Award winning photograph of Andromeda

[Rusted]

Do you suppose that the judges were desperately trying to be "inclusive?"

If art is the absolute proof that time is running backwards, then what is astro art?
That which redefines deliberate optical aberration as [pseudo] science?

The image in question is a kick in the teeth for every skilled imager who did not win.
It shrieks that "bad" astro photography is now "good" astro photography. So cue the copy cats! 
Artistic coma anyone? Astigmatism with extra sauce? Jack-booting ImPPG to produce a "nice bit of grain?"

Well, now we can all relax and start posting the sort of astro smudges for which I can claim some infamy.
Am I now [by the standards of this "artee-phartee" competition winner] the finest solar imager the world has ever seen?
I think not.

Alexandra Hart achieved a result so far in advance of my own daubs that she must be using alien technology.
Or, is the real truth that she is so skilled and well practised in her "art" that she leaves everyone else gasping in astonishment?
It takes the professionals hundreds of millions and a mountain top to achieve that degree of clarity! 
Perhaps Alexandra should have added some "dust bunnies" to ensure a [more] worthy First Prize Winner? 

[Captain Scarlet]

45 minutes ago, ollypenrice said:

Beautiful draughtsman. She doesn't contain socks!

😁lly

In a different context I would’ve used the word “artist” but obviously that’s not suitable here. Draughtsman is not the right word for her though, it implies too much precision. Her works are very untidy and often large. Looked at close up they can look like nothing. But step back and the face (for that’s what she often paints) snaps into instantly recognizable focus.

[adyj1]

1 hour ago, carastro said:

It appears to me that Astrophotographers can ignore all their hard work over the years learning their craft, making accurate, focussed, beautiful and detailed images and just contribute an image that they did when they first started, give it a gimmick and win a prestigious prize.

Carole 

 

It appears to me that if things keep going in this direction I'm closer to what will be considered a 'good' astrophotograph than I ever thought 😂 

(and I agree wholeheartedly with your point of view) 

The weird thing is that I can accept the 'prison' photo being given an award, even with what we would consider normally to be faults, because the finalists of this competition will receive massive 'general public' awareness, and so the impact of the new satellites can now be appreciated more by the non-astro community. And they'll think the halo around the star looks cool. But the macro-like illusion presented by the winner that suggests there are stars in front of andromeda as well as behind seems a step too far. 

Edited September 11, 2020 by adyj1
Typo

[ollypenrice]

26 minutes ago, Captain Magenta said:

In a different context I would’ve used the word “artist” but obviously that’s not suitable here. Draughtsman is not the right word for her though, it implies too much precision. Her works are very untidy and often large. Looked at close up they can look like nothing. But step back and the face (for that’s what she often paints) snaps into instantly recognizable focus.

No, the term draughtsman predates the engineering use of the term and is, I insist, the right one. It is precisely the term you were looking for when you said, 'Drawer' (which does not exist) and is widely used in art history to describe artists like Leonardo da Vinci. My mother, who didn't have an engineering bone in her body, was a truly fine draughtsman. The term is not limited, in any way whatever, to what we might call 'technical drawing.' That is just one (and very recent) branch of draughtsmanship. At the other extreme a satirical cartoonist might be considered a great draughtsman. (Many are.)

Olly

[Captain Scarlet]

21 minutes ago, ollypenrice said:

No, the term draughtsman predates the engineering use of the term and is, I insist, the right one...

I will look into the word further, I won’t be able to resist, but given your insistence I’m persuaded you are right. So thank you, I reckon I’ve learned something.

Magnus

[ollypenrice]

Just now, Captain Magenta said:

I will look into the word further, I won’t be able to resist, but given your insistence I’m persuaded you are right. So thank you, I reckon I’ve learned something.

Magnus

Consider it a compliment to you wife!

😁lly

 

[ollypenrice]

Lest we forget, 'art' looks like this:

Olly

[tomato]

It does absolutely nothing for me. When I read that a device had been 3D printed to tilt the camera I just thought what a waste of printing materials.

If you want a 3D impression of M31, take a look at this:

 

[andrew s]

Unfortunately, so is this...

Regards Andrew

[ollypenrice]

5 minutes ago, andrew s said:

Unfortunately, so is this...

Regards Andrew

😁 Yes, but not in my house. I can do nothing to stop E equaling MC squared in my house but I can stop that from being art. However, I have something not dissimilar here in which I pass my critical judgement on a more or less daily basis...

😮lly

 

[Avdhoeven]

Bad thing is that it is even not original at all. It's just a copy of an earlier idea  I really think the judges should reconsider their decision...

Just look here (from 2013)

and here

https://petapixel.com/2013/12/18/tilt-shift-effect-applied-photographs-cosmos-create-tiny-universe/?fbclid=IwAR3mPah3q5BOq4i8f7ntXuZJ5ES_NeoLQ07jX8Zz9mwnmN0jOmQIGMnYVwU

or here:

https://imgur.com/a/yZcOB 

 

Btw, this is 2 minutes of photoshop work:

Edited September 11, 2020 by Avdhoeven

[ollypenrice]

4 minutes ago, Avdhoeven said:

Bad thing is that it is even not original at all. It's just a copy of an earlier idea  I really think the judges should reconsider their decision...

Just look here (from 2013)

and here

https://petapixel.com/2013/12/18/tilt-shift-effect-applied-photographs-cosmos-create-tiny-universe/?fbclid=IwAR3mPah3q5BOq4i8f7ntXuZJ5ES_NeoLQ07jX8Zz9mwnmN0jOmQIGMnYVwU

or here:

https://imgur.com/a/yZcOB 

That's crap as well!

So, hey, their competition title says, in effect, WE decide who is the astrophotographer of the year. Well, listen up guys,  you don't.

Olly

Edited September 11, 2020 by ollypenrice

[Hawksmoor]

Whether in sport, entertainment, the arts or in this case astro-imaging, competitions are much loved by the public.  Conversely, winning entries or performances are often unpopular.  I have to say that this year, what with all the Covid 19 malarkey, I had totally forgotten about the Insight Competition. Noticing this thread, I thought to myself, better check out the winner.

Well, on a positive note, the winning entry has helped me to convince my long suffering wife that the money and the nights I have spent in equal measure, have not been a complete waste of resources.  If any of you have looked at some of my imaging efforts you might well appreciate any assistance in this area is much appreciated.

In my defence, I should like to point out that I have never had to 3d print or otherwise make, any special connector to hold my camera at a weird angle to my scope.  With dyspraxia and failing eyesight, I find this is quite easy to achieve 'freehand' in complete and utter darkness.   

On a less positive note I do take exception to the use of the term 'art' as a collective noun in any field of endeavour for something that stands out from the rest only because it is different.  Diversity in my book is a wonderful feature of  competitions, art and life in general,  I am less enamoured of perversity.  Most artists I know, whether working in the abstract or reality , graft hard  over long periods of time to acquire  real 'draughtsman skills' and  investigate complex intellectual ideas.  Sticking a catchy 'strap line' on a dodgy sketch does not make it a work of art.  In my book, a blurry photo is a blurry photo and I should know as I have albums full of blurry photos! 😉

George 'outraged' artist of Lowestoft

[tomato]

17 minutes ago, Avdhoeven said:

Bad thing is that it is even not original at all. It's just a copy of an earlier idea  I really think the judges should reconsider their decision...

Just look here (from 2013)

and here

https://petapixel.com/2013/12/18/tilt-shift-effect-applied-photographs-cosmos-create-tiny-universe/?fbclid=IwAR3mPah3q5BOq4i8f7ntXuZJ5ES_NeoLQ07jX8Zz9mwnmN0jOmQIGMnYVwU

or here:

https://imgur.com/a/yZcOB 

 

Btw, this is 2 minutes of photoshop work:

Wow, is that the winner's original M31 data? I take it all back...😜

[tooth_dr]

26 minutes ago, Avdhoeven said:

Bad thing is that it is even not original at all. It's just a copy of an earlier idea  I really think the judges should reconsider their decision...

Just look here (from 2013)

and here

https://petapixel.com/2013/12/18/tilt-shift-effect-applied-photographs-cosmos-create-tiny-universe/?fbclid=IwAR3mPah3q5BOq4i8f7ntXuZJ5ES_NeoLQ07jX8Zz9mwnmN0jOmQIGMnYVwU

or here:

https://imgur.com/a/yZcOB 

 

Btw, this is 2 minutes of photoshop work:

Genuine question. can I ask how you did that. Wouldn’t mind a go. 

[david_taurus83]

Bit of harsh criticism on here? Im sure the author could have produced a more 'traditional' M31 if he wanted but he choose to do something different and he probably enjoyed capturing and producing it..

..and isn't that the whole point?

 

[Avdhoeven]

9 minutes ago, tomato said:

Wow, is that the winner's original M31 data? I take it all back...😜

No, this is my M31 image 😜

[AbsolutelyN]

Give the guy a break please. It may not be everyone's cup of tea but is still a striking image, a creative approach to a familiar subject and an image that will capture the imagination of many people. It's not some beginner image with a Photoshop filter applied, it took skill and creative thought to create the image entirely in camera. Hopefully it will inspire people to learn about astronomy and look up at the sky. Take a look at his website, he's a  deserving winner in my opinion. I love his halo image of Venus. 

 

[Avdhoeven]

Just now, david_taurus83 said:

Bit of harsh criticism on here? Im sure the author could have produced a more 'traditional' M31 if he wanted but he choose to do something different and he probably enjoyed capturing and producing it..

..and isn't that the whole point?

 

He probably had fun. That's not the issue. The issue is that a jury chooses this as astronomy image of the year... 

[carastro]

Has any-one taken a look at the list of Judges.  I was wondering what qualifications they had to choose such an image.

There is only 1 on a panel of 10 who is likely to have a clue about Astrophotography.   

For goodness sake, an Astrophotography competition should have people who know what AP is all about,

https://www.rmg.co.uk/royal-observatory/insight-astronomy-photographer-year/competition/judges

 

[Avdhoeven]

9 minutes ago, AbsolutelyN said:

Give the guy a break please. It may not be everyone's cup of tea but is still a striking image, a creative approach to a familiar subject and an image that will capture the imagination of many people. It's not some beginner image with a Photoshop filter applied, it took skill and creative thought to create the image entirely in camera. Hopefully it will inspire people to learn about astronomy and look up at the sky. Take a look at his website, he's a  deserving winner in my opinion. I love his halo image of Venus. 

 

I don't have anything against the photographer in any way. And his site looks ok. The problem is that the jury choose this image as a winner, which is just not what the contest is about. It's this one image which is selected not all his imagery. I'm sorry, but the jury should have done a better job in my opinion. And this is not the first time. Just look up the 2016 winner and you will understand what I mean...

This was it btw:

 

Edited September 11, 2020 by Avdhoeven

[AbsolutelyN]

20 minutes ago, Avdhoeven said:

I don't have anything against the photographer in any way. And his site looks ok. The problem is that the jury choose this image as a winner, which is just not what the contest is about. It's this one image which is selected not all his imagery. I'm sorry, but the jury should have done a better job in my opinion. And this is not the first time. Just look up the 2016 winner and you will understand what I mean...

This was it btw:

 

Another creative image. Thinking outside the box at how you can visually interpret Sirius.  Its a competition, they want unique images. 

Edited September 11, 2020 by AbsolutelyN

[Avdhoeven]

12 minutes ago, AbsolutelyN said:

Another creative image. Thinking outside the box at how you can visually interpret Sirius.  Its a competition, they want unique images. 

Just don't call it astrophotographer of the year then, but astro artist of the year... If a jury can't judge quality the competition is doomed. 

[AbsolutelyN]

26 minutes ago, Avdhoeven said:

Just don't call it astrophotographer of the year then, but astro artist of the year... If a jury can't judge quality the competition is doomed. 

But its not just about pure technical image perfection based on traditional astrophotography (which I love and practice). It's a blend of astronomy, science and creative thinking. The audience they want to inspire is the public, not just astrophotographers. They need a range of traditional, contemporary and creative images  - even controversial images. 

I really get the point of a creative category, I'm surprised they have not done that already. That still doesn't prevent or delegitimize it from it winning though if it was in that category.  

I know with landscape photographer of the year comp - the title itself is a bit weird. To me landscape/astrophotographer of the year should be based on a portfolio rather than a single image. But they just don't work like that. 

I had a look at your website by the way - fantastic images. 

Edited September 11, 2020 by AbsolutelyN

[Avdhoeven]

Thanks. I fully agree if there would be a separate category. Then it would be clear and much more legitimate. Now it doesn't do right to the astrophotography community in my opinion.