NEQ6 altitude adjustment very stiff

[Astrokev]

Hi All

Now that I have my NEQ6 permanently mounted, I want to spend time getting the polar alignment as accurate as possible, but have a frustrating problem -

The altitude axis is incredibly stiff. This is nothing to do with the problems some have encountered with the alt adjustment bolts bending (as an aside, I have "upgraded" alt bolts, although these are pretty rubbish to be fair, with the threads being a poor fit compared to the standard bolts, and the metal showing signs of rust - very poor value for money in my opinion).

The axis is so stiff that I can remove the alt adjustment bolts completely and the axis supports my scope and counter weights without budging (not recommended!). This makes fine adjustment of the axis using the bolts really difficult. My method is to slacken the bolts then manually adjust the angle of the head by gripping the head in both arms and exerting a lot of force to move it, until it touches the bolt again. I then check the position through the PA scope and repeat this crazy method until it's correct. Accurate alignment is therefore more down to trial and error.

Has anyone else had the same problem, and can anyone suggest a possible solution? I don't really want to take the plastic cover disks off and loosen the axis bolt, or even take it completely apart, but I don't know what else to try. I can't see that it's possible to lubricate the mating surfaces.

Help!

Many thanks for any suggestions.

Kev

[Z3roCool]

I have this with my NEQ6 Pro also. When I am further South (Drive down to Morocco) it is a lot easier, but when in UK it gets stiff as anything. I have found that the screw is not quite perfectly in line with the thread. I remove and change the angle very slightly and then it goes in fairly well. I have added some lube before now just to help it along.

**EDIT** RolandKol post seems more like what you are having....think mine is just a dodgy thread

Edited March 25, 2019 by Z3roCool

[RolandKol]

yep.. it sounds, like... unfortunately, you will need to remove the altitude cap and loosen 3 bolts which tightens or even Locks ALT movement.

On another hand, you can try to lower head South as and try to adjust North direction only.. with tiny adjustments trying Not over-adjust....

I would go for the second option initially and very carefully!

Edited March 25, 2019 by RolandKol

[RolandKol]

P.S. I was made to do it as my Atl Bolt damaged the thread in the Mount!

Your new ones, can do the same!

So I had to re-thread the mount!  was quite a painful task... However, I also loosened these 3 bolts to make ALT adjustments easier, so I would not damage the Thread again.

Once Polar Aligned, I tightened them back

Edited March 25, 2019 by RolandKol

[Astrokev]

14 minutes ago, RolandKol said:

P.S. I was made to do it as my Atl Bolt damaged the thread in the Mount!

Your new ones, can do the same!

So I had to re-thread the mount!  was quite a painful task... However, I also loosened these 3 bolts to make ALT adjustments easier, so I would not damage the Thread again.

Once Polar Aligned, I tightened them back

Ouch that sounds painful. 

Loosening the 3 screws sounds the way to go  

Can you suggest how to remove the cover without breaking it?

[RolandKol]

2 minutes ago, Astrokev said:

Ouch that sounds painful. 

Loosening the 3 screws sounds the way to go  

Can you suggest how to remove the cover without breaking it?

I used a heatgun... failed... as damaged the plastic... it is very sensitive... Heatgun had no impact for several minutes, but once got a bit closer... plastic warped... 

One, much more clever solution (which another forum member used, sadly I was not so inventive), to use a strong metallic wire or fishing line and cut it out.

[Dr_Ju_ju]

If its held on with an adhesive, try brushing some paintbrush cleaner around the covers, leaving for a while then gently try to prying off with a thin kitchen pallet knife...

Edited March 25, 2019 by Dr_Ju_ju

[Astrokev]

1 hour ago, Dr_Ju_ju said:

If its held on with an adhesive, try brushing some paintbrush cleaner around the covers, leaving for a while then gently try to prying off with a thin kitchen pallet knife...

Thanks. That sounds worth a try. I know they're easily broken!

[Davey-T]

You could go mad and buy one of these, it comes with new caps.

Dave

https://www.modernastronomy.com/shop/accessories/mount-accessories/eq6rail/

[Astrokev]

49 minutes ago, Davey-T said:

You could go mad and buy one of these, it comes with new caps.

Dave

https://www.modernastronomy.com/shop/accessories/mount-accessories/eq6rail/

I'm not quite that mad. I don't have a bendy bolt problem so it seems rather pricey just for a couple of caps!

I'll try and soften the adhesive and see if I can gently prize the caps off. If they break, well, so be it! It's a shame it's not possible to get (sensibly priced) replacements. 

Edited March 25, 2019 by Astrokev

[RolandKol]

7 minutes ago, Astrokev said:

I'm not quite that mad. I don't have a bendy bolt problem so it seems rather pricey just for a couple of caps!

I'll try and soften the adhesive and see if I can gently prize the caps off. If they break, well, so be it! It's a shame it's not possible to get (sensibly priced) replacements. 

 

as per caps, - you do not need to remove both!

Only the one which has degrees on it! The main one, - the one, you actually use for PA!  hehe

(Sometimes, to strangle the engineer, is NOT a Crime!)

Edited March 25, 2019 by RolandKol

[Astrokev]

6 minutes ago, RolandKol said:

the link is for the ALT adjustment Rail, which has Blue caps for replacement included

as per caps, - you do not need to remove both!

Only the one which has degrees on it! The main one, - you actually use for PA!  hehe

(Sometimes, to strangle the engineer, is NOT a Crime!)

Yes, sorry if I wasn't clear. My point was that I don't need the adjustment rail (not yet anyway ?) so to buy this product would in essence be paying £129 for just the caps. 

Good point about only needing to remove one cap to loosen the grip on the alt axis. I better make sure I try and remove the correct one ?

Edited March 25, 2019 by Astrokev

[RolandKol]

8 minutes ago, Astrokev said:

Yes, sorry if I wasn't clear. My point was that I don't need the adjustment rail (not yet anyway ?) so to but this product would in essence be paying £129 for just the caps. 

Good point about only needing to remove one cap to loosen the grip on the alt axis. I better make sure I try and remove the correct one ?

hrrr, I was late to delete that sentence!

Anyway, good luck with adjustment!

keep in mind, once you will be ready to tighten them back, go round slowly, bolt by bolt with the more or less the same tension.

As I have damaged my cap, - I simply locked the mound in ALT.  
And it's nice I have noticed your topic, as I am planing to go to the astrocamp!

I would have forgotten to loosen them before ALT adjustment with a key left at home in the "lab"!!!

Edited March 25, 2019 by RolandKol

[Yawning Angel]

Isopropanol may well soften it enough to persuade it to pop. It's always been good at removing leftover sticky from labels etc. It evaporates clean away, and is safe on electrics. Should be about £5 in a pump spray for the 99% grade

[Astrokev]

3 hours ago, Yawning Angel said:

Isopropanol may well soften it enough to persuade it to pop. It's always been good at removing leftover sticky from labels etc. It evaporates clean away, and is safe on electrics. Should be about £5 in a pump spray for the 99% grade

Thanks. I wondered whether acetone may be any good (nail varnish remover?). Tricky without knowing what type of glue they use. I'm guessing it's a rubber type adhesive. 

[JamesF]

Warming it with a hairdryer (rather than a heatgun) might help?

James

[Astrokev]

48 minutes ago, JamesF said:

Warming it with a hairdryer (rather than a heatgun) might help?

James

My hairdryer (not that I use it!) could melt lead ? so I'd have to be careful, but definitely worth a try. A multi-assault approach is probably called for!

From memory (I can't be bothered to go into the observatory to check) the disks are slightly recessed into the mount facing, so may be tricky to get a blade behind the disk to ease it off. Quite looking forward to this, but then I'm a bit sad  

Edited March 25, 2019 by Astrokev

[RolandKol]

Yes, these bloody caps are a bit recessed...

[Yawning Angel]

I’d stick with isopropyl, it’ll not lift the paint off the mount - acetone might not be so forgiving ?

I think @Rattler tried heating his with limited success, and ended up using a pallet knife?

[Juicy6]

No need for chemicals. Use an Exacto knife with snap-off blades and slowly work around the rim. I have removed 4 caps this way. Drill 3 holes over the adj bolts to have access to them later on.

Christer, Sweden

[Astrokev]

Well, today was the day. 

Decided to try and remove the disk using just a craft knife whilst heating it with a hairdryer. 

After several minutes I didn't seem to be getting very far and I was about to give up - the recess was making it very difficult to get the knife under the edge of the disk, and the heat didn't seem to be doing anything. My efforts also started to scratch the white paint around the edge of the disk. But then I managed to get the tip of the knife under and was able to gradually wiggle and twist it until the full width of the blade went under the edge. It was then a matter of working my way around whilst continuing to apply heat. After another 5-10 minutes the disk popped off, without any damage at all. The paint around the edge is slightly scratched in places but nothing to overly concern me. 

My PC is in the repair shop being fixed, so I'm posting this from my phone. Below is a picture of the mount after removing the disk. No idea how big this image will be since I haven't been able to adjust the size for the web!

I've loosened the three Allen bolts one quarter of a turn, and the head now moves in altitude much more easily. Result! ?

Next job is to drill three holes in the disk to allow future access to the bolts, and then to reattach the disk. I'll do this tomorrow. 

Thanks @Juicy6 for this idea ??

[Yawning Angel]

Fantastic result! I wonder if it's possible to make up a template for others with this problem to drill the plate without removing it? 0 seems to line up with the top bolt hole?

[RolandKol]

Nice Idea!

I will prepare a 3d print replacement cap with a place for the small Allen key holder inside (so I will never forget it ever again!), plus the drawing will have the exact measurements of the holes for the original cap drilling task.

Will share later on, once finish and test, as I never succeed to create a successful model from the first attempt!

Edited March 27, 2019 by RolandKol

[Astrokev]

1 hour ago, Yawning Angel said:

Fantastic result! I wonder if it's possible to make up a template for others with this problem to drill the plate without removing it? 0 seems to line up with the top bolt hole?

Great idea Alex. I'm sure there must be lots of users who have similar difficulties.  I'll post another pic once I've reattached the cap with the hole mod, just so folks can see how it looks. 

Edited March 27, 2019 by Astrokev

[Astrokev]

Here's the cap back on the mount. I reattached with 3 small double sided foam pads. Once I'm finally happy that everything works, and I won't need to remove the cap again, I may glue it back on with rubber based adhesive. 

The 3 holes are fairly inconspicuous and allow easy access to the grub screws to loosen / tighten as required. I marked the hole positions direct from the mount using a simple paper template, and then stuck this to the cap with tape. They drilled out very easily using a hand drill. From memory the bit was around 4mm to accommodate the 2.5mm Allen key.

 

Edited March 27, 2019 by Astrokev