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Buying first telescope


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Hello,

A little bit of a backstory :)A few days ago my son came to mother and me and asked for a telescope. I was thinking about getting a telescope 3 or so years ago, but life got in the way. We live on the outskirts of a city, so light pollution is a normal thing.

I live in Europe and would like to buy locally. After writing back and forth with a few telescope shops (one of them has an interesting interpretation of budget). My budget is about 250 euros.

based on their suggestions here is the list:

SkyWatcher SkyHawk 114/500 P EQ1 - 209eur

SkyWatcher Explorer 130/900 EQ2 - 239

SkyWatcher Startravel 102/500 AZ3 - 295

SkyWatcher Evostar 90/900 AZ3/EQ2 - 219/259

Levenhuk Skyline PRO 80 MAK Telescope - 290

Other suggestions were really out of planned budget.

I know dobsonians are cheaper per diameter, but i would like to be able to move the telescope without taking too much space in car trunk.

Which one you would suggest of getting from the list or a better option?

 

Thanks

 

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The Evostar 90 would be my choice. It will handle being transported in the trunk of you car better without needing re-collimation, it is a slow scope so will not need expensive eyepieces to perform well, and it looks like a 'real' telescope - impressive if you can leave it set up at home. It's also about the cheapest of the bunch. I may be slightly biased as I have one, and they are excellent value.

Whatever you decide - good luck, and hope you enjoy it. And a warm welcome to SGL.

David

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Hi and welcome!

I would suggest the 102/500 ST for portability or perhaps the Evostar 90 (though that might be a bit long / bulky for a car?) if I was to buy one of those. I would suggest an AZ mount over an EQ one as they can be fiddly for beginners (especially if this is primarily for a child) to set up and unneeded if the telescope is primarily for visual use from what I understand. 

I have a 90/660 Evostar which is probably similar to the 102ST and get plenty out of it whilst it isn't overly bulky as I can pick it up with one hand to move it around on the lightweight tripod.

Another option might be binoculars / small spotting scope and a sky guide if you don't want to spend a lot of outlay on a telescope initially to "test the water" to see if it is something your son would be interested in longer term? It could also mean delaying the telescope purchase for a few months which might give you more time to consider and a wider choice as most stock is limited at present due to covid / transit issues.

I am sure there will be plenty of other opinions there are some smaller table top dobsonians that are very good price + portability which may be very suitable but I have no experience of them :)

 

Edited by wibblefish
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How old is your son? If quite young I think a decent sized pair of binoculars (10x50s) and a tripod might be a good idea. They give a nice wild field of view which is good for lots of the brighter targets and are more intuitive to use with no image flip/rotation issues. Easier to take out to dark skies and also can be used for normal daytime purposes if the stargazing doesn't take hold.

Failing that my recommendation for a first scope is always the skywatcher heritage 130p tabletop dobsonian. 

Finding anything new at the minute is a bit of a challenge.

Edited by CraigT82
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I've owned a telescope on an EQ mount and I personally would not recommend it for a beginner.  They sound appealing (you can, in theory, track the movement of the stars) but if you're trying to zip all over the sky to get the "low hanging fruit" of easier objects, which you probably will be doing when you start, they are not so easy to move from one point to another.  I recently bought a Skywatcher 150p heritage dobsonian - yes, you need something (bucket/box/stool) to stand it on, but it collapses down very small and weighs no more than about 7kg.  Plus it's 150mm of aperture - good views!

If you are dead set on going down the refractor route, personally at this price point I would stick with an alt-az mount.  But I'm a beginner, so others may disagree!

Pete

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Was looking at that Skywatcher collapsible 130p dobson, but it was out of stock. Will write to them about when it will be back in stock. Hmm it seems like the official site does not show the 150p, just store pages all are out of stock, maybe this is a new model?

Grandmother was a physics teacher and she had to teach some astronomy too, so i'm leaning towards a telescope.

 

Yes, shops look cleaned out, almost as they had huge discount.

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I promise you that the 150p is real - here is a link to it on the First Light Optics website:

https://www.firstlightoptics.com/heritage/sky-watcher-heritage-150p-flextube-dobsonian-telescope.html

You'll get about 44% extra light with the 150p than you would with the 130 and it's still quite small and compact.  If you have budget left over, you might consider some upgraded eyepieces as the ones that come with this telescope are not that good.  Lots of people (myself included) like the BST starguiders - there are plenty of discussions on this forum that could point you in the direction of which would suit you.

Pete

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On 09/02/2021 at 10:39, Orange Smartie said:

I've owned a telescope on an EQ mount and I personally would not recommend it for a beginner.  They sound appealing (you can, in theory, track the movement of the stars) but if you're trying to zip all over the sky to get the "low hanging fruit" of easier objects, which you probably will be doing when you start, they are not so easy to move from one point to another.  I recently bought a Skywatcher 150p heritage dobsonian - yes, you need something (bucket/box/stool) to stand it on, but it collapses down very small and weighs no more than about 7kg.  Plus it's 150mm of aperture - good views!

If you are dead set on going down the refractor route, personally at this price point I would stick with an alt-az mount.  But I'm a beginner, so others may disagree!

Pete

I was set on getting the Celestron - PowerSeeker 127EQ Telescope - Manual German Equatorial Telescope - 127mm Aperture as a gift for my fiance. He has an interest in astronomy, but has 0 experince with telescopes or binoculars. I know he'd like to see the rings of saturn and jupiters moons and some nebulae with the telescope. 

So i wanted to get something that was easy to use yet powerful. 

I don't think the telescope will be moved around much, except in and out of a balcony or so. 

But im worried about the ease of use. I woulnt like to get something he'd end up not enjoying.

https://www.amazon.com/Celestron-21049-PowerSeeker-127EQ-Telescope/dp/B0007UQNKY/ref=sr_1_1_sspa?crid=3UK1AIP6OVZYR&dchild=1&keywords=celestron+127eq+powerseeker+telescope&qid=1612954902&s=electronics&sprefix=CELESTRON+127EQ%2Celectronics%2C323&sr=1-1-spons&psc=1&spLa=ZW5jcnlwdGVkUXVhbGlmaWVyPUExQjk1NTQ3Q01BSjQ5JmVuY3J5cHRlZElkPUEwNjk2NjkzTFZZM1ozSE5BWkFJJmVuY3J5cHRlZEFkSWQ9QTAxNjM0NDlXUFZBVE5PWFFTTFkmd2lkZ2V0TmFtZT1zcF9hdGYmYWN0aW9uPWNsaWNrUmVkaXJlY3QmZG9Ob3RMb2dDbGljaz10cnVl#HLCXComparisonWidget_feature_div

I have checked the skywatcher 150p, but it seems to not come with a tripod. and he would need something with a tripod.

My budget is $150 

I'd welcome any suggestions, because i have zero experience and reading reviews aren't helping.

 

 

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I can confirm what Orange Smartie says, the heritage 150 is real, I'm looking fondly at mine right now 🙂

For portability, it fits on one seat of a small car (with it's seat belt on ) The 130 has a long history, it s sold under the name 'OneSky Newtonian' , there is a thread here about them which runs to hundreds of pages https://www.cloudynights.com/topic/463109-onesky-newtonian-astronomers-without-borders/page-195

The larger 150 was only released in the summer of 2020 (just in time for me when I was looking for my first proper 'scope) . There is plenty about it in earlier discussions on here, including some videos, just do a search for heritage 150.

Key things to know are that both heritage models need to go o top of something to have the viewfinder at average adult height, and that thing must not wobble. Also there are two simple improvements which make a big difference in use : first some PFTE tape on the screw threads of the focus tube, second a 'shroud' of foam or card or something around the open part to block stray light.

All basic Skywatcher telescopes come with a pair of eyepieces, a 25mm which is fine, and a 10mm which is not so good. Most people replace the 10mm if they find they are using the telescope a lot. If you get a slightly cheaper 130 and don't like the views with the 10mm, you could use the saved money on a better high powered eyepiece

Plenty of time for you to think about it , as you say, the shops are cleaned out. This is due to problems in the factories in China where the telescopes are made, and more problems with transport, added to increased demand as many people are staying at home and pursuing hobbies in their free time,  rather than going out to spend their money !

Heather

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25 minutes ago, SAMFS said:

I have checked the skywatcher 150p, but it seems to not come with a tripod. and he would need something with a tripod.

My budget is $150 

I'd welcome any suggestions, because i have zero experience and reading reviews aren't helping.

The skywatcher heritage 150p and 130p don't have a tripod as such.  They are Dobsonian telescopes - which means they are mounted on a very simple "alt-az" mount - in basic terms that means you turn the telescope on its base from side to side and tip it up and down to point it at the target you wish to look at.  Because the mounting is so simple (and cheap to make), it is very easy to use and you probably get more for your money in terms of the optics.  For normal viewing, you just put the telescope on a table or stool etc (I have a little table made out of scrap wood that I use for mine).

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34 minutes ago, SAMFS said:

I was set on getting the Celestron - PowerSeeker 127EQ Telescope - Manual German Equatorial Telescope - 127mm Aperture as a gift for my fiance. He has an interest in astronomy, but has 0 experince with telescopes or binoculars. I know he'd like to see the rings of saturn and jupiters moons and some nebulae with the telescope. 

So i wanted to get something that was easy to use yet powerful. 

I don't think the telescope will be moved around much, except in and out of a balcony or so. 

But im worried about the ease of use. I woulnt like to get something he'd end up not enjoying.

https://www.amazon.com/Celestron-21049-PowerSeeker-127EQ-Telescope/dp/B0007UQNKY/ref=sr_1_1_sspa?crid=3UK1AIP6OVZYR&dchild=1&keywords=celestron+127eq+powerseeker+telescope&qid=1612954902&s=electronics&sprefix=CELESTRON+127EQ%2Celectronics%2C323&sr=1-1-spons&psc=1&spLa=ZW5jcnlwdGVkUXVhbGlmaWVyPUExQjk1NTQ3Q01BSjQ5JmVuY3J5cHRlZElkPUEwNjk2NjkzTFZZM1ozSE5BWkFJJmVuY3J5cHRlZEFkSWQ9QTAxNjM0NDlXUFZBVE5PWFFTTFkmd2lkZ2V0TmFtZT1zcF9hdGYmYWN0aW9uPWNsaWNrUmVkaXJlY3QmZG9Ob3RMb2dDbGljaz10cnVl#HLCXComparisonWidget_feature_div

I have checked the skywatcher 150p, but it seems to not come with a tripod. and he would need something with a tripod.

My budget is $150 

I'd welcome any suggestions, because i have zero experience and reading reviews aren't helping.

 

 

We had a discussion with a young guy a month or so ago who only after some questions mentioned he would be using a telescope from a balcony, and went through the practicalities (or impracticality) of a telescope on a tripod with him , you can read it here:

https://stargazerslounge.com/topic/369179-i-am-a-beginner-what-can-i-expect-from-the-skywatcher-telescope-n-150750-explorer-150p-eq3-2/

 

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On 09/02/2021 at 11:13, EdvardasR said:

Was looking at that Skywatcher collapsible 130p dobson, but it was out of stock. Will write to them about when it will be back in stock. Hmm it seems like the official site does not show the 150p, just store pages all are out of stock, maybe this is a new model?

Grandmother was a physics teacher and she had to teach some astronomy too, so i'm leaning towards a telescope.

 

Yes, shops look cleaned out, almost as they had huge discount.

Possibly worth mentioning that skywatcher's own website seems to miss out many models or variations of models , it is not up to date. Maybe covid problems ?

An advantage of the heritage 130 and 150 is that the mount is basic and simple, as is the focus arrangement. So more of the money goes into the important bit, the optics. Other telescopes at the same sort of price have smaller mirrors to leave enough in the budget to build a metal  tripod and head, neither will be of very good quality.

Heather

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I have the 90/910 evostar and it is a good scope, though as @Tiny Clanger reports the 10mm eyepiece is pretty poor. I will be purchasing a second scope partly because it is, sadly, not as portable as I would like. Does not fit properly in my mini... I bought the scope used for £60 to see if I would stick with the hobby, so I don't feel too disappointed that I am considering a new scope after two years of ownership. I supplemented the eyepieces with two Celestron Omni plossls (32mm and 15mm) which I paid £40 for off fleabay, which improved things enormously. I may yet change the diagonal as it is a 45° one for a nice 90° dielectric star diagonal as it does not look as if I will be getting my new scope in the near future 😟

As a starter scope I do recommend it.... 

Edited by Marc1964
Added concluding sentence.
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On 09/02/2021 at 09:08, MrFreeze said:

The Evostar 90 would be my choice. It will handle being transported in the trunk of you car better without needing re-collimation, it is a slow scope so will not need expensive eyepieces to perform well, and it looks like a 'real' telescope - impressive if you can leave it set up at home. It's also about the cheapest of the bunch. I may be slightly biased as I have one, and they are excellent value.

Whatever you decide - good luck, and hope you enjoy it. And a warm welcome to SGL.

David

WHICH DO YOU THINK WOULD BE THE BETTER TELESCOPE BETWEEN THE EVOSTAR 90 AND THE Skywatcher 150p heritage dobsonian FOR A BEGINNER WITH ZERO EXPERIENCE? THE GOAL IS TO BE ABLE TO SEE RINGS OF SATURN, AND MERCURY'S MOONS WITHOUT TOO MUCH DIFFICULTY. 

I HAVE HAD THE ''Celestron - PowerSeeker 127EQ Telescope - Manual German Equatorial Telescope - 127mm Aperture'' IN MY BASKET BUT FROM ADVICE AND REVIEWS IT SEEMS THE EQ mount WOULD BE DIFFICULT TO USE FOR A BEGINNER.

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The heritage range of telescopes are excellent both for beginners and more advanced individuals who use the Heritage range as grab and go instruments. I have the Heritage 130p which is mounted on a skywatcher pronto alt/az mount. The other night I had good views of M1, M42, M79,M78, M35 and the Rosette nebula.

By the way mercury does not have any moons as mentioned by SAMFS above. But with the Heritage range you will get good views of Jupiter and Saturn plus the moon of course.

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A couple of pros and cons to add to the above excellent advice.  Undoubtedly a Dobsonian is the best 'bang for the buck'.  Relatively light, easily transported and set up.  But like all Newtonian telescopes will need regular collimation and occasional mirror cleaning.  Collimation can be a bit daunting for beginners, at least a Cheshire eyepiece will be required.  I don't know how accessible the primary mirror adjustments are on the Heritage range.   A refractor of course has none of those problems.  For similar money a fair bit smaller, and although there is no central obstruction so better contrast, the lower light grasp is a con.

Re equatorial mounts, yes the German Equatorial Mount (GEM) can be awkward, particularly for Newtonians because of the fixed eyepiece location.  A comfortable position on one side of the meridian becomes impossible on the other side.  Not a problem for refractors (or catadioptrics) where the eyepiece is at the rear and is easily rotated to suit.  Furthermore, although the situation isn't as bad as it was years go, very often the telescopes are 'undermounted'.  That was certainly the case with my first telescope, an 8" Newt on a GEM.  the mount was far too flimsy, and just the slightest touch on the focuser induced vibrations so bad that it was almost impossible to focus!

A refractor in the price range we're talking about will certainly be an achromat, and so have a degree of fringing on bright objects.  The F10 ratio of the Evostar 90 will help in that respect although at the 900 mm focal length some of the larger targets will exceed the field of view.  But if it's equatorially mounted on an EQ2, that is a bit worrying - it's not particularly heavy, but is quite long.  I would consider that telescope should be on an EQ3-2 mount for stability. A driven GEM can help insofar as there is no need to keep touching the mount to track the target.  The AZ3 option looks sturdier, and I expect the user would soon get the hang of operating both axes to keep the target in view.

Something else to buy at the same time is a planisphere and a good sky guide to help with star hopping to targets - the venerable 'Turn left at Orion' is highly recommended.

Or take the easy way out and get an alt-az GOTO mount 😉  But that will probably exceed the budget.

Best of luck!

Peter

Edited by petevasey
Correcting a few typos!
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52 minutes ago, Mark at Beaufort said:

The heritage range of telescopes are excellent both for beginners and more advanced individuals who use the Heritage range as grab and go instruments. I have the Heritage 130p which is mounted on a skywatcher pronto alt/az mount. The other night I had good views of M1, M42, M79,M78, M35 and the Rosette nebula.

By the way mercury does not have any moons as mentioned by SAMFS above. But with the Heritage range you will get good views of Jupiter and Saturn plus the moon of course.

THANK YOU! I MEANT TO SAY MOONS OF JUPITER (FACEPALM). 

SEEMS LIKE THE SKYWATCHER 150 DOBSONIAN IT IS THEN!

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27 minutes ago, petevasey said:

A couple of pros and cons to add to the above excellent advice.  Undoubtedly a Dobsonian is the best 'bang for the buck'.  Relatively light, easily transported and set up.  But like all Newtonian telescopes will need regular collimation and occasional mirror cleaning.  Collimation can be a bit daunting for beginners, at least a Cheshire eyepiece will be required.  I don't know how accessible the primary mirror adjustments are on the Heritage range.   A refractor of course has none of those problems.  For similar money a fair bit smaller, and although there is no central obstruction so better contrast, the lower light grasp is a con.

Re equatorial mounts, yes the German Equatorial Mount (GEM) can be awkward, particularly for Newtonians because of the fixed eyepiece location.  A comfortable position on one side of the meridian becomes impossible on the other side.  Not a problem for refractors (or catadioptrics) where the eyepiece is at the rear and is easily rotated to suit.  Furthermore, although the situation isn't as bad as it was years go, very often the telescopes are 'undermounted'.  That was certainly the case with my first telescope, an 8" Newt on a GEM.  the mount was far too flimsy, and just the slightest touch on the focuser induced vibrations so bad that it was almost impossible to focus!

A refractor in the price range we're talking about will certainly be an achromat, and so have a degree of fringing on bright objects.  The F10 ratio of the Evostar 90 will help in that respect although at the 900 mm focal length some of the larger targets will exceed the field of view.  But if it's equatorially mounted on an EQ2, that is a bit worrying - it's not particularly heavy, but is quite long.  I would consider that telescope should be on an EQ3-2 mount for stability. A driven GEM can help insofar as there is no need to keep touching the mount to track the target.  The AZ3 option looks sturdier, and I expect the user would soon get the hang of operating both axes to keep the target in view.

Something else to buy at the same time is a planisphere and a good sky guide to help with star hopping to targets - the venerable 'Turn left at Orion' is highly recommended.

Or take the easy way out and get an alt-az GOTO mount 😉  But that will probably exceed the budget.

Best of luck!

Peter

CONSIDERED THE ALT-AZ MOUNT, BUT FIGURED I'D LET HIM FIGURE OUT THE TELESCOPE ITSELF FIRST. AND WE'LL FIND A GOOD STOOL FOR NOW. MAYBE EVENTUALLY UPGRADE TO A MOUNT.

BUT IT SEEMS NOW LIKE I SHOULD DEFINATELY PURCHASE THE CHESHIRE EYEPIECE TOGETHER WITH THE TELESCOPE. 

 

DO YOU BELIEVE THE REFRACTOR WILL BE A BETTER OPTION THAN THE SKYWATCHER DOBSONIAN? IN TERMS OF SEEING RINGS OF SATURN, MOONS OF JUPITER, ETC, AN LESS COMPLICATED MAINTENANCE? (FOR SOMEONE WITH ZERO EXPEREINCE BUT ALOT OF ENTHUSIASM)

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On 10/02/2021 at 14:47, Tiny Clanger said:

We had a discussion with a young guy a month or so ago who only after some questions mentioned he would be using a telescope from a balcony, and went through the practicalities (or impracticality) of a telescope on a tripod with him , you can read it here:

https://stargazerslounge.com/topic/369179-i-am-a-beginner-what-can-i-expect-from-the-skywatcher-telescope-n-150750-explorer-150p-eq3-2/

 

READ THROUGH THE THREAD. FROM WHAT I'VE READ, I SHOULDN'T EVEN GET A DOBSONAIN FOR A BALCONY. BUT MY BALCONY IS QUITE WIDE. SO MAYBE IF I GET THE TELESCOPE AND IT DOES NOT FIT WELL, I'D GET AN ALT-AZ COMPUTERISED MOUNT. 

AND JUST HOPE IM NOT BUNGLING IT. BEACUSE THIS IS A GIFT, I JUST WANT TO MAKE IT EASY TO GET INTO ASTRONOMY FOR HIM. SINCE'S HE'S ALWAYS HAD SUCH AN INTEREST. 

 

SO FAR IM GETTING THE 

SKYWATCHER HERITAGE 150,

A CHESHIRE EYEPIECE,

A BST STARGUIDE (HOW IMPORTANT IS THIS FOR A STARTER PLEASE?)

THE TURN LEFT AT ORION BOOK.

 

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@SAMFS Just check the size of your balcony. The Heritage dobs will be on a table and you will be observing from the front of the scope-not behind it.  Is your balcony big enough to push a table to the front edge and move behind it. Do you have railings significantly higher than the table? the dob would need to lean over the railings and you would lean over too in order to view. It might be possible but I very much doubt it would be convenient and I can't see how sitting at the eyepiece could be done.

That's the reason I got a refractor although it's a bit of a squeeze on my little balcony.

 

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@domstar  ITS LONG ENOGH TO LOOK THROUGH THE FRONT OF THE SCOPE, BUT YOU CAN'T MOVE AROUND COMFORTABLY. RAILINGS ARE QUITE LOW (JUST REALISED I DIDN'T CONSIDER THIS). 

WHAT REFRACTOR DO YOU HAVE? I'M NOW CONSIDERING THE EVOSTARR 90. 

THIS LOOKS MORE LIKE A TELESCOPE, SO IT'LL LOOK GOOD AS WELL AS BE FUNCTIONAL.

IS MAINTENANCE ON THIS EASIER THAN ON THE DOBSONIAN?

 

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14 minutes ago, domstar said:

@SAMFS Just check the size of your balcony. The Heritage dobs will be on a table and you will be observing from the front of the scope-not behind it.  Is your balcony big enough to push a table to the front edge and move behind it. Do you have railings significantly higher than the table? the dob would need to lean over the railings and you would lean over too in order to view. It might be possible but I very much doubt it would be convenient and I can't see how sitting at the eyepiece could be done.

That's the reason I got a refractor although it's a bit of a squeeze on my little balcony.

 

Why would anyone push a table to the front of a balcony then lean out over a railing to look through an eyepiece ?

A table placed a little way back from the front of the balcony so you can stand next to the eyepiece at the side of the tube opening , near the rail of the balcony makes perfect sense. Completely extended the heritage 150 is exactly 71cm long, and you stand beside it. That is the maximum front to back space you need, no tripod legs to trip over, no worrying about if you can fit behind it to look through, just sit or stand next to the eyepiece.

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5 minutes ago, SAMFS said:

@domstar  ITS LONG ENOGH TO LOOK THROUGH THE FRONT OF THE SCOPE, BUT YOU CAN'T MOVE AROUND COMFORTABLY. RAILINGS ARE QUITE LOW (JUST REALISED I DIDN'T CONSIDER THIS). 

WHAT REFRACTOR DO YOU HAVE? I'M NOW CONSIDERING THE EVOSTARR 90. 

THIS LOOKS MORE LIKE A TELESCOPE, SO IT'LL LOOK GOOD AS WELL AS BE FUNCTIONAL.

IS MAINTENANCE ON THIS EASIER THAN ON THE DOBSONIAN?

 

Why are you shouting ?

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@Tiny Clanger Yes, I shouldn't assume everybody has the same balcony as me. On my balcony I push the scope as far forward as I can because the side walls and roof extend as far as the balcony itself and the further forward the scope is, the more sky I can see.  Now you've explained it, I can see how it could work on a large balcony.

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