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carballada

Waiting the new Mesu200 (mk2?)

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I was looking at getting a mesu 200 shipped to Australia. But with the new elbow pier. Shipping costs would be very high. 

But i'm following the JTW OGEM mount now.

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On 15/06/2019 at 22:32, ollypenrice said:

Are Mesu mounts attractive? You bet they are.

spacer.png

Olly

The performance of the Mesu 200 is amazing considering the price.  It has some flaws in the design and some in manufacturing but nothing is perfect 😁 . 

On 15/06/2019 at 21:45, tomato said:

The Mk1 is portable, I’ve been putting mine up and taking it down every session for 5 years, you just need:

1. A sturdy, large flightcase.

2. A strong back, or some willing helpers.

3. A vehicle with a decent amount of space if transporting it to a dark site.

4. A fair degree of motivation to want to do this.

85B42F08-DAFE-41A6-ACC3-0D59A1785CF6.jpeg

If you do the things above everything is portable. I bet there are people that can lift on a pier/tripod an even heavier mount. My concern with the transportability of the Mesu 200 is about the fragility of the exposed motors/encoders. Even a small mistake can lead to a catastrophe (I had to replace my DEC encoder because the mount arrived to me in with the encoder ruined most probably from shipping). Also the edges of the mount are so sharp, I had a lot of cuts trying to lift it to it's pier. Then there is the tedious problem with the mount rotating when at the end of doing the PA one wants to tight the mount axes, that makes the PA extremely time consuming. And, as a last thing against portability, it's weird to take a mount that is capable of at least 50 kg of scope for astrophotography and put a 8-9 kg FSQ on it, there are some other mounts in the price range that are marvelous travelers and can carry a relatively small telescope. 

 

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I see there is some serious interest in this new mount!

To the ones planning to upgrade from a current MESU200: "when you do so, just call me... For a small fee I'll be ready to free your place from all the old scrap metal!" 🤣

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8 hours ago, mihaighita said:

 

The performance of the Mesu 200 is amazing considering the price.  It has some flaws in the design and some in manufacturing but nothing is perfect 😁 . 

If you do the things above everything is portable. I bet there are people that can lift on a pier/tripod an even heavier mount. My concern with the transportability of the Mesu 200 is about the fragility of the exposed motors/encoders. Even a small mistake can lead to a catastrophe (I had to replace my DEC encoder because the mount arrived to me in with the encoder ruined most probably from shipping). Also the edges of the mount are so sharp, I had a lot of cuts trying to lift it to it's pier. Then there is the tedious problem with the mount rotating when at the end of doing the PA one wants to tight the mount axes, that makes the PA extremely time consuming. And, as a last thing against portability, it's weird to take a mount that is capable of at least 50 kg of scope for astrophotography and put a 8-9 kg FSQ on it, there are some other mounts in the price range that are marvelous travelers and can carry a relatively small telescope. 

 

I'm trying to think of what you mean by the mount rotating during PA. I'm observatory based so it's a long time since I did a PA but I honestly can't remember any issue like this. I do remember installing the first one here with its original owner and we both thought it was incredibly easy. We aligned using drift. I did use the polarscope when I installed our second one and, again, I remember it as painless. One guest brings his Mesu most years and sets up very quickly, too. I'm not saying you're wrong, just that I can't imagine the issue.

The housings round the drive wheels are fabricated on all but the first Mesus and are more angular, I agree. On ours they are rounded and one piece. (How they are constructed is a bit of a mystery, rather like a ship in a bottle!)

spacer.png

Olly

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4 hours ago, ollypenrice said:

I'm trying to think of what you mean by the mount rotating during PA.

I think that may refer to the final tightening of the main central bolt holding the mount to the pier / adaptor plate?

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24 minutes ago, Jonk said:

I think that may refer to the final tightening of the main central bolt holding the mount to the pier / adaptor plate?

Possibly so, yes. The trick, I think, with any kind of mechanical adjuster that has to be locked finally in place is not to have it too free to begin with. I keep a fair bit of tension in the moving (adjustable) parts before final tightening. This applies to anything - engine tappets, motorbike rear wheels for chain adjustment, etc etc.

Olly

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I put a thrust washer under a penny washer on the central bolt and leave it tight - I can polar align without slackening it - problem solved - £5 from Simply bearings.

I think I got the last original spec Mesu in the UK and I find it a thing of beauty in a brutalist sort of way.

Its also the most boring mount I have ever owned - fit almost any scope and almost any combo of guide scope and guide camera and it guides at about 0.4" total, hardly needs any maintenance or fiddling with. [YAWN} 😉

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When I enquired about one, price etc. it was when I found this thread... a little annoyed but will aee how the mk2 pans out. I'll let someone else buy from the first batch and wait for a couple of reports!

I think I will buy one anyway but makes me feel better after some research 🤓

I'm sure it'll be fine.

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5 hours ago, ollypenrice said:

I'm trying to think of what you mean by the mount rotating during PA. I'm observatory based so it's a long time since I did a PA but I honestly can't remember any issue like this. I do remember installing the first one here with its original owner and we both thought it was incredibly easy. We aligned using drift. I did use the polarscope when I installed our second one and, again, I remember it as painless. One guest brings his Mesu most years and sets up very quickly, too. I'm not saying you're wrong, just that I can't imagine the issue.

The housings round the drive wheels are fabricated on all but the first Mesus and are more angular, I agree. On ours they are rounded and one piece. (How they are constructed is a bit of a mystery, rather like a ship in a bottle!)

 

Olly

 

1 hour ago, Jonk said:

I think that may refer to the final tightening of the main central bolt holding the mount to the pier / adaptor plate?

The mount moves when tightening both the central bolt and the altitude locking bolt. On the central bolt I tried everything to make it stop, from thrust washer to grease between 2 washers to compression bearing and while the last 2 methods did alleviate the problem, the rotation of the mount did not entirely go away. On the altitude locking bolt I've yet to find a cure that will stop the mount moving, I think it slightly flexes the structure and I tend to leave the altitude bolt a bit loosen or anticipate the move and move the star a bit off... On a fixed location where you have time to fiddle with the PA and anticipate the mount movements it's not a deal breaker but the considerations from above were about the mount being used as a portable mount (even in the splittable version).

I love the mount, after the setup on my pier and the PA "nightmare" it just disappeared in the background for most of the time and I imaged with it between 395mm (reduced FSQ 106) and 2000mm (250mm RC) without any problem. And as a testimonial on how sturdy the mount is, I had an incident with the wind taking it down from a berlebach tripod last autumn. It was loaded with the 250mm RC and the FSQ at about 40 kgs of scope and cameras and another 40 kgs of counterweights and the damage the mount sustained was minor (Dec housing bent and, ofcourse, the DEC motor severed from the housing). It's true that the fall was somehow slowed by my body 😁... Lucas fixed the mount quick and perfect after this incident, it took more for me to recover than the mount to be fixed. 

With all of the above said, I will surely buy the second version as the secondary mount for my upcoming observatory in Tuscany...

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9 minutes ago, Jonk said:

When I enquired about one, price etc. it was when I found this thread... a little annoyed but will aee how the mk2 pans out. I'll let someone else buy from the first batch and wait for a couple of reports!

I think I will buy one anyway but makes me feel better after some research 🤓

I'm sure it'll be fine.

You cannot go wrong with it. I am going to buy one next year when I have the budget for it. 

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9 minutes ago, mihaighita said:

You cannot go wrong with it. I am going to buy one next year when I have the budget for it. 

I hope so, ever since I started astro photography I lusted after this mount! Sad but true and hey, you only live once.

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Posted (edited)
23 minutes ago, mihaighita said:

 

The mount moves when tightening both the central bolt and the altitude locking bolt. On the central bolt I tried everything to make it stop, from thrust washer to grease between 2 washers to compression bearing and while the last 2 methods did alleviate the problem, the rotation of the mount did not entirely go away. On the altitude locking bolt I've yet to find a cure that will stop the mount moving, I think it slightly flexes the structure and I tend to leave the altitude bolt a bit loosen or anticipate the move and move the star a bit off... On a fixed location where you have time to fiddle with the PA and anticipate the mount movements it's not a deal breaker but the considerations from above were about the mount being used as a portable mount (even in the splittable version).

I love the mount, after the setup on my pier and the PA "nightmare" it just disappeared in the background for most of the time and I imaged with it between 395mm (reduced FSQ 106) and 2000mm (250mm RC) without any problem. And as a testimonial on how sturdy the mount is, I had an incident with the wind taking it down from a berlebach tripod last autumn. It was loaded with the 250mm RC and the FSQ at about 40 kgs of scope and cameras and another 40 kgs of counterweights and the damage the mount sustained was minor (Dec housing bent and, ofcourse, the DEC motor severed from the housing). It's true that the fall was somehow slowed by my body 😁... Lucas fixed the mount quick and perfect after this incident, it took more for me to recover than the mount to be fixed. 

With all of the above said, I will surely buy the second version as the secondary mount for my upcoming observatory in Tuscany...

I remember Sara saying this as well but it has never affected my PA efforts. There must be a reason. How about this: in the threaded system which pulls or pushes the mount east or west there must be some backlash because there always is. Now the top nut turns clockwise so if the adjusting system has its backlash still present for a clockwise movement of the mount you'll get the effect you describe. But if that backlash has already been taken up you won't. What I'm thinking is that whether or not a final turn on the centre nut will move the mount will depend on the direction of the last thing you did with the adjusters. It might be worth checking that the adjuster's backlash is on the 'anticlockwise side' and is already taken up. Does this make sense?

Olly

Edited by ollypenrice
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2 minutes ago, ollypenrice said:

I remember Sara saying this as well but it has never affected my PA efforts. There must be a reason. How about this: in the threaded system which pulls or pushes the mount east or west there must be some backlash because there always is. Now the top nut turns clockwise so if the adjusting system has its backlash still present for a clockwise movement of the mount you'll get the effect you describe. But if that backlash has already been taken up you won't. What I'm thinking is that whether or not a final turn on the centre nut will move the mount will depend on the direction of the last thing you did with the adjusters. It might be worth checking that the 

I will try this the next time I do PA on the mount. The thing that bothers me the most, tbh, is the movement made from the altitude locking bolt, the central bolt movement is predictable and I can compensate for it relatively easy. The altitude bolt is unpredictable because of the elastic deformation taking place in the halfwheel with the red arrow from the attached photo 

Screen Shot 2019-06-18 at 4.30.05 PM.png

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Posted (edited)
On 19/04/2019 at 19:25, carballada said:

It’s the wedge. 

150€ and prepared for your latitude. 

Its possible to adjusts about 300km in North South direction, máximum of 600km but in this case it’s does not look good (because the angle is to forced). 

 

344223C0-7784-47B8-9FC4-32D1A234A860.jpeg

DFD0F07E-9093-467D-B43C-6ADE64EBE1AE.jpeg

Since this thread has now rewoken, I take the opportunity to wonder if anyone has seen or even used the Mk2 yet. I just do not understand from the pictures of it how you do the azimuth adjustment if you put it on a pier with the wedge shown on these pictures. I also wonder about the altitude adjustment - I see no adjustment screws except three M12 (or M10) bolts - but that would be a very cumbersome and primitive way of doing polar alignment.

I am a happy owner of a Mesu 200 from the very last Mk1 batch so I am mainly qurious, although one day I may want a second Mesu 200 for the second obsy I have just built.

Edited by gorann

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Actually, when I compare the pictures of MK2 with Mk1, it seems that the new version is really stripped and if anything should be a budget model:

Skärmavbild 2019-06-18 kl. 17.32.11.png

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20 hours ago, mihaighita said:

 

The performance of the Mesu 200 is amazing considering the price.  It has some flaws in the design and some in manufacturing but nothing is perfect 😁 . 

If you do the things above everything is portable. I bet there are people that can lift on a pier/tripod an even heavier mount. My concern with the transportability of the Mesu 200 is about the fragility of the exposed motors/encoders. Even a small mistake can lead to a catastrophe (I had to replace my DEC encoder because the mount arrived to me in with the encoder ruined most probably from shipping). Also the edges of the mount are so sharp, I had a lot of cuts trying to lift it to it's pier. Then there is the tedious problem with the mount rotating when at the end of doing the PA one wants to tight the mount axes, that makes the PA extremely time consuming. And, as a last thing against portability, it's weird to take a mount that is capable of at least 50 kg of scope for astrophotography and put a 8-9 kg FSQ on it, there are some other mounts in the price range that are marvelous travelers and can carry a relatively small telescope. 

 

Most Astro kit is fragile if you drop it or clatter it in to something solid, and the setting up and taking down is tedious for sure.

However, in the quest for the best dark skies in the UK, I will be considering transporting the Mesu and an Esprit 150 to mid-Wales, a 100 mile round trip from my soon to be new home location, I’ll keep you posted!

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1 minute ago, tomato said:

Most Astro kit is fragile if you drop it or clatter it in to something solid, and the setting up and taking down is tedious for sure.

However, in the quest for the best dark skies in the UK, I will be considering transporting the Mesu and an Esprit 150 to mid-Wales, a 100 mile round trip from my soon to be new home location, I’ll keep you posted!

The Mesu biggest portability problem is the fragility of the exposed motors. Lucas installed on mine 2 bars on the outside part of the motor to prevent damage to it (basically the most fragile there is the black encoder at the bottom of the motor - it does not need much force to effectively ruin it). A very effective way to transport the mount is to put it in the original wooden box it came with, but you will have to be extremely careful when you install the mount on the pier/tripod and to take your time especially in the morning when you are tired. 

 

Screen Shot 2019-06-18 at 9.26.19 PM.png

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Yes, I’ve seen the installed protector bars on the latest mounts, a useful mod as this motor/encoder is indeed quite vulnerable.

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I've had a price from the UK distributor for the new MK2, and will ponder it.

I will need a bespoke elbow made for my pier, so some calcs are needed.

Has anyone else been given this info, i.e. have shown interest?

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In my case, 

I just received the catch-up email with the descriptions of the main MK2 Upgrades. 

Options: elbow pier or on a Berlebach tripod

and

At the bottom of the email, the question if I am still interested.
 

No price...

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Posted (edited)
2 hours ago, Jonk said:

I've had a price from the UK distributor for the new MK2, and will ponder it.

I will need a bespoke elbow made for my pier, so some calcs are needed.

Has anyone else been given this info, i.e. have shown interest?

 

2 hours ago, RolandKol said:

In my case, 

I just received the catch-up email with the descriptions of the main MK2 Upgrades. 

Options: elbow pier or on a Berlebach tripod

and

At the bottom of the email, the question if I am still interested.
 

No price...

If anything it should be cheaper than the mk1 since it does not seem to have the Alt Az adjustments of the mk1. How would it work for people that already have a pier and cannot fit in that elbow?

Edited by gorann

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42 minutes ago, gorann said:

 

If anything it should be cheaper than the mk1 since it does not seem to have the Alt Az adjustments of the mk1. How would it work for people that already have a pier and cannot fit in that elbow?

Build a custom Alt-Az adjuster?

What is the new pricing anyhow? So mysterious. 

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, gorann said:

 

If anything it should be cheaper than the mk1 since it does not seem to have the Alt Az adjustments of the mk1. How would it work for people that already have a pier and cannot fit in that elbow?

Sorry, missed initially, "optional wedge/adaptor" will be available also for users who have a pier already.

Edited by RolandKol

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The wedge for a pier or tripod is extra, not included in the price of the head.

I haven't disclosed the price quoted to me as I believe this is only revealed to people who have a confirmed interest.

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