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badhex

The Ring under Bortle 8 skies through an 80ed?

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Hello all

Having recently got back to astronomy after a long break, I'm mostly spending time looking for DSOs, clusters etc. with my SW Evostar 80ed.

In the past I have managed to resolve the ring (but not the central star) through a Skymax 102 under admittedly darker skies (class 5 IIRC, from a country park with no pesky street lamps), but I'm not having any luck with the 80ed from my current class 8 location. 

I've been using a 30mm to hunt down the patch of sky, and at higher mags I've tried averted vision and a (cheap IIRC - Kood) sky-glow filter amongst other things, but still no dice. 

I can pick up M13 as a grey smudge, so I feel like I should be able to at least resolve M57 as a fuzzy ball - am I asking a bit too much? 

 

Thanks all! 

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I live under Bortle 6 skies, though I suspect it may be a 7 or 8 . I use an 8 inch reflector so a reasonable aperture for faint objects. Last week I observed M57, the best view was with the 9mm Morpheus (x111 mag) with a UHC filter. With averted vision I could see a Smokey ring but it didn’t jump out at me, it still required a bit of work to get a good look so I’m not surprised you’re finding it difficult 

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Decent target here under bortle 5 skies. My 100mm scopes and up show the mag 13 star off to one side of it as well. Needs medium to high magnifications to make it stand out. 250x in the 12 inch dob is V.nice indeed :smiley:

 

 

m57stars.png

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I too observe mostly from Bortle 8 skies.  I'd say that M13 is much easier than M57.  I think part of the problem is that M57 is so small, so (unless you have goto) it needs more magnification to identify, but then it's harder to find.  It's a faint smudge in my C8, and  I think an 80ED would be pushing it,

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Thanks all. 

As you have all said the main problem might just be magnification vs. light loss. I must admit that I was also finding it very challenging last night once I changed EPs, even to confirm I was moving in the right direction when star hopping, so there's probably a reasonable dash of user error and super bright moon thrown in.

Perhaps I was just very lucky when I got it before on the skymax. I think it was in my 9mm HD60 which would have given me nearly 150x, which is a struggle in the 80ED. 

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3 hours ago, John said:

Needs medium to high magnifications to make it stand out. 250x in the 12 inch dob is V.nice indeed :smiley:

Very jealous! Maybe I'll just go crazy and buy a C11 :D

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1 hour ago, badhex said:

Very jealous! Maybe I'll just go crazy and buy a C11 :D

Maybe the ED80 just hasn't the aperture to punch through the light pollution? Keep trying though. Living under Bortle 8 skies, M57 is one of my favourite objects & one of the first DSO targets I use to test a new telescope. It's been viewed using a Skymax 102, Startravel 120, Explorer 130p, Star Discovery 150i and Skyliner 200p. The central star isn't resolved, but the ring is clearly defined in all the aforementioned instruments at around 125x. Max mag I've managed to keep the ring sharp is around 180- 200x. On a moonlit night forget it, but any other clear night it's not a problem to find.

 

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6 hours ago, ScouseSpaceCadet said:

Maybe the ED80 just hasn't the aperture to punch through the light pollution? Keep trying though. Living under Bortle 8 skies, M57 is one of my favourite objects & one of the first DSO targets I use to test a new telescope. 

Yeah, this is kinda my thinking. I'm determined now, so I will report back once I've nailed it! It's clouds from here on in for a while, but I'm using the cloud cover as an excuse to probably upgrade my somewhat unidentified EQ-??? mount which struggles with the ED80, to something much sturdier with tracking/goto.
This will also mean that if star hopping is failing me, I can fall back on the goto.

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I certainly don't think you are asking too much. M57 should be an easy target in an 80mm scope. It was one of the first DSO's I ever observed many years ago with a little 90mm newt. It also takes relatively high magnification as its very well defined. I also find it easy in a pair of 20x80 bino's though it takes a tripod to show it. 

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2 hours ago, skyhog said:

I certainly don't think you are asking too much. M57 should be an easy target in an 80mm scope. It was one of the first DSO's I ever observed many years ago with a little 90mm newt. It also takes relatively high magnification as its very well defined. I also find it easy in a pair of 20x80 bino's though it takes a tripod to show it. 

Thanks! My general feeling was that it should be possible. I'm still sadly waiting for cloud cover to break so I think I'm doubting myself just because I'm a little rusty and I can't go and check!

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Yes, weather has been pretty poor over the last few days. The great thing about the ring is that it remains well placed right into late autumn. Plenty of time to remove that rust... 😉

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Still no joy on this but very limited opportunities to keep trying. I am resolved to resolve it eventually! 

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I am sure you can see M57 under Bortle 8. I saw it from my backyard with a 102/500 refractor, also on a Bortle 8. 

The best way is to use a red dot finder and put it exactly between gamma and beta lyr. gamma and beta is visible from B8. 

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I think partly it's that once I'm at high enough mags to resolve it, I'm just missing it. I don't have an RDF but will ll maybe try your trick with very low power EP and report back. 

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Here's another challenge Joe.

I find M57 easy enough from home, and i'm in a Bortle 7 area. Being very high up at this time of the year always helps.

But see if you can spot M1 : the crab nebula.

Try as i might, i've never been able to locate it from home, even when i used to have a 12" Newtonian.

Is it my 53 year old eyes stopping me from seeing it ? 🧐

I think its more to do with the fact it has quite a low surface brightness, and my light pollution from home simply washes it away making it invisible.

Yet from a darker sky (Bortle 4) i've seen it easily with a pair of 15x50 binocs.

 

 

 

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Despite it's fame, the Crab Nebula is rather underwhelming unless viewed with a really large aperture scope from a really dark site.

A UHC filter helps a little with this one. I can just start to see a little of the filamentary structure across the nebula's surface with my 12 inch scope and a good UHC filter on a dark night here. 

Through my smaller aperture scopes M1 is generally rather featureless, vaguely oval shaped, patch of light.

It's a difficult one to show folks at outreach events whereas the Ring Nebula is quite a strongly contrasted object which actually does look like it's name suggests.

 

 

Edited by John

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Thanks both. Actually, once upon a time I tried my hand at keeping Perisesarma bidens - or the Red Clawed crab. I had two, and called them Pulsar and Nebula after the eponymous celestial objects. From what it sounds like, spotting the nebula is as hard as keeping them!

 

 image.thumb.png.0bf5452919ba15f20be154734012b42a.png

 

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