There is glue on my new lens?

[Waldemar]

9 hours ago, willcastle said:

After this business is concluded I will take my money elsewhere. I have heard tons of good things about FLO so that will now be my next retailer I guess. Shame. Because I have literally never bought any Astro gear for anywhere else. I’m weirdly loyal like that. 

I think your loyalty is a virtue!  Be proud of it!

[willcastle]

Does anyone know if I am allowed to name them on here? Is it okay with SGL’s forum rules? 

[willcastle]

11 hours ago, willcastle said:

 They actually implied that I am the source of these issues in their last email and basically all but called me a liar. 

They went as far as to tell me that what I was saying isn’t accurate because skywatcher have exceptional quality control and the issues must have occurred in transit or after.

Just to clarify these two points so that I am not accused of liable (should I mention the retailers name):

I said to them in an email:

“Considering the fact that I have only just purchased it, and it seems to have slipped through quality control, like the tripod and counterweight, I feel disappointed with the purchase.”

Here was their reply to that point:

“The manufacturers won't have boxed up a damaged tripod. Their QC is normally very good. It must have been done in transit somehow.”

This totally ignored the fact that a) I had mentioned the counter weight AND lens glue in addition to the tripod and b) ignored the fact that in a previous email I had explained that I feel the tripod damage was done before transit because the dent didn’t line up with any exterior damage to the box.

here was my reply:

“I would also question the fact you are telling me their quality control is so good, when the lens of the telescope has glue on it. That is not something that happened in transit. Nor is the fact that during the manufacturing process they painted over a region of corrosion on the metal.”

and their reply to that:

“We sell a massive amount of Skywatcher and we get very few returns. This is the reason that I am a bit confused about the amount of issues that you've had.”

That to me, is implying they are doubting me at my word. You may have a different interpretation. In my reply I told them I was unhappy with how they are talking to a loyal customer who has spent so much money with them.

UPDATE: they just replied to my last email. They are still reassuring me that I will get a replacement scope and have contacted the supplier to tell me they contacted them too. (I also contacted the supplier to express my disappointment and ask for a replacement).

but they chose to totally ignore all of my comments about upset, disappointment and their implications. 

So after a long process it looks like I will get my replacement scope, and due to my unhappiness with their commutation: they will have lost a loyal customer of 8 years. This whole situation could have played out so differently. 

[DaveL59]

I'm sure this supplier and many others have shipped lots of SW gear, but like any there will always be the odd issue and perhaps more than just the odd one. They'll most all say there are hardly ever any returns even if they know there's more than just a few so as not to discourage buyers or to try and reassure about the problem you have. No idea how SW or any fair on the QC side and I doubt any supplier will want to say much there either, but if they had a bad rep then I'm sure we'd see a lot more -ve and help posts so its likely they're reasonable overall.

Given you've been a long-term customer tho, it is disappointing to find you get given the run-around when you do hit a problem and seems 3 came along at once here. If I were you and the scope arrives, I'd be extra thorough checking it over and if there are any issues at all then return the whole lot for a refund and go elsewhere. Even if the replacement scope arrives there likely will always be the nagging memory of these events when any tiny issue comes up in use, leaving you maybe doubting the equipment itself. If they query, just say with all the problems and having checked it all over with the replacements you just ain't happy with it. A reasonable retailer should understand and do the right thing I'd hope.

[Geoff Barnes]

18 minutes ago, willcastle said:

they will have lost a loyal customer of 8 years.

Ah well Will, look on the bright side, now you can start to use the services of FLO, the best astro supplier bar none!  

[MimasDeathStar]

On 15/01/2020 at 19:36, willcastle said:

I agree of course, but I also don’t like being given the benefit of the doubt when I am being honest. It’s a strange one

I can definitely relate to that feeling. If I've ever had faulty stuff in the past I've always found it a really distressing experience - mostly because I'm waiting for the ugly finger of blame to be pointed at me! Its a horrible experience. But luckily most places aren't like that anymore. When I had a problem with my brand new Opticstar scope they couldn't have been nicer about it and re-assured me repeatedly that it wasn't my fault! That's probably why I get my stuff from there still.

[johninderby]

Opticstar does indeed look after their customers. I sold a scope I had bought a year earlier from Opticstar and the red dot finder that  came with it, but that I had never used, was found to be faulty by the person I had sold the scope to. Gave them the purchase details and they contacted Opticstar who sent them a new finder the next day. Now that is customer service. 👍🏻👍🏻👍🏻

There are great retailers like FLO and Opticstar amoung others so you shouldn’t put up with second class service. 

[Waldemar]

Obvious to me is that the Internet makes any smart retailer a lot more careful with his customers, because these issues will be mentioned and go around.
To me that is one of the greatest values of the www. At the end this will be in every bodies favor.

[Guest]

13 hours ago, willcastle said:

I just needed to get it off my chest. It’s so disappointing when I have spent around £4000 with this particular retailer.

You've spent a small fortune with this lot and they are treating you like this! I'd hate to think how they'd treat someone spending a tenth of that amount on potentially their first scope and ending up with a defective one!🙄

[banjaxed]

After reading this thread I think it should be regarded as a perfect example of how NOT to treat a customer.

[DaveL59]

2 hours ago, Waldemar said:

Obvious to me is that the Internet makes any smart retailer a lot more careful with his customers, because these issues will be mentioned and go around.
To me that is one of the greatest values of the www. At the end this will be in every bodies favor.

problem with the wibbly wobbly web tho - you'll see lots of -ve feedback or comments on items but far fewer good ones which can paint a very inaccurate picture of what your intended purchase might really be like. Similarly you can often find reviews that rave about how good something is but in reality it ain't, either bias or inexperience on the reviewers part, perhaps. It can take time and lots of research to find the information you need to make the decision, but then its down to the individual to do their due diligence. Thankfully forums like this are a great source of information and advice, but so many rely on amazon or other reviews, jump in and find the new toy a disappointment.

oh, that's not aimed at Will of course, clearly he's been burned by QC failure and not poor buying choice.

Edited January 18, 2020 by DaveL59

[willcastle]

Just now, DaveL59 said:

problem with the wibbly wobbly web tho - you'll see lots of -ve feedback or comments on items but far fewer good ones which can paint a very inaccurate picture of what your intended purchase might really be like. Similarly you can often find reviews that rave about how good something is but in reality it ain't, either bias or inexperience on the reviewers part, perhaps. It can take time and lots of research to find the information you need to make the decision, but then its down to the individual to do their due diligence. Thankfully forums like this are a great source of information and advice, but so many rely on amazon or other reviews, jump in and find the new toy a disappointment.

 

This is very true. I once heard that people are ten times more likely to report something negative than something positive. To prove this point, I never made a positive review of this retailer even after my last 5-6 purchases were all fantastic; now something bad has happened and here I am. 

[willcastle]

1 hour ago, banjaxed said:

After reading this thread I think it should be regarded as a perfect example of how NOT to treat a customer.

I just don’t get it. What have I done to warrant this. I have been so loyal to them over the years

[willcastle]

3 hours ago, MimasDeathStar said:

I can definitely relate to that feeling. If I've ever had faulty stuff in the past I've always found it a really distressing experience - mostly because I'm waiting for the ugly finger of blame to be pointed at me! Its a horrible experience. But luckily most places aren't like that anymore. When I had a problem with my brand new Opticstar scope they couldn't have been nicer about it and re-assured me repeatedly that it wasn't my fault! That's probably why I get my stuff from there still.

I will check them out. But yeah that is the kind of service I would expect from a company. They sold you something with a fault so they should be apologising 

[willcastle]

3 hours ago, Geoff Barnes said:

Ah well Will, look on the bright side, now you can start to use the services of FLO, the best astro supplier bar none!  

Yeah you make a good point. When this is sorted I will have a beautiful telescope and amazing set up and I can focus on enjoying the hobby with the knowledge that there are plenty of other good retailers out there

[FLO]

What an interesting conversation!

Thank-you for the votes of confidence 🙂 

In situations like this it is worth remembering your retailer is responsible for providing service and support. Not your retailer's supplier (OVL are not a retailer). This is true even if your retailer arranges the product is drop-shipped to you. 

I understand how frustrating this must be for you but I also have sympathy for your retailer because your situation really is very unusual. I.e. I don’t think glue is used during the manufacture of your telescope and, assuming the box arrived intact and undamaged, the dent in your tripod leg and damage to the counterweight suggests it was previously assembled and used. I agree with others in this discussion when they say it appears they have mistakenly sent you a display / demo / customer return. 

You say your retailer has served you well over a number of years so I suggest you give ‘them’ the benefit of doubt and enough time to arrange a positive outcome. They might surprise you. 

HTH, 

Steve 

[FLO]

17 minutes ago, FLO said:

I don’t think glue is used during the manufacture of your telescope 

I was wrong, I have just found this photo posted by another member that shows glue. I either haven't noticed it before or it is something new. 

Steve

 

[willcastle]

2 hours ago, FLO said:

What an interesting conversation!

Thank-you for the votes of confidence 🙂 

In situations like this it is worth remembering your retailer is responsible for providing service and support. Not your retailer's supplier (OVL are not a retailer). This is true even if they arrange to have the product drop-shipped to you. 

I understand how frustrating this must be for you but I also have sympathy for your retailer because your situation really is very unusual. I.e. I don’t think glue is used during the manufacture of your telescope and, assuming the box arrived intact and undamaged, the dent in your tripod leg and damage to the counterweight suggests it was previously assembled and used. I agree with others in this discussion when they say it appears they have mistakenly sent you a display / demo / customer return. 

You say your retailer has served you well over a number of years so I suggest you give ‘them’ the benefit of doubt and enough time to arrange a positive outcome. They might surprise you. 

HTH, 

Steve 

Hi Steve,

It was definitely a new product that arrived because it was out of stock when I placed the order. It arrived with the retailer and they sent it out to me the same day they got it from the supplier. 

As for the glue, yeah mine looks exactly like that photo you shared in the link, but far more messy. And then there is obviously the glue on the actual lens. This is undeniably a manufacturing issue. 

I took a new photo and highlighted it to show more clearly what it looks like. In red are the bits of glue that I suppose are meant (?) to be there, but are clearly poorly applied. In green is the glue that has gone onto the glass of the lens (it didn’t show up very clearly in the photo). 

But yes I think this will all be resolved just fine by the end of this process. I think the issue has been HOW I have been spoken to. As a loyal customer, who has spent that amount over the years, what I wanted was a sincere apology for the situation; not to feel like I was under suspicion, or being accused, or simply like the retailer couldn’t care less if they had my custom or not. I think the true measure of how good a company really is, is how they handle a situation when things go wrong, and how much they truly value their customers. Sure they handled lots of other orders just fine, but to be perfectly honest, if this had of been my first order with them, it would have likely been my last.