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Beginner scope review. Which scope?


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Hello all, 

I'm just contemplating the idea of buying a cheap beginner telescope to review for my Youtube channel. I've recently raised money to move house, so I don't really want to eat too much into that, so I was thinking around £150-250. I think this is also a likely budget of someone starting out. 

It would be nice to do something a bit more helpful and useful for beginners on my channel, and it would give me a scope to play around with as I now have no scopes! 

I'm not 100% on this, but it seems a good idea on the face of it. 

So my question is: which beginner telescope should I buy for review? 

 

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I would like to see Mak 90 - 102 reviewed.

It's often said that this scope is a bit of "specialist" type of scope that is good on lunar and planetary, and that it is lacking in wide field. With last part I can agree, but I never felt much "boxed in" by my 8" F/6 scope and it is just a tad shorter in focal length compared to those two scopes.

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5 minutes ago, vlaiv said:

I would like to see Mak 90 - 102 reviewed.

It's often said that this scope is a bit of "specialist" type of scope that is good on lunar and planetary, and that it is lacking in wide field. With last part I can agree, but I never felt much "boxed in" by my 8" F/6 scope and it is just a tad shorter in focal length compared to those two scopes.

I had a 102 Mak as it was the best I could afford at the time. Yes, good for moon and planets, but both the FoV and the aperture were too small for most DSO objects, and overall I found it a disappointment. 

FOV - because when you are looking at open clusters, it's a bit like not seeing the wood for the trees - all you see is a lot of stars, you don't see them as 'a cluster'. Example - the Double Cluster isn't - because you can only see one at a time. 

Aperture  - unless you are in a very dark location, there's just not enough light gathering capability to make extended objects stand out. 

I have since picked up a second hand 127mm Mak and it is much better in terms of aperture - though not so much in terms of FoV.  It is my 'holiday' scope, as it is compact enough to take with us.

 

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14 minutes ago, vlaiv said:

I would like to see Mak 90 - 102 reviewed.

It's often said that this scope is a bit of "specialist" type of scope that is good on lunar and planetary, and that it is lacking in wide field. With last part I can agree, but I never felt much "boxed in" by my 8" F/6 scope and it is just a tad shorter in focal length compared to those two scopes.

I agree, the small mak is very much like the old long tube three inch achromats which were the weapon of choice for beginners in the old days.

Alan

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Heritage 130P or Heritage 100P or MAK 102/127 depends on budget

Some fairly good reviews out there but when I started with a very small budget, under £150, I found it really difficult; everyone goes on about bigger the better for light etc. which is great but if you want to start out, go past binos, but really have little to spend at first it's really daunting, love my 100P but to be honest if I had known more I would have gone for the 130P, some good true comparisons of what you would see across different options would also help, plus size, ease of set up, transport etc. take away the astronomy expert and aim at know nothing but enthusiastic; also what you get with scope in terms of eyepieces/ finders - too often reviewers go for "you'll need to upgrade the eyepieces to get the best out of" all good and true but if I can't stretch past £150 and everyone says you'll need to replace and spend more then someone just thinking of starting out may just pass when in reality you can drive the passion for the hobby with what you get in the box to start out

 

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Problem with beginner scopes is that they are usually small, and that is a big minus for beginners.

Experienced observer will put to excellent use even small aperture, but beginners need to gain experience in observing to progress to this stage. That is something you can't learn by reading about it, one actually needs to spend time under stars to hone their observing skills.

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What about a supermarket 70mm refractor? Yes, I know, but... I re-started my interest in astronomy with a 70x700 refractor kit from Lidl (see my sig pic) which cost about £70.  Some people have posted favourable results with these, but  my eventual conclusion some years later was that the tripod and mount were worth the trivial price on their own (not that this meant I liked an EQ-2 clone much) and the accessories were all okay, it was just the objective lens that was rubbish. Maybe I got a Friday afternoon one. 

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15 minutes ago, Cosmic Geoff said:

What about a supermarket 70mm refractor? Yes, I know, but... I re-started my interest in astronomy with a 70x700 refractor kit from Lidl (see my sig pic) which cost about £70.  Some people have posted favourable results with these, but  my eventual conclusion some years later was that the tripod and mount were worth the trivial price on their own (not that this meant I liked an EQ-2 clone much) and the accessories were all okay, it was just the objective lens that was rubbish. Maybe I got a Friday afternoon one. 

Good point, I actually believe that there are no realy bad scopes out there once you get beyond the "toy" prices, you should have seen what my generation had to put up with back in the early 60s.

Alan

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21 minutes ago, Cosmic Geoff said:

What about a supermarket 70mm refractor? Yes, I know, but... I re-started my interest in astronomy with a 70x700 refractor kit from Lidl (see my sig pic) which cost about £70.  Some people have posted favourable results with these, but  my eventual conclusion some years later was that the tripod and mount were worth the trivial price on their own (not that this meant I liked an EQ-2 clone much) and the accessories were all okay, it was just the objective lens that was rubbish. Maybe I got a Friday afternoon one. 

I bought a Celestron Travel 70 scope for my nephews, and the scope itself is pretty decent. 

It comes with a 45 degree diagonal for terrestrial use, and a very lightweight tripod, so is of limited astronomical use as provided, but mounted on something more stable, the view is very good - and it has a reasonable field of view.

But, if someone us interested specifically for Astronomy, I think the Heritage 130P (collapsable Dob) as mentioned upthread is a good starter scope 

https://www.firstlightoptics.com/beginner-telescopes/skywatcher-heritage-130p-flextube.html

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21 minutes ago, Cosmic Geoff said:

Some people have posted favourable results with these, but  my eventual conclusion some years later was that the tripod and mount were worth the trivial price on their own (not that this meant I liked an EQ-2 clone much) and the accessories were all okay, it was just the objective lens that was rubbish.

I've generally found the objectives to be acceptably figured (for an achromat) on department store scopes, but the tripod and especially the head (mount) are just plain awful.  Sticky motions, wobbliness once locked down, etc.  The mounts are just cheap photo tripods that aren't really any good for photography, either.  I've spent countless hours at outreach star parties trying to help newbies get these things to work.  Even aligning the finderscope can be a real challenge.  I generally end up suggesting they walk around the field to get an idea of what type of telescope they'd really like to use and tell them to save up for it.

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I'd very much agree with the Heritage 130P. I had 130M on EQ2 as my first scope which did me proud. I always found the reports from the really experienced observers using 130P's really inspiring. People who owned big dobs going out and having great sessions with a scope that was close to mine. I think it was a big factor in me getting the deep sky observing bug. I started to look for things I may otherwise have not believed could be seen in my beginner scope. It also makes a great travel scope so it really is a scope for life, even if aperture fever leads to further scope purchases.

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How about the Skywatcher 130P-DS? I think it comes with adaptors for visual observing and can be used for astro-photography if that is required in the future. Would also be good to get into collimation with this scope as something to be aware of. 

As someone just coming back to the hobby, I think the 130P-DS holds a lot of value and would be good to know more about.

Do you have a link to your youtube channel? 

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The 130p-ds is the same mirror in other 130p telescopes. For me it's about what you see from different type and size telescopes for beginners. The 130p-ds just needs an extension tube before an eyepiece to reach focus for observing as the focus point without is aimed for cameras whereas a straight 130p is for eyepiece.

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I totally agree with @vlaiv

I started not so long time ago and I do remember my thoughts, - THE LARGER the BETTER!

And ended up with my first scope - SW 10" flexitube DOB :)

My vote goes for 130PDS!

 

Edited by RolandKol
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Judging by the scopes that turn up at the "scope surgeries" that my astro society holds, the Celestron AstroMaster 130 EQ's seem to catch many beginners eyes and are a popular 1st "proper" scope purchase.

 

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For some reason, most people in this thread think in terms: "what is the best beginner scope".

I think that OP had in mind something along the lines: "What would be a good beginner scope that is often overlooked, but would be worth having review on it as some people might purchase it based on some criteria that is important to them"?

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49 minutes ago, happy-kat said:

Or is it that those new users have the most troublesome first scope hence you see them more than other first telescope users who choose differently.

The main issue with the AstroMasters is their poor finder. Once that is replaced / improved, the rest of the scope seems to work pretty well for the budget. Newcomers also find equatorial mounts non-intuative to use so need some guidance in setting them up and moving the scope around but thats EQ mounts generally, not just the AstroMaster.

One subject that could do with a bit more "air time" is how to make the best of a less than optimum initial purchase, eg: bird-jones designs, 76mm newtonians and that sort of thing.

 

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Just a quick skim read through, I'm looking forward to replying in full once the family chores are taken care of :)  Thanks for everyone's thoughts so far! :) 

I will say, vlaiv has a point! There are some scopes that have plenty of reviews all ready, so is there something suitable for beginners that isn't getting the limelight? 

@FLO Wow! that's a really wonderful offer! :) I honestly don't mind just buying it, especially if it's at the cheaper end. I could then donate it to a school or astro society once I've reviewed it fully. I will certainly give your kind offer some serious thought, thank you :) 

Looking forward to replying to peoples thoughts......is that the dinner burning! ? 

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1 hour ago, happy-kat said:

Or is it that those new users have the most troublesome first scope hence you see them more than other first telescope users who choose differently.

That's an interesting point. My experiences with the Celestron 130EQ was "an education" and it wasn't all down to the useless finder, but a review of a particular item or scope shouldn't automatically be - "this is a brilliant scope - buy it".  Maybe, because the Celestron 130EQ is such a popular first buy - a good warts and all review would indeed be useful. To add to that, a side by side comparison between the 130EQ  and the Heritage 130p would be very interesting. Two 130 F5  reflectors but different in everything  but the basics. If FLO would oblige with equipment (and I appreciate that its  very decent thing thing to offer one scope let alone two) I think that review would be very useful to first time buyers.

Edited by Alfian
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Thanks for starting this  thread Chris.

I have been asked to give a 45 minute talk on beginners scopes and what you can expect to see at a whole day conference being held in July to celebrate the 50th anniversary of Apollo 11.

I like the beginners statement made by FLO on their website - https://www.firstlightoptics.com/beginner-telescopes.html

For my part I still believe that the best beginners scope for the money is the Heritage 130P

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6 hours ago, happy-kat said:

Heritage 130P or Evostar 90 on Az3 then there is the 150 dob but I think your budget should be £150 which rules out the 150 dob.

Hi, putting myself in the shoes of someone just testing out the hobby, I agree maybe the budget should perhaps be closer to £150. I might cap the budget off at around £180-200 rather than £250.  

I did own the SW 150p f/8 Dob for over a year and tested it against a 150p f/5 for planetary observing. The 150p f/8 Dob was the clear winner. You could tell the optical figure was good because of how it soaked up the mag but still remained sharp, and with the smaller central obstruction contrast was high. I do see this as a step up from a beginner scope though, in fact I feel it could be all the planetary lunar scope a more experienced observer could ever need. 

I also owned the Evo90 AZ3  some years back, and loved the OTA but found the mount good in some ways and frustrating others. I didn't like how the slow mo's came to a hard stop which you need to reset. And it wasn't a very well balanced anywhere near zenith. I see that some people mod this mount with a counter weight bar which I feel would improve it, but I'm just not sure about it for beginners having owned one. I think now there might be better options without hard stops.   

Maybe an EQ2 would be better? I admit,  you need to learn where Polaris is and point the axis in that direction which isn't as easy as just plonking an AZ3 down, but once done you have a balanced scope and no hard stops on the slow motion control. also the option to ad the RA drive so they can share their experience. I'm just thinking out loud though. 

The Heritage 130p is a great scope and probably the best bang for buck for any beginner, however, there are lot of reviews out on that one. with good reason. I'm just wondering about the value of adding another? 

   

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Over here, I also see lots of Celestron Firstscopes on Craigslist.  They have an f/4 spherical primary.  They actually have been reviewed here.  It would be difficult to find a better telescope for $50, though.

Here's the same reviewer's Barska Starwatcher 400x70mm telescope review that is the same scope as the one I linked to the picture above.  I do recall the primary objective being mediocre, but it was still the best optical/mechanical part of the scope.  He (Zane Landers) even reviewed the dreaded Celestron Astromaster 114EQ.

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