I need help with buying a setup I'm a beginner

[Alekos]

Hello to everyone reading this,

I am very new to photography and I could use some suggestions on buying a camera, a lens and anything else I need. I have never owned a camera but have used some over the past couple of years. My budget is around 300$ for everything. I really like taking landscape photos and would love to try astrophotography but currently can't until I buy a camera.

Thanks in advance.

[nfotis]

Hello here, and welcome (I am a newcomer, too, as everyone else was in the past 🙂 )

All camera brands offer nice introductory cameras and lenses. It's a matter of personal preference, really.

Personally, as I was a film shooter decades ago, I settled on Canon SLRs and lenses (and I continue using my Canon lenses on my current Canon dSLRs).

The big two brands in dSLR today are Canon and Nikon. Both companies offer very good cameras and lenses (of course, you get what you pay for), and there's a large used gear market for both of them. If you prefer mirrorless cameras, note that they have usually smaller batteries than their dSLR counterparts, and that may be a problem if you are shooting long exposures all night. Also, it seems that some astronomic software like Backyard EOS doesn't support most of the mirrorless models.

Cheers,

N.F.

 

[carastro]

Astrophotography is about a lot more than buying a camera.  But some widefield stuff can be done with simple equipment.

The best camera for Astrophotography at this level is a modified DSLR and most people use Canon DSLRs because of software support.  Modified means removing of the IR lens in the camera as this blocks out some of the Hydrogen alpha wavelengths.  Using a modified camera during the day will need a change of settings or the photos will and end up pink (Custom white balance).

You can buy a modified camera directly from Cheapastrophotography many astrophotographers have bought from him, this saves you buying and unmodified one and then having to get it modified.

https://www.cheapastrophotography.com/

Now the next thing you need to appreciate is that the Earth is rotating, so any long exposure will be smudged and stars elongated, unless you want to do star trails and this can be done on a static tripod, but almost all astrophotography needs to be done on long exposure, so needs a tracking mount. 

To to overcome this you need a tracking mount, and if you want to get even more advanced you will need a sturdy mount capable of guiding, but we are getting ahead of ourselves here.

The cheapest way of doing this and imaging with a camera lens is using a Skywatcher Star Adventurer (this needs mounting on a sturdy tripod.

https://www.firstlightoptics.com/skywatcher-mounts/skywatcher-star-adventurer-astronomy-bundle.html 

I hope this helps.

Carole 

 

Edited July 4, 2020 by carastro

[Adam J]

Well you won't get anything with cooling for 300 pounds. A modified DSLR is probably the way to go. 

I recommend cheap astrophotography.

https://m.cheapastrophotography.com/Available-Cameras.html

A 1300D is at your price point. 

Adam

[Alekos]

9 hours ago, carastro said:

Astrophotography is about a lot more than buying a camera.  But some widefield stuff can be done with simple equipment.

The best camera for Astrophotography at this level is a modified DSLR and most people use Canon DSLRs because of software support.  Modified means removing of the IR lens in the camera as this blocks out some of the Hydrogen alpha wavelengths.  Using a modified camera during the day will need a change of settings or the photos will and end up pink (Custom white balance).

You can buy a modified camera directly from Cheapastrophotography many astrophotographers have bought from him, this saves you buying and unmodified one and then having to get it modified.

https://www.cheapastrophotography.com/

Now the next thing you need to appreciate is that the Earth is rotating, so any long exposure will be smudged and stars elongated, unless you want to do star trails and this can be done on a static tripod, but almost all astrophotography needs to be done on long exposure, so needs a tracking mount. 

To to overcome this you need a tracking mount, and if you want to get even more advanced you will need a sturdy mount capable of guiding, but we are getting ahead of ourselves here.

The cheapest way of doing this and imaging with a camera lens is using a Skywatcher Star Adventurer (this needs mounting on a sturdy tripod.

https://www.firstlightoptics.com/skywatcher-mounts/skywatcher-star-adventurer-astronomy-bundle.html 

I hope this helps.

Carole 

 

Thanks for the suggestion,

However, as I mentioned I would like to do regular photography aswell so wouldn't a modified camera change the outcome of regular photos?

As for the star tracker/mount I think it's too early for that and I'm not thinking of taking any amazing photos that need to be focused somewhere specific and it cost quite a lot of money for my current budget.

Thanks for everything again I'm just not thinking of going the modded camera rout yet,

Alex

[Alekos]

6 hours ago, Adam J said:

Well you won't get anything with cooling for 300 pounds. A modified DSLR is probably the way to go. 

I recommend cheap astrophotography.

https://m.cheapastrophotography.com/Available-Cameras.html

A 1300D is at your price point. 

Adam

I'm not thinking of buying a modified camera yet.

However I have found a 1300D for around 180$ with a regular kit lens or 140$ with just the body.

Alex

[carastro]

People do use unmodified cameras, but they are restrictive.  

Carole 

[Alekos]

10 hours ago, nfotis said:

Hello here, and welcome (I am a newcomer, too, as everyone else was in the past 🙂 )

All camera brands offer nice introductory cameras and lenses. It's a matter of personal preference, really.

Personally, as I was a film shooter decades ago, I settled on Canon SLRs and lenses (and I continue using my Canon lenses on my current Canon dSLRs).

The big two brands in dSLR today are Canon and Nikon. Both companies offer very good cameras and lenses (of course, you get what you pay for), and there's a large used gear market for both of them. If you prefer mirrorless cameras, note that they have usually smaller batteries than their dSLR counterparts, and that may be a problem if you are shooting long exposures all night. Also, it seems that some astronomic software like Backyard EOS doesn't support most of the mirrorless models.

Cheers,

N.F.

 

I have seen some deals on mostly dslr cameras and probably going to buy one of those. I can probably find a pretty good camera at around 200 max but then I don't know about the lens. A lot of them come with the regular 18-55 kit lens but I have heard that that isn't good enough.

Alex

[Alekos]

4 minutes ago, carastro said:

People do use unmodified cameras, but they are restrictive.  

Carole 

I'm not thinking of taking any top of the line amazing photos, just some simple ones.

For simple photos wouldn't a unmodified camera be just fine?

Alex

[carastro]

I did this with a kit lens in Spain but the exposures were 2 - 3 minutes long (some of each) and tracked on an Ioptron sky tracker.  However it was a Modified DSLR, but the kit lens on this was fine, but I would not use it for actual deep sky objects.

Edited July 5, 2020 by carastro

[Alan White]

Alex, one thing I hare learnt over the years as both an Astronomer and Photographer is that if you buy cheap,

you buy twice or even three times.

Nothing cheap delivers long term and is a compromise.

A basic DSLR and kit lens will set you going, but over time you will find the compromise issues and want more, that involves change of lenses, camera bodies and additional kit, it’s a journey many, including me have taken.

Out of interest, what camera are you looking at?

Be aware photography is very much in flux at the minute, lens fitting are changing, mirrorless is starting to rule and brands are suffering a big down turn in sales, some manufacturers will go.

 

 

 

[carastro]

Here's another I took with the Kit lens.  the stuff in the foreground will smudge in long exposure and I had to re-superimpose over the image after stacking all the 1 minute exposures.  there were some whispy clouds around. 

Modified Canon 1100D + Kit lens @ F3.5

7 x 1 min exosures

Ioptron Skytracker 

Edited July 5, 2020 by carastro

[carastro]

There are some fabulous things you can do on a static tripod.  This is just one I found on the internet, point the camera towards the pole with a tree in the foreground, probably a few hours of data stacked together showing the Stars as they rotate around the pole.

Here is one I found on the internet:

 

 

 

Edited July 5, 2020 by carastro

[happy-kat]

I'm happy using an unmodified camera it lets me do imaging within the limitations that my overall gear provides, I don't use a tracking mount that would enable me to get the most out of a modified camera anyway.

I chose canon and a model that the Android app DSLR Controller supports, this way I get a bigger screen on my phone to help with focusing and I can use the timelapse. Lots of software supports canon. I've got an 1100d but the 600d is nice and has an articulated screen.

With a static mount you can take startrail images, milky way and sometimes even comets if they are bright enough. Plus you can start to learn about stacking and processing.

For me I look at any changes in camera technology just means the old stuff becomes even cheaper but it's still useable as well it is being used today. One of my lenses is circa 1963.

[carastro]

That's a good point Happy Kat (would love to see some examples of your images), make sure you get a camera with live view otherwise getting focus will be a nightmare and as Happy Kat says a flip out screen is even more helpful if you have the camera pointed at an awkward angle, though if you use a laptop to control it all you can checkfocus on the laptop even more easily.

Carole 

[happy-kat]

I don't have a laptop I use my android phone to focus and control my 1100d using the app mentioned. This was at 24mm static tripod.

Free useful software

GIMP

DSS deep sky stacker

Sequator

ICE image composite editor

[happy-kat]

Your local sky pollution level is probably the most limiting factor in what you can take. The image above was at a bortle 3-4 location.

If you are handy you could make a barn door tracker mount to get longer exposures. My manual barn door tracker gives 3 minute exposures reliably at 40mm lens use.

[Alekos]

1 hour ago, carastro said:

I did this with a kit lens in Spain but the exposures were 2 - 3 minutes long (some of each) and tracked on an Ioptron sky tracker.  However it was a Modified DSLR, but the kit lens on this was fine, but I would not use it for actual deep sky objects.

if I could take photos like that it would be amazing! But I'm not looking for anything better because I know I can't with such a budget.

 

[Alekos]

1 hour ago, Alan White said:

Alex, one thing I hare learnt over the years as both an Astronomer and Photographer is that if you buy cheap,

you buy twice or even three times.

Nothing cheap delivers long term and is a compromise.

A basic DSLR and kit lens will set you going, but over time you will find the compromise issues and want more, that involves change of lenses, camera bodies and additional kit, it’s a journey many, including me have taken.

Out of interest, what camera are you looking at?

Be aware photography is very much in flux at the minute, lens fitting are changing, mirrorless is starting to rule and brands are suffering a big down turn in sales, some manufacturers will go.

 

 

Thanks for the advise but as I said I have never had a camera so going all out and wasting like 700$ for my first camera and setup wouldn't be a good idea. I am looking at a canon 1300D with I have found for about 180$ with the kit lens.

[nfotis]

3 minutes ago, Alekos said:

 

You *can* shoot such photos even with the kit lens of a dSLR - it's mostly a matter of technique and dark skies.

And then you can expand with a fast telephoto lens (eg Samyang 135mm) and a tracking mount (eg Skywatcher Star Adventurer)

 

N.F.

 

Edited July 5, 2020 by nfotis

[Alekos]

1 hour ago, happy-kat said:

I don't have a laptop I use my android phone to focus and control my 1100d using the app mentioned. This was at 24mm static tripod.

Free useful software

GIMP

DSS deep sky stacker

Sequator

ICE image composite editor

This look awesome! These kinds of photos I am looking at shooting. However I don't have a clue about software, editing, stacking or whatever else the images need after.

[Alekos]

1 hour ago, happy-kat said:

Your local sky pollution level is probably the most limiting factor in what you can take. The image above was at a bortle 3-4 location.

If you are handy you could make a barn door tracker mount to get longer exposures. My manual barn door tracker gives 3 minute exposures reliably at 40mm lens use.

No need to worry about sky pollution I live in a very good area where there's almost no one within a couple kilometers.

[Alekos]

9 minutes ago, nfotis said:

You *can* shoot such photos even with the kit lens of a dSLR - it's mostly a matter of technique and dark skies.

And then you can expand with a fast telephoto lens (eg Samyang 135mm) and a tracking mount (eg Skywatcher Star Adventurer)

 

N.F.

 

I don't think I'm going to buy a tracking mount since they are pretty expensive and I don't need it yet. However am am looking at different telephoto lenses.

Alex

[Adam J]

2 hours ago, Alekos said:

I'm not thinking of buying a modified camera yet.

However I have found a 1300D for around 180$ with a regular kit lens or 140$ with just the body.

Alex

Unless you are willing to modify it yourself then that is a mistake in my opinion even if you are only shooting milky way shots on a tripod. You will not get the large Ha regions coming through. 

Adam

Edited July 5, 2020 by Adam J

[Adam J]

2 hours ago, carastro said:

I did this with a kit lens in Spain but the exposures were 2 - 3 minutes long (some of each) and tracked on an Ioptron sky tracker.  However it was a Modified DSLR, but the kit lens on this was fine, but I would not use it for actual deep sky objects.

Lagoon and triffid showing nicely there. So you can tell it's modified. 

Edited July 5, 2020 by Adam J