Vixen HR's VX10

[jetstream]

These 2 eyepieces continue to amaze me and tonight in the VX10 (excellent optics) was no exception. I started out lunar observing with the Leica Asph zoom/VIP combo and soon realized this mag was not enough- back in the house for the 3.4mm HR- still razor sharp- here we go I should have had the 15" out in this seeing. Back in the house for the 2.4mm HR- same again razor sharp at 500x... and it could take more.

I put the 2.4mm in the VIP barlow- no idea what mag but it was very high- zero breakdown. I pulled the 2.4mm back to increase the barlow effect- this dim image was still excellent.

If anyone knows the field stop location in the 2.4mm HR I'd like to know or maybe someone already knows how much mag the 2.4 HR/VIP produces? BTW tonight is -25c, with the breeze bringing things down below -30c and with very steady upper skies. The VX10 was accurately collimated with the Catseye sight tube and cheshire and cooled for an hour.

[mikeDnight]

Your passion for the HR's is very encouraging Gerry, and on the basis of your posts regarding this eyepiece I've got a 2mm on the way. A 2mm eyepiece in a 100mm scope may seem silly to some but my scope comes to life at high powers. Ive made numerous observations of Mars while it was loitering around 4 arc seconds diameter and seen plenty of detail with a large image scale produced by a 2.5mm LV, so a 2mm HR giving me X370 should be a worthy acquisition.

I believe you can get an exact magnification for your HR VIP combo by accurately measuring the exit pupil. Perhaps someone on here will be able to show the math, which is very simple. Measuring the exit pupil accurately is the difficult part!

[Littleguy80]

The Vixen HR's seem to be top notch eyepieces. I'm going to go slightly off topic and hope that's ok with you! Your comment on collimating with Catseye sight tube caught my eye. I've never been very happy with collimating the secondary. I'm really just using the primary mirror clips reflection to decide if it's ok or not, which doesn't feel very precise. I had a read of the catseye telecat xls instructions. That seems to be a better solution though quite expensive. I use a chesire for primary collimation which I'm much happier with. I can too this pretty confidently in the dark with a red light torch now. What are your thoughts on secondary collimation? At F4.7, will the extra precision be significant? 

[jetstream]

5 hours ago, Littleguy80 said:

What are your thoughts on secondary collimation? At F4.7, will the extra precision be significant? 

I always have my scopes accurately collimated Neil and I'll say that Glatters Tublug is accurate but not quite as accurate as the Catseye Cheshire IMHO.

You can easily show yourself the effects of collimation by de collimating and then viewing the results on an object such as the moon or DSO. Go in small steps to see where changes take place. Before buying the hvy binoviewers I made a weight to simulate the unit so I could check collimation as I racked the focuser out- I noticed de collimation due to focuser sag starting about 1/2 way up the travel. I then set the binos up to focus in the first third of travel... with stunning results.

Many say that secondary collimation affects illumination- have you noticed that if you tweak the secondary the primary might go out a bit? they say that is an iterative process and with good reason.

Btw, I use Glatters laser/Tublug after centering the sec with the Catseye sight tube in the 15" for most viewing but the Catseye cheshire will show a need for a tiny tweak...

The precision offered by the Catseye will show an improvement if you are off in the first place... maybe you are good though? Try de collimating Neil...

[jetstream]

7 hours ago, mikeDnight said:

Your passion for the HR's is very encouraging Gerry, and on the basis of your posts regarding this eyepiece I've got a 2mm on the way. A 2mm eyepiece in a 100mm scope may seem silly to some but my scope comes to life at high powers. Ive made numerous observations of Mars while it was loitering around 4 arc seconds diameter and seen plenty of detail with a large image scale produced by a 2.5mm LV, so a 2mm HR giving me X370 should be a worthy acquisition.

I believe you can get an exact magnification for your HR VIP combo by accurately measuring the exit pupil. Perhaps someone on here will be able to show the math, which is very simple. Measuring the exit pupil accurately is the difficult part!

I love these eyepieces on many levels Mike- low scatter, great resolution,fantastic contrast, light, great eyerelief and most importantly the views! I like knowing my optics chain won't break down before my seeing and my favorite scopes, diags and eyepieces give me this.

Congrats! I'm very interested in the results with these eyepieces in a top doublet such as your Tak. I know this- under great seeing and testing a system that breaks down early with the HR's-its the scope...

My Zeiss zoom is extremely sharp on axis until near the end of its travel and then breaks down (a small amount)- and I use these eyepieces to show it. Great to know its not my scope! Thanks for the info- I would like to find a diagram for the HR's so I can calc the barlow effect with the VIP ie the fs location in relation to the shoulder.

Just for info- my 15" with the 2.4mm HR supports 761X on the moon- and could take more.

[Stardust1]

Gerry, great post!

I have enjoyed my Vixen HR 2mm and 2.4mm as well. Last summer we had one night of  perfect seeing early in the morning. I observed the whole night until sun rise. The seeing got better and better. I got memorable views with the Tak FS-102 and Vixen HR 2 and 2.4mm on the moon. I couldn't believe the magnification on the moon even with the Vixen 2x barlow between. The image did get darker, yes, but still acceptable with this crazy high magnification,  820X on the moon with a 102mm. 

[jetstream]

7 minutes ago, Stardust1 said:

Gerry, great post!

I have enjoyed my Vixen HR 2mm and 2.4mm as well. Last summer we had one night of  perfect seeing early in the morning. I observed the whole night until sun rise. The seeing got better and better. I got memorable views with the Tak FS-102 and Vixen HR 2 and 2.4mm on the moon. I couldn't believe the magnification on the moon even with the Vixen 2x barlow between. The image did get darker, yes, but still acceptable with this crazy high magnification,  820X on the moon with a 102mm. 

Thanks, I like hearing about these successful high mag observing sessions. For me real world scope performance is the true indicator of optical quality and when the seeing co incides with these optics the sights are jaw dropping. I've heard the FS Taks are superb, very nice set up Stardust1.

[Stardust1]

Thank you Gerry!

The Vixen HR eyepieces are excellent. For the moon I do like the Vixen HR over the Pentax XO. The XO which gives excellent contrast, but lacks the eye relief of the HR. The short eye relief of the XO is not a problem on the planets but on the moon it's less comfortable to use. Yes, the Tak doublets are superb with sharp and contrasty views. 

By the way how do you like your  VIP barlow? Have you noticed any image degradation? 

[jetstream]

The VIP works very well with no degradation at all- if anything it improves some eyepieces (mind you any good barlow might). I use it with Leica and Zeiss zooms primarily and the views are excellent. The Docter 12.5mm UWA also loves this barlow.

XO's.... always wanted these- how do the Vixen HR's compare? scatter, contrast and sharpness? Thanks, Gerry

[Stardust1]

Hi Gerry, The VIP is excellent barlow. I love the modular design of the VIP, especially when I remove the two spacers. It doesn't add too much length to the eyepiece.

I have compared the XO 2.5mm to the HR 2.4mm on a few occasions with the FS102. To my eye the XO is just a tiny bit sharper and gives a tiny bit more contrast. The HR is more comfortable to view through. The XO gives more neutral color. But what surprised me is that the HR 2mm doesn't give much to the HR 2.4mm. The XO's are excellent on Jupiter. I prefer the HR for Saturn and the moon. It's a toss up, I would be happy with either.

I have never tried the Zeiss zoom. I had a Leica zoom for a short period and was hoping to replace my Pentax XW eyepieces with it. What I noticed is that the eye placement is more critical with the Leica compared with the XW. I would love to try the Docter 12.5mm some day.

 

[Pig]

I also love the HR I have Gerry, and I have also used it in the VIP.  Even with these crazy high mags the views are crystal clear and bright ?

[JeremyS]

I enjoyed hearing of your experiences of the Vixen HR's with the FS102 @Stardust1

When you say 

1 hour ago, Stardust1 said:

But what surprised me is that the HR 2mm doesn't give much to the HR 2.4mm.

do you mean that the HR 2mm was a slight improvement on the HR 2.4mm? I guess from your previous comments this was on the Moon. Have you tried on the planets?

[Stardust1]

Thank you Jeremy!

I use the HR most of the time on the Moon and sometimes on the planets. On the planets the HR gives too much magnification with the FS-102 and I don't see any additional details over the 5mm XO. Though it's fun to use. If the seeing cooperates I hope to use it on Mars on the next opposition, as Mars can take high magnification opposed to Jupiter. 

On the Moon I don't see image degradation with the 2 HR opposed to 2.4 HR. Logically one would say one should see, but I don't see it. I thought that BillP had the same experience with the HR eyepieces.

By the way the HR eyepieces are very nice if you love double stars.

[jetstream]

4 hours ago, Stardust1 said:

I prefer the HR for Saturn and the moon.

Thanks for the info

When I purchased the TSA120 and also the HRs, the 2 targets I thought would really suit this combo are Saturn and the moon- exactly your experience with these. I'm going to try the 2mm HR to find out where my seeing limit is using the 15"- if the image doesn't break down at 914x I'll be jumping up and down with joy. Seeing at this level is not infrequent but not everyday either. So far 761X is the max using the 2.4mm.

btw, using either the barlowed Docter or the zooms the views of Jupiter and Saturn between 400x and 500x are spectacular. I can't wait for the planets to climb back up. The Docter 12.5mm is superb and I consider it the only widefield "orthoscopic" eyepiece in existence.

If XO's or ZAOII were available new I would buy them to try - you have very nice optics Stardust1!

[Stardust1]

You will love the TSA120, it's a stunning sharp scope. I have memorable memories of Jupiter in excellent seeing with the TSA120 at 180X.

I have only one time witnessed the glory of Saturn at 483X in a Mewlon 210 in excellent seeing. I got the feeling as if I was looking at a Hubble photo, but scaled down.

When I want comfort viewing Jupiter I do prefer the Tak LE 5mm over the XO 5mm. But when the seeing permitting and want to squeeze all the detail out the XO excels.

I do have a pair of 16mm ZAOII for binoviewing which are joy to view through, especially on the Moon. I had the 10mm ZAO which I loved, traded for 6mm ZAO which I didn't like. Traded the 6mm ZAO with the XO 5mm which I love.

 

[mikeDnight]

On 19/01/2019 at 17:59, Stardust1 said:

You will love the TSA120, it's a stunning sharp scope. I have memorable memories of Jupiter in excellent seeing with the TSA120 at 180X.

I have only one time witnessed the glory of Saturn at 483X in a Mewlon 210 in excellent seeing. I got the feeling as if I was looking at a Hubble photo, but scaled down.

When I want comfort viewing Jupiter I do prefer the Tak LE 5mm over the XO 5mm. But when the seeing permitting and want to squeeze all the detail out the XO excels.

I do have a pair of 16mm ZAOII for binoviewing which are joy to view through, especially on the Moon. I had the 10mm ZAO which I loved, traded for 6mm ZAO which I didn't like. Traded the 6mm ZAO with the XO 5mm which I love.

 

It's interesting you love the 5mm LE so much! I heard great things about the 5mm many years ago and so I bought one. Sadly the 5mm LE and I didn't get along, as when the moon was completely out of the field of view, the ghost of it in intricate detail was still visible through the eyepiece. Ive never experienced that with any other eyepiece, though my 3.6mm Hi LE did have a ghosting problem, though not nearly as bad as the 5mm LE. I'm now wondering if this is a design floor or whether I'd just managed to get the one duff 5mm LE in existence? I love the 18mm LE and it doesn't ghost!

[Stardust1]

Mike,

My 5mm LE had ghosting issues as well, though not sure how severe it was compared with your 5mm. I still have the LE 7.5mm and 30mm. I will check next time about ghosting and how severe it is. I haven't noticed with the 30mm, but I will double check. The LE 7.5mm is the old engraved with green lettering on it. The LE 30mm is the new white painted lettering on the eyepiece.

I wasn't fond about the LE 5mm when observing the Moon. I used the 5mm LE most of the time on Jupiter and Saturn. Did you observe Saturn and Jupiter with your LE and FC100DC?

[Stu]

Bother it. My finger just slipped on a 2.4mm. Will report back soon!

[John]

20 minutes ago, Stu said:

Bother it. My finger just slipped on a 2.4mm. Will report back soon!

ENS ?

[dannybgoode]

46 minutes ago, John said:

ENS ?

No, my finger slipped on that

[Stu]

48 minutes ago, John said:

ENS ?

No, new one from FLO

I got impulsive

[dannybgoode]

39 minutes ago, Stu said:

No, new one from FLO

I got impulsive

We’ll have to compare notes. With my new thirst for lunar obs and now having a scope that’ll take the magnification I got impulsive too. ?

[mikeDnight]

1 hour ago, Stardust1 said:

 

I wasn't fond about the LE 5mm when observing the Moon. I used the 5mm LE most of the time on Jupiter and Saturn. Did you observe Saturn and Jupiter with your LE and FC100DC?

Sadly not! I used the 5mm LE with my FS128. I sold the eyepiece very soon after buying it as the ghost image of the Moon irritated me so much. I enjoyed using the Hi LE's with the FS128 and bought a second 3.6mm after selling the first, for use with my FC100DC. The second 3.6mm Hi LE also had ghosting, though not as strong as the 5mm LE.I've since sold that too!

May be I'm just not well suited to the LE, as after buying the 30mm for use with my FC, I found the eye lens situated too far down the barrel for comfort. Then there was the rubber eye cup that also restricted the view even further.  The 30mm soon got the elbow after my friends 32mm volcanoe top erfle knocked the socks of the Tak 30LE with regards to both comfort and edge correction. As a consequence I'm a little cautious about Takahashi's reputation for great eyepieces. 

I could be wrong, but I am under the impression the LE design is a pseudo Masuyama, the same as Celestron Ultima's, Orion Ultrascopic's, Parks Gold and Baader Eudiascopics. All of the latter I value highly and have not as yet noticed any ghost images, so what's different about the LE I have no idea? I wait to be educated by those who know better than I! 

[Stardust1]

44 minutes ago, Stu said:

No, new one from FLO

I got impulsive

Congrats, you will love the Vixen HR 2.4mm. It's sharp and comfortable to use.

[JeremyS]

57 minutes ago, Stu said:

I got impulsive

Nothing wrong with that Stu ?