Why isn’t everyone an astronomer?

[John]

I don't think I could help ending up interested in space and astronomy. I was 9 when Apollo 11 made the 1st moon landing and had followed the preparatory and later missions with avid interest. My parents were not particularly interested in those subjects themselves but were very aware of the significance of what was unfolding so ensured that my brother and I had a good supply of newspaper and magazine articles, plastic model kits etc and were able to watch much of the TV coverage.

Actually the "hit" rate from their efforts was just 50% because my brother is not all that interested these days

I suppose there were a lot of folks who lived through the 1965-75 period relatively unaware of these momentus space-related events though 

I have always been interested in nature, wildlife, geology and the natural world though so I guess space and astronomy are an extension of that.

 

Edited December 26, 2020 by John

[Moonshed]

45 minutes ago, Tiny Clanger said:

And some have no concept of the difference between child like, and childish, and are so bogged down in the drudgery of keeping up with the Joneses that they forget to look up and wonder.

Heather

I sometimes think that to admit to being in awe or emotionally moved by something is to show a sign of weakness that cannot be tolerated by today’s society. This appears to be an extension of the old myth that men don’t cry, that’s what girls do. To be honest though at my stage in life Heather I really don’t give a jot as to what others may think of my marvelling at the wonders of the universe while they cry when their team drops a point. C’est la Vie! Each to their own.

Edited December 26, 2020 by Moonshed

[niallk]

Just now, Captain Magenta said:

I too had my adult astronomy epiphany stumbling out of a pub in West Cork about 6 years ago. Having been used to SE England LP for most of my adult life, the blaze of stars against a sable backdrop that greeted me as I left Bushe’s in Baltimore blew my mind.

Jimmy's in Allihies for me 😂

Ah yes, I know Bushe's: I've 'missed' more than one ferry out to Cape Clear for the story telling festival, just to have one more Guinness there - great spot!!

[Moonshed]

5 hours ago, Hals said:

Be pretty boring if everyone was an astronomer. It's nice to be in a niche hobby. I'm sure everyone who has a hobby says the same thing, no matter what their interests are. My missus loves crafting for instance and I can't see the appeal of it personally but I can see how passionate she is about it. There you are.

The wording of the title was not of course meant to be taken quite so literally. My wife for instance loves to sew, to make dresses and tops and....things, and gets so involved in watching some YouTuber’s sewing vlogs (is that the right word?) and gets very passionate about everything sewing. My brother-in-law is into collecting air guns and rifles and loves to carve new wooden stocks for them and tinker around with the firing mechanism, he can easily spend a week or more making one rifle stock from a block of wood. While these hobbies hold only a passing interest for me, apart from the wood carving, I can fully appreciate it is their thing as much as astronomy is mine, which of course they think to be very boring.

As you so rightly say, it would indeed be pretty boring if everyone was an astronomer.

[scarp15]

7 hours ago, Paz said:

I think people get inspired into different hobbies for different reasons depending on their interests but also their circumstances and what they happen to experience. I got into astronomy by a chance coming together of circumstances.

Chance determines so much within our lives and within the vast realms of space. When Kielder Star Camp was first introduced and publicized and a family friend was actually planning on going, this became a strong incentive and a reawakening I guess towards an interest practiced from a young age. As also with John, a memory of my brother and I sitting up to watch the grainy and quite abstract, to my 7 year old mind, first pictures of Neil Armstrong stepping from the Lunar Landing Module, subconsciously remained. I have always had a fascination in the great outdoors and exploring landscapes, astronomy is a way of forming a connection with landscapes of different constitutions - just 'further away'. Not unlike other hobbies, is also a form of escapism, becoming transported elsewhere. Unfortunately many folk prefer their warm, dry and lit indoor environments, TV's and gadgets , to become transported elsewhere.

[Jonk]

I don’t think I have an exact past moment that got me hooked, but I have vague memories of looking through my grandad’s telescope when I was probably about 10, mainly at the moon.

Since then, I’ve always loved space, especially films like Star Wars and that sort of thing growing up in the 80s.

I always enjoyed taking photos, especially when digital cameras first came about and I suppose linking the love of photography and the love of space gives me what I love doing today, astro imaging of various flavours.

So I suppose I have my late grandad to thank.

[Roy Challen]

11 hours ago, Tiny Clanger said:

My dad was a philatelist, so naturally as a child I found stamps I was not allowed to touch boring,  and began to collect coins instead,  I liked that the worn ones I could afford had been in many pockets and purses . I was hooked on UK copper pennies when I found my home city Birmingham, and even my suburb of it, had manufactured some pennies in a few years of the first two decades of the 20th century , identifiable by a tiny 'H' for Heaton's or KN for Kings Norton next to the  date. Heaton's had bought up the machinery from Matthew Bolton's Soho Mint, which led me to find out about the Industrial Revolution , and then the Lunar Society of Birmingham .

There ,  I've gone from coin collecting to astronomy in a few steps !

My great grandfather, (or was it great great grandfather?) was a partner in an engineering firm that made presses for minting. They were based in Birmingham, Taylor and Challen was the name. There are still some buildings that bear the name, and apparently, many examples of the prsses still exist in operational condition around the world. T and C were taken over in the 70s but that company still makes spares for Tand C presses almost a century after they were made. Test samples are easily available to buy on eBay etc.

[Mr Spock]

Some people have a sense of wonder about the world around them, some don't. 

There is also a shortfall in the education system. The science lessons as I knew it was split into physics, chemistry and biology; they were quite rigid, but, there is so much more to science than that. Each of those could be expanded to include subjects like astronomy and the natural world.

I'm in quite a few nature groups on facebook and it's staggering the number of people who can't correctly identify a bee, house sparrow or dandelion.
I've lost count of the times someone has posted a picture of a hoverfly (not one of the bee mimics) and asked what kind of bee it is... sigh. 

[wulfrun]

1 hour ago, Mr Spock said:

Some people have a sense of wonder about the world around them, some don't. 

There is also a shortfall in the education system. The science lessons as I knew it was split into physics, chemistry and biology; they were quite rigid, but, there is so much more to science than that. Each of those could be expanded to include subjects like astronomy and the natural world.

I'm in quite a few nature groups on facebook and it's staggering the number of people who can't correctly identify a bee, house sparrow or dandelion.
I've lost count of the times someone has posted a picture of a hoverfly (not one of the bee mimics) and asked what kind of bee it is... sigh. 

Agreed with all of the above. Nowadays, there is a gulf of disconnect between (most) humans and the natural world in all senses. We have nice cosy lives, with light & warmth, shelter and food readily available and an almost unlimited level of entertainment, in whatever form interests us, to keep us in our comfortable homes. Yes, sweeping generalisations but roughly correct for the majority.

My interest in astronomy comes from a young age, I can still recall a sense of wonder at the night skies when the family was taken out to Cannock Chase (local beauty area) when light pollution was far lower. And looking through my Dad's CZJ 8x30 binoculars in amazement at how much more there is. Science has always been an area of study and interest for me but things like telescopes were beyond my financial reach until fairly recently. I had to make do with armchair astronomy; books, TV etc. I recall the Moon landings too. One thing that does occur to me: nowadays we have (relatively) cheap astro gear but perversely we've ruined (largely) the environment that allows its best use. Having just taken up a more active interest, I find that annoying and saddening - in equal measure.

I think in days gone by, people were more aware of the night skies, not least because they could actually see them! It would just have been part of everyday (or every-night) life, even if it was less understood. Proper darkness is now all but banished and scares many.

Edited December 27, 2020 by wulfrun

[Macavity]

Everyone is [an Astronomer] these days? Or is that "Astronomy science FAN"?!?! 🥳

N.B. I do appreciate the work of today's *science promoters* - But I chuckled when
one (TAK owner, noless) asked "social media" a rank beginner Astronomy question?
Maybe he should join an Astro Forum... Read Books (Not just his own)! [teasing] 😛

There are ever more "bums on seats" at university/college now etc. But I still worry:
Do the audiences e.g. of TEDx talks become active scientists or just "Science Fans"?
The "I hate experts scientists" are a omnipressent: "That's all clever clogs stuff" - in
the words of one of my neighbours! But it also saddens me many folks lacked the
opportunity to DO stuff I had... Amateur Astronomers, I meet, who were told that
"they could never become Scientist". Worse still many folk have NO HOBBIES?! ☹️

I was lucky. Despite certain "home problems" my "kidulthood" had a modicum of
BOOKS available... I avidly read my parents' Observer's Books & Encyclopediae?!?
MY parents indulged my hobbies... DAD encouraged me  to "explore rock pools"
(whatever). My MUM was sadly almost *totally* deprived of an education (sigh)
But I owe her a softer, more empathetic, side of the "hardcore scientist" thing! 🤓

A complex problem. Parents who work all the time? Kids who have zero  access to
"stuff they can take appart" (allegedly a budding scientist thing?!). A culture where
every one is "hard working", but devotes ALL spare time to "DIY / Car maintenance
cleaning" or (essential) money making? Today's Students who "Go treking in the
Andes"? (GREAT!) But Star Gazing & making electronics stuff is less unworthy? 🤔

Sadly, over recent years, I have become disenchanted with Science & Amateur
Astronomy. So much is now "Argumentative" - "Friendly fire" hurts worst of all.

 

 

Edited December 27, 2020 by Macavity

[Tiny Clanger]

3 hours ago, Roy Challen said:

My great grandfather, (or was it great great grandfather?) was a partner in an engineering firm that made presses for minting. They were based in Birmingham, Taylor and Challen was the name. There are still some buildings that bear the name, and apparently, many examples of the prsses still exist in operational condition around the world. T and C were taken over in the 70s but that company still makes spares for Tand C presses almost a century after they were made. Test samples are easily available to buy on eBay etc.

Interesting ! Brummie metal working was so ubiquitous for 200 years it had a nickname, "metal bashing industry" . Best not mention the notorious tool for precision work, the Brumagen screwdriver (a hammer, ideal for knocking screws in to save time ... ) Some old companies still carry on in the traditional way in the same factories with the same tools, one fascinating story is J. Hudson,  still making the famous metal 'acme thunderer' whistles in  Brum as they did in Victorian times https://www.acmewhistles.co.uk/since-1870

In the 1960s my dad worked for J.R Gaunt & sons, one of many button makers in Brum ( https://www.oldcopper.org/makers/buttons_birmingham.php, ) they also made military badges and medals , they were I believe taken over in the 70's by the Birmingham Mint , around that time my dad went to work for Hoskins and Sewell another company founded in Victroria's reign , who made metal bed frames, specifically hospital ones when dad worked for them.

http://calmview.birmingham.gov.uk/CalmView/Record.aspx?src=CalmView.Catalog&id=MS+1088

My grandad though, saw the way the world was heading, having been impressed by the newfangled bakelite (the first ever manmade plastic) in the late 1920s, he got into the machining of plastics, set up a small business with a couple of partners, and made a modest but comfortable living from it.

[Moonshed]

17 minutes ago, Tiny Clanger said:

Interesting ! Brummie metal working was so ubiquitous for 200 years it had a nickname, "metal bashing industry" . Best not mention the notorious tool for precision work, the Brumagen screwdriver (a hammer, ideal for knocking screws in to save time ... ) Some old companies still carry on in the traditional way in the same factories with the same tools, one fascinating story is J. Hudson,  still making the famous metal 'acme thunderer' whistles in  Brum as they did in Victorian times https://www.acmewhistles.co.uk/since-1870

In the 1960s my dad worked for J.R Gaunt & sons, one of many button makers in Brum ( https://www.oldcopper.org/makers/buttons_birmingham.php, ) they also made military badges and medals , they were I believe taken over in the 70's by the Birmingham Mint , around that time my dad went to work for Hoskins and Sewell another company founded in Victroria's reign , who made metal bed frames, specifically hospital ones when dad worked for them.

http://calmview.birmingham.gov.uk/CalmView/Record.aspx?src=CalmView.Catalog&id=MS+1088

My grandad though, saw the way the world was heading, having been impressed by the newfangled bakelite (the first ever manmade plastic) in the late 1920s, he got into the machining of plastics, set up a small business with a couple of partners, and made a modest but comfortable living from it.

Thank you for presenting all that information on old Birmingham and its history of metal working. I found the section on those old buttons fascinating for some reason, will have to show it to my wife. I absolutely love the Brumagen screwdriver, still very popular today in some quarters.

[Moonshed]

40 minutes ago, Macavity said:

Everyone is [an Astronomer] these days? Or is that "Astronomy science FAN"?!?! 🥳

N.B. I do appreciate the work of today's *science promoters* - But I chuckled when
one (TAK owner, noless) asked "social media" a rank beginner Astronomy question?
Maybe he should join an Astro Forum... Read Books (Not just his own)! [teasing] 😛

There are ever more "bums on seats" at university/college now etc. But I still worry:
Do the audiences e.g. of TEDx talks become active scientists or just "Science Fans"?
The "I hate experts scientists" are a omnipressent: "That's all clever clogs stuff" - in
the words of one of my neighbours! But it also saddens me many folks lacked the
opportunity to DO stuff I had... Amateur Astronomers, I meet, who were told that
"they could never become Scientist". Worse still many folk have NO HOBBIES?! ☹️

I was lucky. Despite certain "home problems" my "kidulthood" had a modicum of
BOOKS available... I avidly read my parents' Observer's Books & Encyclopediae?!?
MY parents indulged my hobbies... DAD encouraged me  to "explore rock pools"
(whatever). My MUM was sadly almost *totally* deprived of an education (sigh)
But I owe her a softer, more empathetic, side of the "hardcore scientist" thing! 🤓

A complex problem. Parents who work all the time? Kids who have zero  access to
"stuff they can take appart" (allegedly a budding scientist thing?!). A culture where
every one is "hard working", but devotes ALL spare time to "DIY / Car maintenance
cleaning" or (essential) money making? Today's Students who "Go treking in the
Andes"? (GREAT!) But Star Gazing & making electronics stuff is less unworthy? 🤔

Sadly, over recent years, I have become disenchanted with Science & Amateur
Astronomy. So much is now "Argumentative" - "Friendly fire" hurts worst of all.

 

 

I found myself nodding in agreement as I read your comments, so much there that I connected to.

With regards to universities I really don’t know what it is they are teaching their students today, how to fill in grant application forms for exciting new projects, such as researching why dogs sniff lampposts? Years ago English universities were considered the centres of excellence whence came great politicians, Prime Ministers, scientists,  businessmen who created empires, and so much more. What do they produce today? Maybe the best of them, Oxbridge say, still create those great individuals, but the other 99% seem to be a places where teenagers go when they have left school yet don’t want to work for a living, it’s just a fun place to hang out with other like minded entitled millennials who as you say go trekking in the Andes.

Your last paragraph saddens me though, but I kind of get where you are coming from.

[wulfrun]

1 hour ago, Tiny Clanger said:

Interesting ! Brummie metal working was so ubiquitous for 200 years it had a nickname, "metal bashing industry" . Best not mention the notorious tool for precision work, the Brumagen screwdriver (a hammer, ideal for knocking screws in to save time ... ) Some old companies still carry on in the traditional way in the same factories with the same tools, one fascinating story is J. Hudson,  still making the famous metal 'acme thunderer' whistles in  Brum as they did in Victorian times https://www.acmewhistles.co.uk/since-1870

In the 1960s my dad worked for J.R Gaunt & sons, one of many button makers in Brum ( https://www.oldcopper.org/makers/buttons_birmingham.php, ) they also made military badges and medals , they were I believe taken over in the 70's by the Birmingham Mint , around that time my dad went to work for Hoskins and Sewell another company founded in Victroria's reign , who made metal bed frames, specifically hospital ones when dad worked for them.

http://calmview.birmingham.gov.uk/CalmView/Record.aspx?src=CalmView.Catalog&id=MS+1088

My grandad though, saw the way the world was heading, having been impressed by the newfangled bakelite (the first ever manmade plastic) in the late 1920s, he got into the machining of plastics, set up a small business with a couple of partners, and made a modest but comfortable living from it.

I have an Acme Thunderer - my Dad worked for BR/Freightliner and had a BR-logoed one which is now mine. The logo is on a brass(?) inset in the plastic (probably bakelite). There's a lot of industry still in this area, far more than you might think. Virtually all of the big places are long gone but there's still a wealth of one-man/small business outfits on small industrial estates around here. My paternal grandfather was the last ropemaker in the area, he worked for the same company for 60 years, from 14 till he retired at 74. Different times and a different world.

I take it since you made mention of the Lunar Society in a previous post that you know why it was so named? I read that they met monthly (ish) when the full moon made navigating Brum's dark streets safer.

[Tiny Clanger]

58 minutes ago, Moonshed said:

Thank you for presenting all that information on old Birmingham and its history of metal working. I found the section on those old buttons fascinating for some reason, will have to show it to my wife. I absolutely love the Brumagen screwdriver, still very popular today in some quarters.

You're welcome, I may be exiled in Leicestershire, but I'm proud of my real home., and find its history interesting : a settlement with no major river, no handy geological treasures such as coal or iron ore, no port , no royal connections, no ancient religious foundations, and yet still it grew to a city, simply because of the industry and enterprise of the inhabitants.

The coins, buttons, whistles and other 'toys' as they were known, such as metal buckles , are small tangible pieces of the lives of normal people ,  I think that's where the fascination with them lies for me.

[endless-sky]

Why isn't everyone an astronomer?

I have asked myself the same question multiple times, but never gave it much of an answer. It would seem only natural to be in wonder of such a marvellous beauty that is our visible sky.

However, if I had to try to answer, I would say:

- because it's expensive; and the more into it you get, the more money is needed for the next "bang for the buck". You start visually, then binos, then a small achromatic refractor, then a 114 mm Newton, then a Celestron C8, then you want to get into imaging and buy an equatorial mount, an FPL-53 triplet, a dedicated DSLR (to astromodify it), a guide scope, a guide camera (till here, this is my actual path), then in the future you'll want a monochromatic, cooled astrocamera, filterwheel, filters, bigger scope(s), bigger mount(s), more cameras. As long as there's Universe to observe/photograph, there will really be no end on the amount of equipment you'll want to have. There's always something dimmer, smaller, and further away that you'll want to see/photograph and that your current gear won't allow you to

- because it's not taught in schools; at least not when I attended, more than 30 years ago. I had to develop an interest into Astronomy on my own. I was fortunate enough that the son (older than me) of some family friends had an Astronomy book and let me look at it when we used to go visit. After the first couple of pages (if you don't count the cover and the first few blank pages/introduction), I was hooked (I was less than 6 or 7 years old)

- because you need nights in order to enjoy it (unless you are only interested in the Sun); nights are when people usually sleep after work / spend time with their family / relax / watch TV. It's hard to find time for a few hours under the stars when you take all these into account

- because it's weather dependent; if you are hardcore about running / cycling / doing activities that require you to be outside, you can still do them/enjoy them (maybe a little less), even if it's cloudy/raining. But no amount of money and gear will clear the sky for you to use it. You'll have to wait for a clear night. Then there's the Moon. Sometimes, a clear sky night with no Moon feels rarer than the Great Conjunction that we just had...

- because it's light pollution dependent; and as time passes, light pollution is only destined to grow. 20-30 years ago I could find a dark sky in less than a 30 minute drive. Now I probably have to drive 1/1.5 hours to get to a dark sky. You can find a "solution" to this by doing narrowband, but then see the first answer above (monochrome, filterwheel, filters = $$$)

So, you really, really need to be into it, for all of the above (and more) to not matter much to you and still allow youreslf to enjoy it.

To me, everytime I see / photograph a DSO, a planet, the Moon or a comet, I still feel the same wonder / humbleness that I did at that first page with a photograph, of that book that I was lucky enough to see when I was still young enough that my age could be counted in less than two full hands. And I probably will keep feeling until I am too old to be able to see.

[Tiny Clanger]

16 minutes ago, wulfrun said:

I have an Acme Thunderer - my Dad worked for BR/Freightliner and had a BR-logoed one which is now mine. The logo is on a brass(?) inset in the plastic (probably bakelite). There's a lot of industry still in this area, far more than you might think. Virtually all of the big places are long gone but there's still a wealth of one-man/small business outfits on small industrial estates around here. My paternal grandfather was the last ropemaker in the area, he worked for the same company for 60 years, from 14 till he retired at 74. Different times and a different world.

I take it since you made mention of the Lunar Society in a previous post that you know why it was so named? I read that they met monthly (ish) when the full moon made navigating Brum's dark streets safer.

My Acme Thunderer is more recent, a mere 30 years old, all metal  (bar the cork 'pea') but it's called in many hundreds of children at the end of playtimes ! I also have a CWS stamped (Co-operative Wholesale Soc.) police style whistle dated 1941 which grandad used in the home guard ( the Birmingham CWS factory turned from making pots & pans to war work). Acme make a range of historical whistles from the original machine tools , interesting to browse their website.

The Black Country in general I think of as a sort of run-together set of towns which each had their particular industrial specializations, often heavier industry than  Brum's small metal stuff, like chain making at Netherton, and leather tanning at Walsall , I really don't know much about the area beyond a few visits to the excellent Black country Museum, and geological field trips to the Wren's Nest.

The Lunar Society , Watt, Boulton, Priestley, Wedgewood, Darwin*  (and typical self deprecating brummie humour that they called themselves the lunatics )  I read "The Lunar Men" by Jenny Uglow, a while back and whilst it seems well researched and accurate, I didn't much enjoy the book, too much of a set of disparate biographies, not enough of the development of scientific ideas for my taste. By the way, we have one of the lunatics to thank for gas lighting, Murdoch , so I guess you could call him the father of light pollution !

 

 

*Not that one, his grandfather Erasmus

[Tiny Clanger]

Science education can surgically remove all the joy from the subject. Teachers in England these days have to be constantly mindful  of targets, assessments and the curriculum, if you can't test or assess something, it's not going to be a priority of management, who are increasingly all about the statistics.

I hated the fact that many of my fellow primary school teachers knew so little about science that they were reluctant to teach it in an interesting way, fearing that the pupils might ask questions they couldn't answer . So they avoided the fun experiments ("It might turn out wrong and not prove what I want it to !" ) whilst I relished the unexpected result, as it gave a chance to analyze what might have produced the seeming anomaly, and involve the pupils in some critical thinking and possibly the devising of further tests . Plus I was happy to say, "I don't know why that happened, let's see if we can find out" . Which is precisely what science is all about.

I like to think I got quite a few pupils interested in science, or at the very least gave them a basic understanding of how it works. I ran a free after school science club too, which was always over subscribed . Often a week or so into the new school year I'd get pupils who had moved on to 'the big school' down the road pop back at the end of the day to say hello and tell me how they were getting on, and I'd always ask them what science lessons they'd had in those exciting, proper , well equipped lab.s , taught by actual graduates in chemistry, physics etc .

Every year, every returning pupil said their first task in the chemistry lab was to draw and label a bunsen burner.

Good grief, I'm pretty sure I had to draw the exact same thing myself over 40 years ago. What a great way to convince 11 year olds that science is boring . You couldn't just do a demo of putting out a candle with carbon dioxide, or do the exploding custard tin thing , or burn a bit of magnesium ribbon or anything slightly theatrical to grab their interest ?

[Moonshed]

Tiny Clanger, you were exactly the type of teacher that kids love. I love science and always have, even before that interest was enhanced by a good science teacher who loved to carry out experiments. This could be as simple as getting two volunteers to come to the front of the class and each be given a thin metal strip to hold, the other ends of which were heated by the ubiquitous Bunsen burner. One would let go very quickly while the other could keep holding it, a fun way to demonstrate the different heat conductivity of different metals, and it sticks in the mind! One of my favourites was taking an empty five gallon can with a small screw cap on the top, I think it was a paraffin can, and putting a little water in and then boiling the water. After a while steam would come out of the filler hole  and after a minute or two, long enough to push most of the air out, the cap was screwed tightly on and the heat turned off. As it cooled It was amazing to watch  the air pressure crush that tin like it was made of paper, a brilliant experiment  demonstrating the air pressure we live in and a vacuum. 
As you say, if an experiment goes wrong that should be used an exciting new project to determine why it didn’t work, so much more can be learnt that way.

[wulfrun]

1 hour ago, Tiny Clanger said:

Good grief, I'm pretty sure I had to draw the exact same thing myself over 40 years ago. What a great way to convince 11 year olds that science is boring . You couldn't just do a demo of putting out a candle with carbon dioxide, or do the exploding custard tin thing , or burn a bit of magnesium ribbon or anything slightly theatrical to grab their interest ?

That's modern "Elf and safety" for you. In my day, the chemistry lab ceiling bore many a scar to testify that things went wrong. We cheerfully set fire to magnesium, allowed sodium or lithium to dry out and made picric acid to play with. And, of course, we put lit tapers to measuring jars of stoichiometrically-measured hydrogen and oxygen mixtures. Some of us got burns when we weren't careful enough - which quickly teaches you to pay attention.

Oh and bunsen burners are far more fun when connected to the water-tap than a gas-tap.

[Tiny Clanger]

1 minute ago, wulfrun said:

That's modern "Elf and safety" for you. In my day, the chemistry lab ceiling bore many a scar to testify that things went wrong. We cheerfully set fire to magnesium, allowed sodium or lithium to dry out and made picric acid to play with. And, of course, we put lit tapers to measuring jars of stoichiometrically-measured hydrogen and oxygen mixtures. Some of us got burns when we weren't careful enough - which quickly teaches you to pay attention.

Oh and bunsen burners are far more fun when connected to the water-tap than a gas-tap.

He heh , I was quite spectacularly bad at chemistry : we had a teacher who we were told had been 'in industry' , and his teaching style was ramble on for 45 minutes, set off some sort of approximately relevant small explosion, then hand out notes we were to take home, copy the hand out into our books for homework, and return them looking pristine so he could issue them again next year. No questions were to be asked or answered in class.

I got lost early on. I was not the only one, and the concerned parents of some fellow pupils (with expectations of oxbridge) complained : Mr P and his giant pile of handouts vanished silently in the middle of a term, and a young female (trained) teacher appeared in his place. For the rest of the year she was constantly saying things like

 "In the past, this (whatever) would occasionally be done in school as a practical demonstration, but for some time now the law has forbidden it as too dangerous " The inevitable hand went up and the reply was always "Mr P.  did that last term ..."

The only thing I clearly recall was getting to push some blobs of mercury around , not sure why we were issued any of that stuff by Mr P., no doubt it was against the rules too :  there's a good reason why Alice's Mad Hatter was unwell ... Bunsen burner water cannon sounds like fun though 😀

[Tiny Clanger]

1 hour ago, Moonshed said:

Tiny Clanger, you were exactly the type of teacher that kids love. I love science and always have, even before that interest was enhanced by a good science teacher who loved to carry out experiments. This could be as simple as getting two volunteers to come to the front of the class and each be given a thin metal strip to hold, the other ends of which were heated by the ubiquitous Bunsen burner. One would let go very quickly while the other could keep holding it, a fun way to demonstrate the different heat conductivity of different metals, and it sticks in the mind! One of my favourites was taking an empty five gallon can with a small screw cap on the top, I think it was a paraffin can, and putting a little water in and then boiling the water. After a while steam would come out of the filler hole  and after a minute or two, long enough to push most of the air out, the cap was screwed tightly on and the heat turned off. As it cooled It was amazing to watch  the air pressure crush that tin like it was made of paper, a brilliant experiment  demonstrating the air pressure we live in and a vacuum. 
As you say, if an experiment goes wrong that should be used an exciting new project to determine why it didn’t work, so much more can be learnt that way.

We had an ace 'elderly lady' (probably younger than I am now !) as head of physics at my grammar school, she did a perfectly judged , hugely impressive lesson with us where a big block of ice was stood on the front bench , perched on top of, and bridging the gap between, two lab, stools . Below the ice block was a large shallow metal tray to catch the drips. Over the ice block was a wire, each end had a metal mass on it, maybe a 1kg , the masses hung down either side. As teach. explained about pressure and melting point, the wire slowly cut into the block, which refroze behind it . She continued to teach from in front of the bench for the whole lesson. Just a few minutes before the bell went for change of lesson, the masses crashed noisily onto the tray below, the wire having cut all the way through the still whole block , with perfect dramatic timing !

[Moonshed]

17 minutes ago, Tiny Clanger said:

We had an ace 'elderly lady' (probably younger than I am now !) as head of physics at my grammar school, she did a perfectly judged , hugely impressive lesson with us where a big block of ice was stood on the front bench , perched on top of, and bridging the gap between, two lab, stools . Below the ice block was a large shallow metal tray to catch the drips. Over the ice block was a wire, each end had a metal mass on it, maybe a 1kg , the masses hung down either side. As teach. explained about pressure and melting point, the wire slowly cut into the block, which refroze behind it . She continued to teach from in front of the bench for the whole lesson. Just a few minutes before the bell went for change of lesson, the masses crashed noisily onto the tray below, the wire having cut all the way through the still whole block , with perfect dramatic timing !

That is precisely the sort of thing that gets the attention of the whole class, plus as a bonus it employs the use of magic!

[Tiny Clanger]

3 minutes ago, Moonshed said:

That is precisely the sort of thing that gets the attention of the whole class, plus as a bonus it employs the use of magic!

As Arthur C Clarke said ,

“Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic.”     😀

 

[PXR-5]

One of my pet peeves is junky department store scopes.

People buy them and then can't see a thing.

And if they finally see the Moon, the darn mount is too shaky.

 

Go inside and watch TV

Edited December 27, 2020 by PXR-5
Shepelling