Jump to content

sgl_imaging_challenge_banner_31.thumb.jpg.b7a41d6a0fa4e315f57ea3e240acf140.jpg

Recommended Posts

Dear all,

There's probably lots of good information in other topics but I should ask your advice anyways. When I was a youngster I attended astronomy gatherings and from that time I have been somehow in love with astronomy. So I made a decision to get my first telescope. My budget would be somewhere around 250-300EUR tops. My interest is to search for planets and also some good Messier catalog objects (when I am out of town in perfect pitch darkness). In Riga I would hope to see the Moon perfectly. I did some research on telescope types and their pros/cons. I will share with you links of possible purchases (they are Latvian sites so hope you can navigate):

1) https://www.skyhunters.lv/teleskopi/?product_id=23377 

This is Newtonian telescope so I am a little afraid of calibration process but it may be not so bad and easy. If I am correct that this kind of type has better price performance compared to refractors. Meaning, I can see more for cheaper price. 

2)https://www.skyhunters.lv/teleskopi/?product_id=24746

Refractor. No calibration required. But I don't know if this is powerful enough compared to the first one. 

3)https://www.gpspro.lv/products/lv/462/13790/sort/1/filter/0_0_0_0/OMEGON-Reflektora-teleskops-N-130-920-EQ-3-260x-teleskops.html

Another Newtonian. 

 

I would greatly appreciate any info on which to better choose. I'm not good in telescope parameters so maybe you guys could give me some insight between those 3 telescopes. 

Thanks a lot! 

Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi and welcome to SGL,,

The first scope you linked to has a spherical primary, which means that this scope is what is generally referred to as a Bird-Jones telescope. That means that it has a correcting lens at the bottom of the focuser tube. It also means that it is very difficult to collimate.

The 2nd scope you linked to has a small aperture on a very unstable mount.

The 3rd scope appears to be better, slightly, but still not brilliant.

I am not sure how to advise you purchase equipment in Latvia or exactly what equipment is available and prices relative to the UK.

From the info you gave you seem interested in visual, primarily planetary.

The best scope/ value for money generally means a Newtonian/ dobsonian telescope. 
On that basis I would recommend something like this:-

https://www.teleskop-express.de/shop/product_info.php/info/p7222_GSO-Dobsonian-Telescope-150C---6-inch-aperture-with-fine-Crayford-focuser.html
 

Not sure if you can order from TS OPTICS, but they are a known and respected supplier. GSO are a known quantity, very similar to Skywatcher.

You could also try the site sponsor, but you would need to check their delivery options to Latvia. I believe they do delivery to many nations, other than the UK, but that may have changed since I last looked.

Dont worry, there will be plenty other people who will reply - with alternatives. That was my suggestion to meet your requirements and from a trusted supplier - closer to your location.

 

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites

Thanks guys for the reply!

The main reason I want to buy telescope from Latvian sites is that they are offering to pay monthly for the product (and shipping for free). 

There's no rush, so I would like to have common understanding of what's best from telescopes they are offering.

Question: Aperture is one of the most important factors to see deep sky objects? So therefore, Newtonian would be a better choice, right?

I have 4 other candidates. 

1) https://www.gpspro.lv/products/lv/462/13790/sort/1/filter/0_0_0_0/OMEGON-Reflektora-teleskops-N-130-920-EQ-3-260x-teleskops.html

https://www.gpspro.lv/products/lv/462/13778/sort/1/filter/0_0_0_0/OMEGON-Reflektora-teleskops-N-130-920-EQ-2-260x-teleskops.html

The main difference for these looks like mount. EQ-2 and EQ-3.

2) https://www.gpspro.lv/products/lv/462/14686/sort/1/filter/0_0_0_0/SKY-WATCHER-Dobson-Reflektora-teleskops-N-150-1200-Skyliner-Classic-DOB-300X-teleskops.html

Dobsonian 

3) https://www.skyhunters.lv/teleskopi/Ņūtona-Reflektora-Teleskops-Bresser-Pollux-SKY-150-1400-ar-EQ3-Montējumu/

This one looks really promising. Good discount and I even get smart phone adapter! Although there is "catadioptic system (integrated barlow lens)" and not sure if that makes calibration harder. 

Link to post
Share on other sites
38 minutes ago, deThalion said:

This is by far the best option that you have shared. You are right that for DSOs, aperture is key and so unless you have very deep pockets, a Newtonian is the best option. However, in my opinion, a Newtonian is best used on an Alt-Az rather than EQ mount as an EQ mount spins the telescope as it pans across the sky. This means that the focuser and finderscope end up in all sorts of positions and you have to either do contortions to use them, or stop and rotate the tube in its rings for each new object (or both). Of the different Alt-A mounts, the Dobsonian design is both the cheapest and most stable, which makes it a no-brainer to use for large Newtonians. However, there are two things that you should note:

  1. This is a long scope and so you may have issues transporting it to your dark site. It will require use of a car (this also applies to all the EQ-mounted options you have found as well).
  2. Despite the size, it is still quite low to the ground. You will need some sort of height-adjustable chair to sit at to observe. I use a drum stool with my (8") dob.
38 minutes ago, deThalion said:

3) https://www.skyhunters.lv/teleskopi/Ņūtona-Reflektora-Teleskops-Bresser-Pollux-SKY-150-1400-ar-EQ3-Montējumu/

This one looks really promising. Good discount and I even get smart phone adapter! Although there is "catadioptic system (integrated barlow lens)" and not sure if that makes calibration harder. 

The integrated barlow lens means that the primary is a fast spherical mirror and the lens is included in a desperate attempt to get a useable image out of it. This is commonly referred to as a Jones-Bird design. You should avoid this telescope at all costs. 

This differs from telescope 1 in your original post, which is not a Jones-Bird design, as has been previously suggested. The original choice has a real long focal length (indicated by the very long tube) and at high focal ratios, a spherical mirror is acceptable. At low (fast) focal ratios, a parabolic mirror must be used. You should note that despite the fact that the Skywatcher dobsonian you have selected has a slow focal ratio, which could allow use of a spherical mirror, it actually is fitted with a better and more expensive parabolic mirror. 

Edit: I should also add that the 6" f8 newtonian is often referred to as an "APO killer". It is not only good on DSOs, but also on the moon and planets. For your budget you won't get a better telescope, the only consideration I would have would be whether you want to increase your budget and go for the 8" or even 10" version. 

Edited by Ricochet
Link to post
Share on other sites
35 minutes ago, deThalion said:

Thanks guys for the reply!

The main reason I want to buy telescope from Latvian sites is that they are offering to pay monthly for the product (and shipping for free). 

There's no rush, so I would like to have common understanding of what's best from telescopes they are offering.

Question: Aperture is one of the most important factors to see deep sky objects? So therefore, Newtonian would be a better choice, right?

I have 4 other candidates. 

1) https://www.gpspro.lv/products/lv/462/13790/sort/1/filter/0_0_0_0/OMEGON-Reflektora-teleskops-N-130-920-EQ-3-260x-teleskops.html

https://www.gpspro.lv/products/lv/462/13778/sort/1/filter/0_0_0_0/OMEGON-Reflektora-teleskops-N-130-920-EQ-2-260x-teleskops.html

The main difference for these looks like mount. EQ-2 and EQ-3.

2) https://www.gpspro.lv/products/lv/462/14686/sort/1/filter/0_0_0_0/SKY-WATCHER-Dobson-Reflektora-teleskops-N-150-1200-Skyliner-Classic-DOB-300X-teleskops.html

Dobsonian 

3) https://www.skyhunters.lv/teleskopi/Ņūtona-Reflektora-Teleskops-Bresser-Pollux-SKY-150-1400-ar-EQ3-Montējumu/

This one looks really promising. Good discount and I even get smart phone adapter! Although there is "catadioptic system (integrated barlow lens)" and not sure if that makes calibration harder. 

The Bresser is a Bird-Jones model, it has been discussed previously here

The Skyliner is a decent scope, and the dobsonian design gives you great value for money.

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, Ricochet said:

This is by far the best option that you have shared. You are right that for DSOs, aperture is key and so unless you have very deep pockets, a Newtonian is the best option. However, in my opinion, a Newtonian is best used on an Alt-Az rather than EQ mount as an EQ mount spins the telescope as it pans across the sky. This means that the focuser and finderscope end up in all sorts of positions and you have to either do contortions to use them, or stop and rotate the tube in its rings for each new object (or both). Of the different Alt-A mounts, the Dobsonian design is both the cheapest and most stable, which makes it a no-brainer to use for large Newtonians. However, there are two things that you should note:

  1. This is a long scope and so you may have issues transporting it to your dark site. It will require use of a car (this also applies to all the EQ-mounted options you have found as well).
  2. Despite the size, it is still quite low to the ground. You will need some sort of height-adjustable chair to sit at to observe. I use a drum stool with my (8") dob.

 

I do not own a car but my friends does and we would go on a sky hunt together. Not worried so much about transportation. It would even have a nice interior spot in my flat :)

And collimation for DSO should be a no brainer, right? There's probably a lot of video tutorials. 

2 hours ago, Ricochet said:

The integrated barlow lens means that the primary is a fast spherical mirror and the lens is included in a desperate attempt to get a useable image out of it. This is commonly referred to as a Jones-Bird design. You should avoid this telescope at all costs. 

Roger that. 

2 hours ago, Ricochet said:

This differs from telescope 1 in your original post, which is not a Jones-Bird design, as has been previously suggested. The original choice has a real long focal length (indicated by the very long tube) and at high focal ratios, a spherical mirror is acceptable. At low (fast) focal ratios, a parabolic mirror must be used. You should note that despite the fact that the Skywatcher dobsonian you have selected has a slow focal ratio, which could allow use of a spherical mirror, it actually is fitted with a better and more expensive parabolic mirror. 

So my picked dobsonian have better and more expensive mirror. Good to know. 

So given any other telescopes on the Latvian market this one looks like a keeper. 

This probably is better but the cost is little too much:

https://www.gpspro.lv/products/lv/462/13774/sort/1/filter/0_0_0_0/OMEGON-Reflektora-teleskops-X-N-203-1200-400x-teleskops.html

2 hours ago, Ricochet said:

Edit: I should also add that the 6" f8 newtonian is often referred to as an "APO killer". It is not only good on DSOs, but also on the moon and planets. For your budget you won't get a better telescope, the only consideration I would have would be whether you want to increase your budget and go for the 8" or even 10" version. 

Could you enlighten me what is "APO killer"? 

At the moment I should not spend more money since this is my first telescope and I want to get used how to work with a telescope. If curiosity will only grow I'm sure that in the future I could buy 10" version. 

Edited by deThalion
Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, deThalion said:

And collimation for DSO should be a no brainer, right? There's probably a lot of video tutorials. 

Yes, it is really not something to be overly worried about. It might take you a long time the first time you try it, but with a bit of practice it becomes quite easy. An f8 Newtonian is also quite tolerant with regards to collimation. I would advise you to buy a good quality cheshire eyepiece, and to avoid laser collimators (but you can do barlowed laser collimation for the primary if you like).

1 hour ago, deThalion said:

With regards to DSOs, a bigger aperture collects more light so you can see fainter stars and magnify objects more, but the downside is more weight and more cost, and we all have to draw the line somewhere.

1 hour ago, deThalion said:

Could you enlighten me what is "APO killer"? 

An "APO" is an apochromat, a very expensive, optically well corrected refractor that doesn't have chromatic aberration (or rather, it is so small that you don't see it). The APO killer term refers to the idea that the telescope in question produces high contrast images that are similar to these much more expensive scopes. Visual 4" APOs that have become quite fashionable on this forum can be found here and a 6" APO from the same manufacturer can be found here

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites

Dobsonians are great, rather than trying to produce a package of tripod, mount, and telescope at a price point , and making compromises with a flimsy tripod and cheaply made but complicated mount, a dobsonian design puts the telescope on a cheap, heavy, sturdy wooden cradle. So most of your money goes to the telescope itself, and you get a bigger mirror. They are also simple to set up and get used to using.

The downsides are the size of the thing , be sure you appreciate just how tall the telescope is , the size of its base, and the weight. As long as you are confident it won't get in the way indoors, and will be easy for you to carry outside to use, it's a great choice. Collimation is not the nightmare some accounts suggest, as long as you are cautious and careful .

I bought a 150 dob as my first proper telescope 6 months ago, I don't have the space to store a full sized one, so bought a SkyWatcher heritage 150 which closes down to half length, and has a tabletop dobsonian mount. It works very well for me, I'm glad I chose it.

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Tiny Clanger said:

Dobsonians are great, rather than trying to produce a package of tripod, mount, and telescope at a price point , and making compromises with a flimsy tripod and cheaply made but complicated mount, a dobsonian design puts the telescope on a cheap, heavy, sturdy wooden cradle. So most of your money goes to the telescope itself, and you get a bigger mirror. They are also simple to set up and get used to using.

The downsides are the size of the thing , be sure you appreciate just how tall the telescope is , the size of its base, and the weight. As long as you are confident it won't get in the way indoors, and will be easy for you to carry outside to use, it's a great choice. Collimation is not the nightmare some accounts suggest, as long as you are cautious and careful .

I bought a 150 dob as my first proper telescope 6 months ago, I don't have the space to store a full sized one, so bought a SkyWatcher heritage 150 which closes down to half length, and has a tabletop dobsonian mount. It works very well for me, I'm glad I chose it.

Another point for DSO then. 

I have room for it in my flat. The only thing what would be a little problematic is to watch something out of my window (4th floor) but I think I can manage something to have it at the needed height to gaze outside my window. 

Link to post
Share on other sites
6 minutes ago, deThalion said:

Another point for DSO then. 

I have room for it in my flat. The only thing what would be a little problematic is to watch something out of my window (4th floor) but I think I can manage something to have it at the needed height to gaze outside my window. 

Ah ! Oh dear.

The problems you will encounter when observing out of an upstairs window have been thoroughly explained very recently here :

https://stargazerslounge.com/topic/367504-bedroom-astronomy/

I'll leave you to read those pages of reasons why it's a bad idea . If you have a good sized balcony, that might work, but the dob. tube might make it difficult to work around the angles you need to be at. If there's a garden or a park you can use, you might want to reconsider and think about something portable ...

Heather

 

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites

From my Latvian space forum colleagues someone recommended this one. And to be honest, DSO looks like just too big. Maybe it's not a bad idea to start with this one? Surely, I will not get as good hunts as with DSO but at least I could more easily gaze into sky from my window. 

https://www.gpspro.lv/products/lv/462/13324/sort/1/filter/0_0_0_0/BRESSER-MESSIER-AR-90-900-NANO-AZ-20x-180x-teleskops.html

DSO is still a choice and I just need to make a decision. 

Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

We have placed cookies on your device to help make this website better. You can adjust your cookie settings, otherwise we'll assume you're okay to continue. By using this site, you agree to our Terms of Use.