Does Charles Messier post here?

[Mark at Beaufort]

When the sgl management decided to find a new venue for the sgl4 star party I was asked to visit the lucksall caravan site to assess it dark site suitability. I visited the site with my 15x70 celeston binos and viewed both M1 and M33.

We have used this site ever since and many members have seen some DSOs for the first time. Hopefully, we will return to lucksall in the future.

From home I often view M1 using my Apollo 15x70 binos.

[inFINNity Deck]

13 hours ago, wookie1965 said:

This Lamp is directly south.

Of I understood Padraic well this is M2 of Messi's list, so two more to go..... 😉

Nicolàs

Edited January 9, 2021 by inFINNity Deck

[HutchStar]

I found M1 relatively easily but I can see why people struggle. Think it was a fluke I found it because calling it a smudge would be overstating it. It was a whisp of a smudge which I just happened to catch a glimpse of in the corner of my eye.

The messier object thats driving me nuts at the moment is M33, pinwheel galaxy. I feel like it should be easy-ish to see but I've tried for hours without luck.

[John]

34 minutes ago, HutchStar said:

I found M1 relatively easily but I can see why people struggle. Think it was a fluke I found it because calling it a smudge would be overstating it. It was a whisp of a smudge which I just happened to catch a glimpse of in the corner of my eye.

The messier object thats driving me nuts at the moment is M33, pinwheel galaxy. I feel like it should be easy-ish to see but I've tried for hours without luck.

M33 is another where the stated magnitude is very misleading as a guide to potential visibility because it is an extended object and the actual surface brightness of the galaxy is much lower than the integrated magnitude figure of 5.7. As a face on spiral it does have a core but the brightness of that area is not much greater than that of the spiral arms that surround it.

I have never seen M33 naked eye but I have seen it with 7x35 binoculars on a dark night here. Through scopes quite often and it is worth finding because it is one of the very few galaxies that contain deep sky objects (nebulae in this case) that can be seen fairly readily with amateur scopes, the star forming HII region NGC 604 in particular. The trick is to find M33 in the first place though !

 

[HutchStar]

39 minutes ago, John said:

M33 is another where the stated magnitude is very misleading as a guide to potential visibility because it is an extended object and the actual surface brightness of the galaxy is much lower than the integrated magnitude figure of 5.7. As a face on spiral it does have a core but the brightness of that area is not much greater than that of the spiral arms that surround it.

I have never seen M33 naked eye but I have seen it with 7x35 binoculars on a dark night here. Through scopes quite often and it is worth finding because it is one of the very few galaxies that contain deep sky objects (nebulae in this case) that can be seen fairly readily with amateur scopes, the star forming HII region NGC 604 in particular. The trick is to find M33 in the first place though !

 

I'm trying with an 8 inch reflector. 48 times magnification. Do I need more magnification or less?

[Mark at Beaufort]

4 minutes ago, HutchStar said:

I'm trying with an 8 inch reflector. 48 times magnification. Do I need more magnification or less?

Do you own some binos or has your 8" scope got a 50mm finderscope? If so place alpha Tri (Mothallah) in the centre of your FOV. About 5 degrees looking towards Andromeda you will pick up a 6 mag star. Extend your line a further 5 degrees and you will see this hazy glow (M33). I often sit in a reclining chair and view M33 with binos. 

On a good clear night with good transparency you should pick up NGC 604.

[vlaiv]

2 hours ago, Stu said:

I doubt it was, but I’m sure skies were much darker so it was easier to find. I spent years looking for, and failing to find M1 from home or local skies. The first time I went somewhere dark I found it straight away, really quite easy though not spectacular in smaller apertures. I’ve even managed it in 15x50is binoculars once as I recall.

Actually, there is reason to believe that it was somewhat brighter than now.

It has to do with surface brightness and the fact that planetary nebulae are expanding over time. I don't know how much it expanded since then, but it is fair to assume that it is measurable amount (if we had image from back then and one shot now).

[HutchStar]

13 minutes ago, Mark at Beaufort said:

Do you own some binos or has your 8" scope got a 50mm finderscope? If so place alpha Tri (Mothallah) in the centre of your FOV. About 5 degrees looking towards Andromeda you will pick up a 6 mag star. Extend your line a further 5 degrees and you will see this hazy glow (M33). I often sit in a reclining chair and view M33 with binos. 

On a good clear night with good transparency you should pick up NGC 604.

I do have a finder scope. I'll try this out, thanks!

[John]

41 minutes ago, HutchStar said:

I'm trying with an 8 inch reflector. 48 times magnification. Do I need more magnification or less?

Less. It may be easier to see M33 in a 50mm finder scope than in your main 8 inch scope, ironically.

It appears as a faint hazy patch framed by a rhomboid formed by 4 faintish stars. This is M33 at 27x with a 130mm newtonian, drawing by Martijn Straub:

Edited January 9, 2021 by John

[Stu]

44 minutes ago, vlaiv said:

Actually, there is reason to believe that it was somewhat brighter than now.

It has to do with surface brightness and the fact that planetary nebulae are expanding over time. I don't know how much it expanded since then, but it is fair to assume that it is measurable amount (if we had image from back then and one shot now).

True enough, although I suspect the light pollution issue is the greater factor of the two. It exploded in 1054, so is nearly 1000 years old, and was ‘discovered’ in 1731 apparently so would have been approximately 70% of its current size perhaps? A measurable increase in surface brightness as you suggest.

[wookie1965]

12 hours ago, Jiggy 67 said:

You send that photo with the fact that you’re an amateur astronomer to the council, they may do something about that for you 

I did it was worse before if it could get any worse they came out and put this shield on and this is the result.

[Muc]

I've seen M1 for the first time recently. With my 4" F4.2 Astroscan. At 16x with the 28mm eyepiece. Just smudgy but clearly there. 

Clocking off loads of Messiers stuff with that scope that I've never gotten to see before. 

That's from a suburban back garden.

Not M33 yet, but gonna keep trying