First light with Bresser 10" Dobsonian

[orions_boot]

27 minutes ago, HollyHound said:

I had issues with focus until I used the supplied extension tube on the focuser. Does the Barlow significantly affect focussing distance I wonder ?

I am using the extension tube and as I say the Barlow works with the plossl so I don't understand it.  

[HollyHound]

Having struggled with the original finder supplied with the Bresser, I've upgraded as planned and fitted a 9x50 RACI finder and TelRad (on riser). Initial calibration and testing in daylight proved to be much more successful and comfortable with these finders in place and would expect to make a huge difference in usability at night 🤞

I was going to try the Rigel Quickfinder, but I think the TelRad on a riser works better for this scope, and I'd read it had issues sticking properly... that means I can fit the Rigel to my StellaMira or C5 🤔

Thanks to @johninderby again for the tip on swapping out the finder shoe for a Baader one, which I had on my ST80 doing nothing.

I prefer the 9x50 RACI on the lower/side shoe because I can quickly and comfortably move between this and the eyepiece in one simple movement 😃

I had to move the tube back an inch or so to make it balanced, but it's really smooth in operation and stays exactly where you put it at any angle... this is a very well engineered scope/mount 👍

Edited November 7, 2020 by HollyHound

[johninderby]

Are you going to rotate the focuser to about a 45 degree angle? Just loosen the four tiny hex screws in the focuser baseplate. 🙂

[HollyHound]

5 minutes ago, johninderby said:

Are you going to rotate the focuser to about a 45 degree angle? Just loosen the four tiny hex screws in the focuser baseplate. 🙂

Oh I did read that somewhere, and makes sense... will give it a go, thanks 👍

Also the fine focuser knob arrived today, so do that tomorrow at the same time 😃

[orions_boot]

@HollyHound have you had much observing time yet? 

This morning I tried out the sun filter and could see the current major sunspot 2781 using the included plossl.

This evening I had mars upto 360x mag making out the ice cap which is simply amazing.  This is with the Hyperion zoom and Barlow.  

I am using the Rigel quick finder which is taking some getting used to how it correlates to the EP view.  Managed to find M33 which looked best in the Aero 35mm and didn't gain anything from zooming in.  I then spent 30 mins trying to find andromeda before my back gave in.  Couldn't even find it with binoculars which is unusual so not sure whats going on.

 

 

[HollyHound]

41 minutes ago, orions_boot said:

@HollyHound have you had much observing time yet? 

This morning I tried out the sun filter and could see the current major sunspot 2781 using the included plossl.

This evening I had mars upto 360x mag making out the ice cap which is simply amazing.  This is with the Hyperion zoom and Barlow.  

I am using the Rigel quick finder which is taking some getting used to how it correlates to the EP view.  Managed to find M33 which looked best in the Aero 35mm and didn't gain anything from zooming in.  I then spent 30 mins trying to find andromeda before my back gave in.  Couldn't even find it with binoculars which is unusual so not sure whats going on.

 

 

Hi,

Not since Thursday night, been cloudy here. Got a few hours on Thursday and was very impressed 😊

I had Mars up to 211x (6mm ortho) and was very good, so am looking forward to trying 300x or higher next time. 

As shown in the post above, I’ve now fitted TelRad and RACI finders, so should be able to move around more easily next time, which will help a lot. 

Im looking forward to working through Messier objects and seeing how much of an improvement I can see over my current scopes.

I have the same eyepieces... Hyperion Zoom and Barlow, Aero 35mm... the latter was great for wide views. I found that M42 was excellent through this, but then detail improved going down through Panoptic 24mm, DeLite 18.2mm and finally was superb in DeLite 13mm.

I’m also really impressed how quickly this thing can be carried out (in two parts) and setup, ready to go. Didn’t expect it to be quite so “grab and go”... well “lug and go”.

Good luck with some more clear skies and lots of observing 👍

Cheers

Gary

Edited November 7, 2020 by HollyHound

[HollyHound]

22 hours ago, orions_boot said:

@HollyHound have you had much observing time yet? 

This morning I tried out the sun filter and could see the current major sunspot 2781 using the included plossl.

This evening I had mars upto 360x mag making out the ice cap which is simply amazing.  This is with the Hyperion zoom and Barlow.  

I am using the Rigel quick finder which is taking some getting used to how it correlates to the EP view.  Managed to find M33 which looked best in the Aero 35mm and didn't gain anything from zooming in.  I then spent 30 mins trying to find andromeda before my back gave in.  Couldn't even find it with binoculars which is unusual so not sure whats going on.

 

 

Thanks, I didn't even realise this came with a sun filter, until I read this and went hunting back in the box... I thought the box it was in was just packing 🤣

Something new to try... will read up on the method and safety first, as never observed the sun 😬

[Dantooine]

15 minutes ago, HollyHound said:

Thanks, I didn't even realise this came with a sun filter, until I read this and went hunting back in the box... I thought the box it was in was just packing 🤣

Something new to try... will read up on the method and safety first, as never observed the sun 😬

The idea of looking at the sun through a telescope frightens me 😱

[Paz]

On 07/11/2020 at 18:10, HollyHound said:

Having struggled with the original finder supplied with the Bresser, I've upgraded as planned and fitted a 9x50 RACI finder and TelRad (on riser). Initial calibration and testing in daylight proved to be much more successful and comfortable with these finders in place and would expect to make a huge difference in usability at night 🤞

I was going to try the Rigel Quickfinder, but I think the TelRad on a riser works better for this scope, and I'd read it had issues sticking properly... that means I can fit the Rigel to my StellaMira or C5 🤔

Thanks to @johninderby again for the tip on swapping out the finder shoe for a Baader one, which I had on my ST80 doing nothing.

I prefer the 9x50 RACI on the lower/side shoe because I can quickly and comfortably move between this and the eyepiece in one simple movement 😃

I had to move the tube back an inch or so to make it balanced, but it's really smooth in operation and stays exactly where you put it at any angle... this is a very well engineered scope/mount 👍

 

That's a nice looking scope and a nice set up.

If you have an observing chair it is worth trying it with the tube rotated so that the eyepiece is pointing almost straight out sideways at whatever angle allows your neck/head to be at its most natural angle when looking forwards (mine is slightly above horizontal so that I am looking very slightly down). I find this makes it easier to concentrate for longer periods and it also brings the weight of the eyepiece closer to the centre so the balance of the ota doesn't change so much as the altitude is changed (but I can see it would rotate your RACI finder perhaps beyond where it would be accessible).

On the topic of balance I originally had a 2" riser for my Telrad but it made quite a difference to how the weight of the Telrad affected the balance of the scope at different altitudes so in the end I went back to having no riser.

[Stu]

17 minutes ago, Dantooine said:

The idea of looking at the sun through a telescope frightens me 😱

Well worth doing, providing you are methodical and know what you are doing. Mainly just about checking the filter is ok each time and ensuring it is securely fitted and can’t blow or fall off. Cover up or remove any finders/Telrads too. A 10” dob is not necessarily the most obvious choice for a solar scope but I’m sure it would give decent views.

[HollyHound]

7 minutes ago, Paz said:

That's a nice looking scope and a nice set up.

If you have an observing chair it is worth trying it with the tube rotated so that the eyepiece is pointing almost straight out sideways at whatever angle allows your neck/head to be at its most natural angle when looking forwards (mine is slightly above horizontal so that I am looking very slightly down). I find this makes it easier to concentrate for longer periods and it also brings the weight of the eyepiece closer to the centre so the balance of the ota doesn't change so much as the altitude is changed (but I can see it would rotate your RACI finder perhaps beyond where it would be accessible).

On the topic of balance I originally had a 2" riser for my Telrad but it made quite a difference to how the weight of the Telrad affected the balance of the scope at different altitudes so in the end I went back to having no riser.

Thanks 😊

I’ve actually just ordered a Berlebach observing chair (this one... https://www.firstlightoptics.com/astronomy-observing-chairs/berlebach-nix-ii-observers-chair.html), so that I can adjust the observing position easily, as my guitar stool is fixed at quite a high level. It would make the current position for the RACI finder awkward, but I have another Baader finder shoe, so could move the RACI to the top position quite easily. Once the chair arrives, I’ll give it a go. I’m getting to an age now where I would prefer to be as comfortable, relaxed as possible and not putting my back into strange positions 👍

Likewise, I’ll experiment with and without the riser... if I can get my eye close enough to the tube comfortably then the riser becomes superfluous.

Cheers, Gary

[Matt01]

18 hours ago, HollyHound said:

Likewise, I’ll experiment with and without the riser... if I can get my eye close enough to the tube comfortably then the riser becomes superfluous.

Let me know how you get on with the riser... If it works well I might consider buying one.

Also as a side note, does anybody here know of a cheap way to prevent dew on my telrad... most time i've have is about 10 minutes before its completly dewed up.

It may just be down to the conditions... half an hour later it was completly foggy.

[HollyHound]

4 minutes ago, Matt01 said:

Let me know how you get on with the riser... If it works well I might consider buying one.

Also as a side note, does anybody here know of a cheap way to prevent dew on my telrad... most time i've have is about 10 minutes before its completly dewed up.

It may just be down to the conditions... half an hour later it was completly foggy.

I find the riser does help with alignment and eye position behind the Telrad, but will also try without one night and see which works better.

I've purchased one of these... https://www.firstlightoptics.com/telegizmos-telescope-covers/telegizmos_tgds.html, so will see if it helps, once I can get some clear skies again of course 🤞

There are also heaters and a little folding dew shield available... others will no doubt chip in with suggestions...

Edited November 9, 2020 by HollyHound

[johninderby]

I tried the 4” riser and found it too tall. The 2” riser is just right I find. Without any riser it’s just a bit too close to the tube.

 

Edited November 9, 2020 by johninderby

[HollyHound]

34 minutes ago, johninderby said:

I tried the 4” riser and found it too tall. The 2” riser is just right I find. Without any riser it’s just a bit too close to the tube.

I order another Rigel Quickfinder and TelRad, so I have a decent RDF for all my scopes, and as the Rigel comes with two baseplates (one for 5" radius and another for 10" radius), I'm going to mount a spare baseplate next to the TelRad and have a go with both, see which I prefer. I've always liked the TelRad but the Rigel seems decent too.

Might look for a 2" riser too and swap it around, to see which works best if I end up preferring the TelRad 👍

[johninderby]

The Rigel seems to be a bit of a Marmite thing. Some love them but some find them awkward to use. I personaly find the Telrad is so easy to use whereas with the Rigel ypu have to have your eye in just the right position. 

[AdeKing]

18 minutes ago, johninderby said:

The Rigel seems to be a bit of a Marmite thing. Some love them but some find them awkward to use. I personaly find the Telrad is so easy to use whereas with the Rigel ypu have to have your eye in just the right position. 

I use both and do find the Telrad slightly easier to get the sight line correct to see the rings.

However, as most of my OTAs are Fracs and don't have as much space available along the OTA as a Newt does, I use the Rigel on my Fracs as it's smaller and neater.

Both are however very effective and are easier to star hop with than a simple RDF.

[HollyHound]

30 minutes ago, AdeKing said:

I use both and do find the Telrad slightly easier to get the sight line correct to see the rings.

However, as most of my OTAs are Fracs and don't have as much space available along the OTA as a Newt does, I use the Rigel on my Fracs as it's smaller and neater.

Both are however very effective and are easier to star hop with than a simple RDF.

That’s my plan... I’ve put one Rigel on my C5, as the tube is too short to take TelRad easily, and put the other (possibly) on my StellaMira, as that currently doesn’t have an RDF.

I will try the Rigel on the Bresser though, suspect the TelRad will win... it certainly worked well in testing last week 👍

[Pixies]

8 hours ago, Matt01 said:

Let me know how you get on with the riser... If it works well I might consider buying one.

Also as a side note, does anybody here know of a cheap way to prevent dew on my telrad... most time i've have is about 10 minutes before its completly dewed up.

It may just be down to the conditions... half an hour later it was completly foggy.

 

If you're a DIY type, here's:

 

[Luke]

Congrats and nice write-up! My 10 inch dob (GSO) is a really convenient scope. Easy to pop out, no big dew issues with the solid tube. It for me is close to the perfect low-hassle dob. We sold our 16 inch dob, alas, which was very nice optically but I had a nasty knee injury and the thing was so heavy to move around! The 10 is a breeze to move. I still wonder about a 12 or maybe a lighter 14 inch fast Orion Optics UK scope as as compromise between weight and aperture / maybe to pair with a 10 inch. My only gripe with the GSO is that I feel like the optics are not quite as good as the skywatcher dobs I have used. The base itself is sweet.

[HollyHound]

2 hours ago, Luke said:

Congrats and nice write-up! My 10 inch dob (GSO) is a really convenient scope. Easy to pop out, no big dew issues with the solid tube. It for me is close to the perfect low-hassle dob. We sold our 16 inch dob, alas, which was very nice optically but I had a nasty knee injury and the thing was so heavy to move around! The 10 is a breeze to move. I still wonder about a 12 or maybe a lighter 14 inch fast Orion Optics UK scope as as compromise between weight and aperture / maybe to pair with a 10 inch. My only gripe with the GSO is that I feel like the optics are not quite as good as the skywatcher dobs I have used. The base itself is sweet.

Thanks. Yes, I'm surprised how really easy and quick it was to move this dob from the house to the patio... move base, followed by OTA and that's it, ready to  observe.

It's much quicker than setting up my iOptron AZ Mount Pro on its TriPier... however, I do now have plans for that as an EEVA system... more to follow sometime soon.

This dob and my Mak127 or StellaMira on the Scopetech/Report are now my grab and go systems, and I never thought I'd say that about a dob 🤣

Edited November 10, 2020 by HollyHound

[Ships and Stars]

Great report, I love to read when someone gets their first views through a decent sized reflector, can't go wrong with a 10" dob! 

[HollyHound]

8 hours ago, Ships and Stars said:

Great report, I love to read when someone gets their first views through a decent sized reflector, can't go wrong with a 10" dob! 

Thanks. I was quite literally gobsmacked with the view, such a huge step up in light gathering ability and I was also very surprised how easy and quick it is to setup and pack away again... so I really do see this getting an awful lot of use 😃

On that basis, I've pushed the boat out slightly and ordered a bunch of new eyepieces, which should maximise it's effectiveness too 👍

[HollyHound]

Well finally yesterday as it was just starting to get dark, the sky cleared and moved the Bresser back out again (took 2mins) for its "second light".

Since I got it two weeks ago, and was fortunate to get first light the night of its arrival, I've made some changes (including some recommendations from other forum members)...

• I've changed one of the finder brackets for a Baader bracket (Synta type) and fitted my 9x50 RACI finder... much more intuitive  to use when moving around the sky. I've put this currently under the eyepiece, but am going to fit another bracket on the top and will likely move the finder up there, but for now this works and also doubles as a handle!
• Fitted a Telrad finder on a 4" riser... this allows initial positioning and the riser means I don't have to my face flat against the scope tube.
• Focuser has been upgraded with the Bresser 1:10 fine focuser knob... bit fiddly to fit but well worth it.
• Rotated the focuser through 45 degrees (as recommended by others) to improve usability.
• Replaced the supplied extension tube, with a Baader 2" Clicklock which maintains a similar amount of extension and makes eyepiece swapping so much easier. The standard three screw with compression ring is perfectly good, but I've got used to ClickLock adaptors on other scopes. I've also added a 2" to 1.25" Clicklock adaptor as well.
• Mounted a small foam block inside the mount base unit, as I found that the tube kept banging into the base when moved back to vertical for storage and didn't want to tempt fate with alignment/collimation.

I'd bought a collimation cap and Cheshire eyepiece, so following some online instructions, gave the collimation a quick once over. It's pretty close as delivered, so didn't adjust, but I will spend a bit of time learning the process and checking it regularly.

Around 6pm, Jupiter, Saturn and Mars were all visible, although fairly low in the sky. Having quickly setup, popped the Pentax XW10 (127x) in and had a look.

It was very easy locating Jupiter with the Telrad and RACI compared to the original supplied 9x30 finder and the required only a minor tweak to calibrate them (after my daytime calibration a few days ago). Jupiter gave a reasonable view and bands were visible, but also some colour fringing most likely due to it being placed quite low and thus subject to atmospheric effects. Saturn was significantly better with both the XW10 and the XW7 (187x), quite sharp (given the low placing) and (I think) a "shadow" visible on the ring. Mars was quickly located and being a bit higher, gave a nice view, hint of polar ice cap and dark markings as expected with the same eyepieces. 

I wouldn't say the view was massively better than my Mak127 to 80mm ED f/10 but given the time/position, still very pleasing. I'm learning to live with the diffraction spikes on planets and bright stars, but still think my other scopes will be used more for planetary observation, but will revisit again next year when they're higher again. Although the moon was too low by now to observe, my first night gave me awesome views of the moon, so I think this scope has lots to offer there alongside the others.

I left it outside for a few hours and was waiting for Orion to appear, so popped back out around 10:45. It was getting a little windy and cloud was coming in, M42 was still just behind the trees, but I had enough time to observe Pleiades and M31.

Swapped in the Pentax XW30 and had look at Pleiades... stunning view, really fantastic, absolutely blown away by the number of stars visible and it was framed almost perfectly with this eyepiece. These Pentax eyepieces are really good, relaxing view (love the adjustable eyecup) and sharp to (almost) the edge of view. I spent a few minutes just cruising around the stars with this eyepiece and it was almost literally a "big bucket of stars" 😃

Finally swung up to M31 and there it was, immediately visible, with the expected elongated oval shape, but this time it extended much further and more was visible without resorting to averted vision. I'd first seen this back in January in my Mak102 and since in ST120, 80mm and Mak127, in all those scopes it was good, but really just a "smudge" of grey. Last night I saw much more shape and brighter too... of course it's still not "Hubble" like or any of the really good astrophotograpy images, but it was a completely different experience to any of the other scopes... just like M42 was on the first night. It's companion galaxy (M110) was also very visible as a bright grey shape, whereas I'd previously struggled to see that as anything more than a "hint".

The clouds rolled in at this point, so M42 and others will have to wait for next time, but all very impressive and confirms (for me) that as a "visual" scope, this 10" dob is fantastic. I remain impressed as to how easy it was to track objects, even at those higher magnifications, seems quite intuitive to gently push or pull the scope to keep things moving across the frame of view as required. With the XW40, even that wasn't necessary, as I could just it drift very slowly across the view and then make a small correction every 20/30 secs 👍

One issue I did encounter, was that (of course) the Pentax XW30 is quite a bit heavier than all my other eyepieces and so the dob became nose heavy when lowered to around 40 degrees. I solved this by dropping a small beanbag on the tail of the OTA, but I've now ordered a magnetic counterweight. I did try moving the tube in the rings, but given it's such a small change required really, the counterweight should address this more elegantly.

In addition, this was the first time using my new Berlebach NIX II Observers chair... this made a massive difference in terms of comfort, as I'd previously been using a guitar stool (non adjustable) and then bending over the eyepiece or moving the chair away to compensate for eyepiece height on all my scopes. Being able to quickly raise/lower the seat and then sit with an (almost) straight back, was not only more comfortable but meant observing was just more relaxed. Long term, I suspect this will also ease any back issues, something to consider as I'm edging into the middle 50s now 😬

The scope also was packed away again, quicker than my iOptron AZ setup and almost as quick as the "grab and go" scope, which still amazes me. It now lives near the back door in the coolest part of the house, so can be outside and ready to go in minutes.

I had planned on attempting to put this OTA on my iOptron, even bought a dovetail for it, but that's not happening now... firstly, it's too heavy (and will likely be unwieldy) and secondly, I like the Dobsonian system and am happy to keep learning how to use it to get round the sky.

I'm also very impressed with the Pentax XWs, these are definite keepers for this scope and I suspect will be great for the StellaMira and Mak too, except possibly the XW30, which is quite chunky. Test that next time...

I read about dobs back last Christmas and dismissed them as looking a bit unwieldy and clunky, even though everyone said they are the best "bang for buck". I am now firmly in that camp and will now be bringing this scope out for pretty much anything deep sky and some lunar. Still favour the Mak and StellaMira for planetary and lunar too, but will have the Bresser out much more than I initially thought I would 😃

Thanks again to all for their advise and suggestions 👍

Gary 

Edited November 19, 2020 by HollyHound
Spelling

[cloudsweeper]

Good report Gary.

(Mid-50s?  Just a kid then!  😉)

Doug.