a displacement activity I spent a little time fettling the little ST80. Flocked the dew shield (with FLO self adhesive velour stuff left over after flocking my dob) , blackened the lens edges with a sharpie, and twiddled the focus tube adjusting screws (15 minutes hunting a small enough allen key, about 12 seconds using it to get a nice non wobbly action) . I'd thought I'd flock the inside  of the 'scope body too, but with the baffle there needing attention, and various bits of protruding metalwork too, I think paint will be a better option, so that's blackboard paint on the shopping list.

Looks like the weather will be hopeless tomorrow too ...maybe I'll clean and re grease the focus rack & pinion then ... I found a tube of lithium grease in the bike tools kit when rummaging for that tiny allen key ...

Heather

[Pixies]

Me too! me too!

For a while I thought I might get a chance for first light. But alas, wind and rain now...

[SuburbanMak]

Inspired by the various videos and upgrade stories on here I took the plunge and took the ST80 to bits last weekend & lavished some TLC. 

I painted the inner baffles with blackboard paint with an artist's brush.  (Reminded me of painting airfix models as a kid) & flocked the inside of the tube on either side of the baffle with sticky backed flock from FLO. Its very easy to use as the glue is not too sticky and I was able to peel it off and adjust quite easily until I had it looking neat. I also flocked the inside of the dew shield as I had plenty on the roll. I used a kebab stick to puncture screw holes in the flock.  

By this time I was feeling brave so I blacked the edges of the lenses with a few coats from a Sharpie,  I marked an arrow across the two lens edges so that I could put it back again in the right orientation (& made sure I didn't colour over that little bit). 

I gave them a clean with a Baader lens cleaning kit (which was suspiciously expensive, its essentially a lens cleaner cloth and an isopropyl alcohol squirter quite sure I could've got similar from Specsavers much cheaper but I am told it has special telescope things in it...)

 

Getting them back in  position was very easy following the instructions in the video - balancing the lens objective facing down on my hand on the lens cloth and then bringing the tube down vertically on them, the lenses are then seated by arching your palm upward a bit and you can feel when they are properly in place. Then you gently screw the front lens retaining ring back on and then back it off slightly to avoid pinching the optics (which I read as getting the lenses pushed unevenly anywhere). 

Last lap was to black the interior of the focuser, there were a few shiny tube ends and the end of the stainless steel focuser rack quite near the optical path which got sorted out. Then take the rack & pinion apart and clean off the old thick grease with WD40 and an old toothbrush and replace it with lithium grease. 

 

I don't own a laser collimator so I was super careful about marking the tube-focuser alignment with tape so I could be as close as possible to the original alignment, not sure that is an approved technique but when I got it back together all seems to be OK with nice tight stars!   

So, did it make any difference?

I got out for one short session with it on Sunday night & I do think that contrast is definitely improved and the focuser is nicer to use. Also the flock has a side effect of tightening up all the joins & dew-shield fit, so the whole thing feels a bit more "together".  CA wasn't really an issue, but then I wouldn't expect that on the night's targets.

Before the cloud rolled in I was rewarded with some lovely crisp views of the Beehive, Pleiades and Double Cluster - gorgeous at all magnifications offered by the Baader Zoom (17x - 50x).  To test it more at the margins I was able to get a nice wide field view of a tiny M81 & M82, really brought home the vastness. I was also was able to track down M53 (recognisable globular no individual stars resolved) and M64 (just, no detail at the very limit of visibility and had to confirm that what I'd seen was in fact in the right place back in the warm with the atlas.) 

Very easy, well worth the effort and small expenditure and learned a lot.  Next phase will be learning collimation and I suspect the ST80 will be a good test bed to experiment with there too! 

 

Edited March 11, 2021 by SuburbanMak

[SuburbanMak]

On 08/03/2021 at 16:20, Tiny Clanger said:

Dear lord, and international moose/elk incident would be a serious thing , those perishers are large and somewhat likely to kick back , as quite a few random hikers and idiots attempting to hand feed or acquire a selfie with the 'cute' creature have painfully discovered.

But they do have a place in the history of astronomy , search out 'Tycho Brahe's moose' online ...

Have just got round to reading about Tycho Brae's Moose - what an extraordinary story! And in fact he's quite an extraordinary character all round, with an extraordinary moustache....! 

[Tiny Clanger]

28 minutes ago, SuburbanMak said:

Have just got round to reading about Tycho Brae's Moose - what an extraordinary story! And in fact he's quite an extraordinary character all round, with an extraordinary moustache....! 

I've no idea if the 'tache was the fashion in Denmark at the time, or intended as a distraction from the famous metal nose !

Tycho's story would make a fantastic film.

Or a setting for a new series of Blackadder (Edmund as his secretary, Baldrick as ... the moose herd ..or the psychic dwarf... )

[iapa]

On 23/02/2021 at 15:29, SuburbanMak said:

Agreed - like you I can see myself tinkering and learning a lot based on the video @Tiny Clanger posted earlier, all good experience for later becoming self sufficient in maintaining more exotic future equipment , which will inevitably follow  

Last year, I followed this procedure from end to end, taking my time with each step.

Really smooth focus now, usual Colour Aberration you would expect. The collimation was reasonably successful too.

Mainly  used for guiding, with an auto focussed fitted.

May repeat procedure again being more familiar with it.

My variant is the Skywatcher Starttravel 80,