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long_arms

The Blackest Black Paint - Black 3.0!

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Hello, 

It's been a long time since I've posted in this forum, anyway I've picked up a Skywatcher 200p F/6 dobsonian as a DIY project whilst I continue to work on a new telescope from scratch, (I've started to grind the mirror). 

I'll be making improvements to this dobsonian as a project and learning experience, I've already got a temperature controlled fan which has a probe that can measure both mirror and ambient temperature. I'll be measuring the primary mirror with my in progress Foucault/Ronchi/Bath Tester when that's finished in the next couple of weeks,  may even refigure it depending on results.

But I'm most excited about this right now. The blackest Black Paint as an alternative (hopefully better alternative) to flocking!

This stuff is seriously black and flat, I backed it on kickstarter and received 3 bottles along with goodies.

 

I plan on painting the area opposite the focuser, area around the primary mirror, inside the focuser drawtube, potentially the secondary mirror holder and edge of the secondary also. 

It's a shame I don't have any flocking to compare it with but it looks incredible. 

This video shows just how impressive it is (moreso than my little tester I've done).

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uJIIzcbRD9w

 

I'll try and get some decent before and after pics. 

 

Dan

Black 3.0.jpg

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The reference to Anish Kapoor rings bells.  Was it him that somehow got control of an alleged "blackest black" colour, so another artist created a "pinkest pink", but would only sell it to people on the understanding that they would never make it available to Kapoor?

James

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12 hours ago, long_arms said:

Hello, 

It's been a long time since I've posted in this forum, anyway I've picked up a Skywatcher 200p F/6 dobsonian as a DIY project whilst I continue to work on a new telescope from scratch, (I've started to grind the mirror). 

I'll be making improvements to this dobsonian as a project and learning experience, I've already got a temperature controlled fan which has a probe that can measure both mirror and ambient temperature. I'll be measuring the primary mirror with my in progress Foucault/Ronchi/Bath Tester when that's finished in the next couple of weeks,  may even refigure it depending on results.

But I'm most excited about this right now. The blackest Black Paint as an alternative (hopefully better alternative) to flocking!

This stuff is seriously black and flat, I backed it on kickstarter and received 3 bottles along with goodies.

 

I plan on painting the area opposite the focuser, area around the primary mirror, inside the focuser drawtube, potentially the secondary mirror holder and edge of the secondary also. 

It's a shame I don't have any flocking to compare it with but it looks incredible. 

This video shows just how impressive it is (moreso than my little tester I've done).

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uJIIzcbRD9w

 

I'll try and get some decent before and after pics. 

 

Dan

Black 3.0.jpg

Hi Dan,

Sometimes I'm a bit of a sucker. I am looking for paint finishes that do not reflect. Is this for real ? Or is it a delayed April Fools thing ?

Jeremy.

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It’s definitely in the same league as flock. I tried some black2.0 and another paint against some Wilko flock. Ought to get a tube of the 3.0!

Kapoor seems to have rights to Vanta black, nanotube based, invented in Surrey. There are other structured blacks out where that are also pretty dim. Just make sure you keep dust off them!

 

peter

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Tried to think of a fun quick test to document this afternoon, previous little tester on less metallic object is unbelievable to be honest. 

So, very shiny coin with grazing light and lit from above also. 

1.thumb.jpg.463a27228035128c2cdb3ce11e812edd.jpg

Whilst drying, as you can see its a thin single coat (not simply "filling" in the shape)Wet.thumb.jpg.59c8d0ccc9897d542c8786aefb61b755.jpg

Finally, even on a challenging shiny object with light shining on it, it makes it essentially 2D. 

 

3.1.thumb.jpg.65c8e13328df21b2312f5522d7c49d65.jpg

 

 

4.jpg

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I wonder if it's "blackness" extends into the IR and UV?  That might be an interesting thing to test.

James

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I painted the inside of a focuser with black 2.0 because the tolerance was too tight to flock. It's very good, however, it's also prone to flaking off if scored. I wouldn't recommend it for a draw tube like I did. I cleaned it off before I sold the focuser as I didn't want it to flake onto someone else's primary. For non contact surfaces it would be good.

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This stuff would be great for lens hoods or the focus tube of a Mak.....

Alan

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Does look very dark. Could be useful for those hard to flock places. A bit concerned about the flaking though :unsure:

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5 minutes ago, Alien 13 said:

This stuff would be great for lens hoods or the focus tube of a Mak.....

Alan

It would certainly be a lot easier than flocking the inside of the Mak (or SCT).

James

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10 minutes ago, JamesF said:

I wonder if it's "blackness" extends into the IR and UV?  That might be an interesting thing to test.

James

This is a good shout, I have an IR742 Pass filter somewhere, I'll try and get a photo through that. 
 

1 minute ago, Mr Spock said:

Does look very dark. Could be useful for those hard to flock places. A bit concerned about the flaking though :unsure:

The small amount of dried paint on paper, is now making everything I can find look positively gray!! 
I'll see how easily it flakes when its dried on the steel tube of the telescope. 

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1 minute ago, JamesF said:

It would certainly be a lot easier than flocking the inside of the Mak (or SCT).

James

I believe that the later C90 Mak (mine) has a much less reflective finish on the focus tube but have seen impressive demonstrations of the benefits of flocking, takes the humble cheap Mak to almost Questar levels....

Alan

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11 minutes ago, david_taurus83 said:

I painted the inside of a focuser with black 2.0 because the tolerance was too tight to flock. It's very good, however, it's also prone to flaking off if scored. I wouldn't recommend it for a draw tube like I did. I cleaned it off before I sold the focuser as I didn't want it to flake onto someone else's primary. For non contact surfaces it would be good.

I've seen mixed things about Black 2.0, apparently it had the usual tendency of getting slightly lighter as it dried. The video I posted shows comparison between Black 2.0 and Black 3.0 quite well I think. 

From this article: https://www.fastcompany.com/90300113/move-over-vantablack-you-can-now-buy-the-worlds-blackest-black-paint

"His first version, Black 2.0, wasn’t quite as black as Vantablack, since it only absorbed 95% of the visible light (Vantablack absorbs about 99%).
Now, Black 3.0 is out and available on Kickstarter for about $32 per 150ml tube. According to Semple, it is the blackest, mattest, flattest acrylic paint available on the planet, capturing up to 99% of all the visible spectrum radiation. The paint is based on a new pigment called Black Magick, whose exact composition they aren’t disclosing. Black 3.0 is made up of this pigment, combined with a custom acrylic polymer. Semple and his colleagues claim that the polymer “is special because it has more available bonds than any other acrylic polymer being used in paints,” allowing more pigment density. The paint is then finished with what they claim are new  “nano-mattifiers,” which remove any shine from the paint. Unlike Vantablack, the resulting paint is soluble in water and nontoxic"

Thankyou for your feedback on flaking! Before I paint the drawtube I will certainly check this out. ?

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Just to point out, I gave my draw tube 2 good coats of the stuff. But it made a 2" nosepiece a tight fit. I noticed a lot of scoring marks in the paint. It didn't flake off in big chips but it did score easily. Enough so that I wouldn't do it again. Painting an OTA might be ok but then it might develop a dent...

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Hi Dan,

Interesting results on the 20p coin paint coverage. Just one small question....... is defacing the Queen still considered as a treasonable act?  ?

No sweat, we'll all come and visit you in the Tower! ?

Seriously, good info!

Les

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Small splodge opposite the focuser of the 200p dobsonian. Pointed at a light source to attempt to illuminate it. The inside of the telescope seems very black until I illuminate it like this. 

Interestingly I can find an angle where the paint appears "lighter" than this. Its hard to get a photo of. 

739443881_Insidetelescope.thumb.jpg.1a5701d296c345e7f066f35241426c67.jpg

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1 minute ago, Wyvern said:

Hi Dan,

Interesting results on the 20p coin paint coverage. Just one small question....... is defacing the Queen still considered as a treasonable act?  ?

No sweat, we'll all come and visit you in the Tower! ?

Seriously, good info!

Les

He he, I am sure if you painted both sides then placed it on a painted card or in a painted box no one would know :D

Alan

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2 minutes ago, Wyvern said:

Hi Dan,

Interesting results on the 20p coin paint coverage. Just one small question....... is defacing the Queen still considered as a treasonable act?  ?

No sweat, we'll all come and visit you in the Tower! ?

Seriously, good info!

Les

Ha I did google this out of interest, all those crushing/bending penny machines at tourist destinations springs to mind. Can't believe its enforced.

However to remove any doubt, it was only paint. I have now cleaned the 20p clean and the Queen looks as good as ever! 

No tower for me just yet.

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