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Astroberry / KStars on Rpi - More advice needed


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I have come across something odd I do not understand and may explain some issues I have had.

I have been mostly using windows Remote Desktop via ethernet to run the RPi remotely and mostly seems to work fine. occasionally use the browser with "http://astroberry.local/desktop/" .

So this time I have used Remote Desktop and all seems to work but I had a monitor and keyboard plugged directly to the RPi as well because I needed to set the configuration for ethernet which it did not seem to let me do remotely. 

The odd bit is that screen plugged into the RPI had the astroberry background  and I could use the keyboard to open programs such as KStars, EKOS PHD2 etc and they appeared on the screen plugged into the RPi but not on my remote desktop. Conversely I could then open up the same programs on the remote desktop but they did not appear on the screen plugged into rpI.

So I am guessing I have two instances of Astroberry server running somehow.

If I use the browser to operate the Pi then the same appears on the screen as the RPi screen.

So can anybody explain exactly what is going on here and can I operate my scope with Astroberry and windows remote desktop. I have had instances when I try to open INDI panel and it says an instance is already running so this may explain that but am I okay to say just use remote desktop to operate my equipment, it is just odd that mostly it does seem to work even though if I plug a screen into RPi it is not changing anything on the screen. I guess I just do not understand what is meant by Astroberry Server.

Steve

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All sounds a bit weird.

I don't think you should need to attach a screen etc to the Pi to change the ethernet settings. Should be able to do it via a browser at astroberry.local

Maybe remove the computer link, change settings direct on the Pi then hook up computer again with the new ethernet settings.

It does sound a bit like two instances running somehow.

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Yes I think now I could have changed ethernet settings via the browser but it would not let me through remote desktop, which I didn't realise at the time hence why I plugged the monitor in there, which has now highlighted this odd behavior. (well odd to me as I do not understand it). 

The ethernet is running fine now I gave it a static address I am just worried if this starting a second instance off with remote desktop would cause an issue. I think in past maybe I did cause some issues as I may have inadvertently used both the browser and then connected via remote desktop. But If using one or the other is fine but not both then that is okay I will make sure I do not do it again.

But I really prefer to use Remote Desktop as I can use two monitors.

Steve

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1 minute ago, fireshipjohn said:

Hi Steve,

The Astroberry desktop has 4 virtual screens, are you sure you were not viewing on the 'alternate' desktops as they all look the same?

I've done similar things myself, it can appear very odd!

Screenshot from 2020-09-02 12-16-15.png

No I thought the same at first but both have the 4 desktops and each screen I could put any running application on them but were not visible from the other monitor.

Steve

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I wonder if connecting with Remote Desktop actually creates a second desktop altogether?  It's a long time since I've done it, but it's quite feasible for a single UNIX/Linux system to run multiple desktops concurrently even if there is no monitor/keybord/mouse connected at all.

It might be interesting to log in on both, open a terminal window in each and just enter "w" at the shell prompt in both cases.  I'd expect it to come back with ":0" in the "FROM" column, but if, say, there's a ":1" as well then that could indicate a second desktop is running.

James

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Connecting with RDP does indeed create a new desktop altogether...each instance of it creates a new one with blank desktop.... 👍 it’s totally confusing compared to using VNC or  teamviewer which just shows the same desktop...

Edited by Stuart1971
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Astroberry comes with VNC server. I use that via Ethernet to change settings/configure wifi (don't like the Astroberry hot-spot but I have used that too). 

Just install VNC viewer your remote machine or (as I do) on a tablet. I have been using the tablet for at the mount adjustments like focusing via a hotspot on my tablet.

But having had great trouble with the stability of the Pi  I have just swapped things round on recommendation from the SGL massive. I now have KStars/Ekos on the laptop, connected via Ethernet to the Pi. The Pi is just a server and only runs the Astroberry/Indi server. I now have my Laptop set as a VNC server (free software for personal use) and connect to that with my tablet for at-the-mount work. So I have a remote monitor on my lappy in the lounge and a mobile monitor on the tablet at the mount :)

Only one incidence of Astroberry running and if needed I can still use a browser to log on to astroberry.local via the Astroberry hot-spot. All screens are identical.

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35 minutes ago, JamesF said:

You want two monitors to share (as near as makes no odds) exactly the same display?

James

No I wanted to make it like Remote desktop where you can just move open applications from one monitor to the other (effectively double the amount of open desktop viewable at same time). I am just so used to running the sequence software on one screen and the planetarium software on the other.

If not possible then I will just have to get used to switching between desktops on Astroberry.

Steve

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31 minutes ago, Paul M said:

Astroberry comes with VNC server. I use that via Ethernet to change settings/configure wifi (don't like the Astroberry hot-spot but I have used that too). 

Just install VNC viewer your remote machine or (as I do) on a tablet. I have been using the tablet for at the mount adjustments like focusing via a hotspot on my tablet.

But having had great trouble with the stability of the Pi  I have just swapped things round on recommendation from the SGL massive. I now have KStars/Ekos on the laptop, connected via Ethernet to the Pi. The Pi is just a server and only runs the Astroberry/Indi server. I now have my Laptop set as a VNC server (free software for personal use) and connect to that with my tablet for at-the-mount work. So I have a remote monitor on my lappy in the lounge and a mobile monitor on the tablet at the mount :)

Only one incidence of Astroberry running and if needed I can still use a browser to log on to astroberry.local via the Astroberry hot-spot. All screens are identical.

I did think of going this route but just worried that if the connection dropped (I know ethernet should be pretty rock solid - but if it did) then the sequence would abort and the session lost but as it is the sequence still goes on n the RPi as Ekos is on that. On the other hand if it is not stable then the RPi could freeze or shut down and the same. So far the few time I have used the RPi then it has crashed a few times but only when I am messing around, when actually running on its own it has seemed fine - so far (famous last words 😞 )

Steve

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38 minutes ago, teoria_del_big_bang said:

So far the few time I have used the RPi then it has crashed a few times but only when I am messing around

Hope it stays stable for you. I've had many, many more crashes than subs! :(

Hopefully, if the sky ever clears, my new arrangement will be usable. 

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Just now, Paul M said:

Hope it stays stable for you. I've had many, many more crashes than subs! :(

Hopefully, if the sky ever clears, my new arrangement will be usable. 

I hope so too, it would be nice if you remember to let me know how it goes over a few sessions. I have not ruled this method out yet.

Steve

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Just now, teoria_del_big_bang said:

I hope so too, it would be nice if you remember to let me know how it goes over a few sessions. I have not ruled this method out yet.

Steve

Let you know? If it works I'll tell the world!!! :)

You'll be sick of hearing about it. It's been a long torturous road that there Astroberry/RPi. 

But seriously, it isn't the way I wanted to go. I'd been very happy with the simplicity of APT and my DSLR but really wanted to get away from having my lappy outside once the dew arrives. The Pi just seemed like a perfect solution. But now I'm back needing my lappy, even though it's not outside now. 

I do take my gear up to our Luxury Cumbrian Villa if the forecast is good and the portability of the standalone Pi/Astroberry solution is diluted if not lost completely. Plan B is to dump the RPi and get an NUC/Windows micro PC and run APT headless on that via my trusty old tablet. The new set up will need to perform from the word go. No intentions of wasting the autumn and winter nights on further RPi problems!

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@Paul M I know exactly where you are coming from. I was really delighted with APT both with the DSLR and dedicated cam. Never (and I mean never) failed me unless it was me that did something wrong.

So why move. Well it was just the summer months with little to do and so many use KStars I wanted to try. In general the architecture of it all I really like, more so than  ASCOM, and the actual setting op of the INDI drivers seemed far easier than with ASCOM. Hard to say why but I just really liked the feel of it and how everything is displayed.

What I wasn't so impressed with was the KStars planetarium software compared to Stellarium, or at least the look of it and smoothness of how it operates. And what I really liked was how you could automate everything in EKOS from the goto, the framing to be same as previous nights absolutely spot on just using a reference image from previous night (so long as camera rotation is not vastly different) to focussing and then guiding. The sequencing side I also really like.

The clunkiness of the planetarium software I can live with it is useful enough.

So I more than likely will stick with KStars/Ekos it is just whether I think the RPi can handle it, not overheat or crash or go back to my expensive mini (not that mini but fits on tripod okay) computer that is far more powerful than it needs to be and fast and runs like a dream, but if I go back I cannot use Astroberry server (maybe not a big issue) but do I use Linux or Windows.

Anyway same as you really I just want it all working without fear of crashes and cannot afford wasted clear nights oratting about with software, whether my fault or not.

If somebody could now make a stand alone application that encompasses all the good aspects of say APT, Kstars, Stellarium, EKOS etc that is robust I would pay for that no problem and would be happy 🙂 

Steve

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7 minutes ago, TerryMcK said:

As I thought RDP port 3389 isn’t open in the native installation of Astroberry. It looks like xrdp server has to be installed first. I’ll have a bash at that tomorrow.

I think a lot of my issues are I am reasonably computer savy to a point but ports and things like IP addresses are way beyond what I can understand nowerdays.

Steve

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5 minutes ago, teoria_del_big_bang said:

What I wasn't so impressed with was the KStars planetarium software compared to Stellarium

I agree with all you say but particularly regarding KStars, I assumed it was a bit "skeletal" to keep it small with low processor overheads. My personal planetarium favorite is SkySafari and one of my first "jobs" with Astroberry/Kstars was to implement the SkySafari plugin. It worked within limits, could perform goto's from SkySafari on my tablet and things would sync ok. But I couldn't see much point in the end so stopped doing that.

I did uses Stallarium with APT due to it's lack of native planetarium but found the link unstable. Stellarium would hang occasionally.

So here's what to do. Run Astroberry/Indi server remotely via Kstars on a Windows machine . Connect APT to the Indi server (tried that too and got it working!) and use SkySafari via the Indi plugin to run goto's for APT... :)

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13 hours ago, teoria_del_big_bang said:

No I wanted to make it like Remote desktop where you can just move open applications from one monitor to the other (effectively double the amount of open desktop viewable at same time). I am just so used to running the sequence software on one screen and the planetarium software on the other.

If not possible then I will just have to get used to switching between desktops on Astroberry.

Steve

Yes, I would like to do that too, but no way AFAIK... ☹️

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