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Geoff Barnes

Pursuing the Horse.

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7 hours ago, scarp15 said:

Assuming appropriate conditions, without a H-beta filter the Horse Head nebula so far as my experience to date is concerned remains invisible, with a H-beta filter and applying an optimum exit pupil, approximately 4mm (as stated previously with a medium aperture scope i.e. 8" -14") it becomes apparent. The alternative to this is Night Vision technology, which besides being very (very) expensive, would depend whether you prefer those distant travelled photons reaching your line of vision and accepting a more challenging observation, or an electronically presented image. Incidentally a H-beta filter is equally effectively advantageous with smaller aperture scopes - on bright nebula such as the California, when a larger exit pupil is applied.

Picking up on the night vision electronically presented image, one of my concerns before purchasing my NV monoculars was that the visual views would be too artificial and electronic looking.

However, the resolution on the monoculars is higher than the eye can distinguish and importantly my monoculars allow the ‘gain’ to be adjusted to suit my preference (which varies from object to object and dark site vs LP site).

By turning the gain down you can get views that seem like you are viewing through normal glass with no artificial feel to them

 

B10ABE22-EB1E-405B-A6AF-9E8C1CA87039.jpeg

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I always found this article gives simple but good advice, again supporting the comments in this thread.

http://home.ix.netcom.com/~bwilson2/barbarasweb/MEyepiece.htm

I've only ever seen HH with NV gear, and very impressive it is too, but I would love to see it with no assistance. I have the right kit; 14" Nichol Optic mirror dob, Lumicon Hb filter and a Zeiss 25mm ortho. Just need to get under some decent sky now, possibly this winter if the clouds ever clear!

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Blimey Gav, I fear I would need to relocate to the deepest darkest Australian Outback to get a naked eye view like that! 😎

Edited by Geoff Barnes

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16 hours ago, scarp15 said:

 

 

Edited by mikeDnight

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1 hour ago, Stu said:

I always found this article gives simple but good advice, again supporting the comments in this thread.

http://home.ix.netcom.com/~bwilson2/barbarasweb/MEyepiece.htm

I've only ever seen HH with NV gear, and very impressive it is too, but I would love to see it with no assistance. I have the right kit; 14" Nichol Optic mirror dob, Lumicon Hb filter and a Zeiss 25mm ortho. Just need to get under some decent sky now, possibly this winter if the clouds ever clear!

You have an Ha filter, Stu? Good to know 😉 

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16 hours ago, scarp15 said:

Just interested to learn what evidence you have for this Mike?

I look towards the zenith and check the visible stars against a star chart. 

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7 minutes ago, GavStar said:

You have an Ha filter, Stu? Good to know 😉 

Hb? Are you wanting to try it in the dob? Could be fun :)

 

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6 minutes ago, Stu said:

Hb? Are you wanting to try it in the dob? Could be fun :)

 

Yes Hb - I’m catching your phone spellcheck disease 😀

Yes I’d love to try it in the dob with my Ethos..👍

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3 minutes ago, GavStar said:

Yes Hb - I’m catching your phone spellcheck disease 😀

Yes I’d love to try it in the dob with my Ethos..👍

Do you know how many times I had to correct dog to dob? 😬😬🤪🤪

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Hmmm, I could point my daytime hydrogen alpha scope upwards and see what we see.... make your 5nm filter look pretty pants! It is f8 which is pretty poor compared to ge speeds we normally want to work at.

As @GavStar says, the new breed of high res  white phosphor tubes with Manila gain control give you as close to a “natural” view as you are likely to get... especially when compared to the “ol fashioned” sparkly green snowy views of older models of night vision.

PEter

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13 hours ago, Littleguy80 said:

As a side note. The thing that gave me confidence that I’d seen the HH was the position of the two stars circled in the SkySafari screenshot below. They were obvious in the eyepiece and confirmed I was seeing the HH in the correct spot. That’s pretty much the FOV I had with Alnitak just outside  

07251416-52A4-40FC-A998-9FCFB2A97A90.thumb.jpeg.bc6ff21ce3ac3f9d1b060b497f13dd7f.jpeg

Yes, I call those two “the pointers”, they always used to guide me into the right spot. Try to follow the line of IC434 away from Alnitak until you pass those two pointer stars (keep them on the edge of the fov), once they leave the fov, reverse and head back towards Alnitak (I always got the HH easier on the way back when I had a C11). It way pretty easy in the 20” either way (although I still had nights of failure even with 20"!).

The use of movement to help your vision spot the black notch is a big help (don’t just sit there staring with a tracking scope) so do nudge/slow slowly around and be prepared for it to be bigger than you expect. In the 20” with ethos 13 at x150 it is a really big black patch.

Your best chance is with top branded Hb filter, although I have seen it with Astronomik UHC and even unfiltered (on occasions) with the 20”!  

It’s a case of learning exactly where it is. The two pointer stars give you the best shot of getting in the right spot.

Also, try for the nearby Flame nebula first , if you cannot see the Flame then you won’t get the HH. You should be able to get the Flame with Hb or UHC (I always found it better with UHC) and even unfiltered on decent nights. 

Alan

p.s. Checking my logs, I see that on 27th December 2016, I saw the tiny notch of the HH using my Borg89 with Ethos 13mm and Astronomik 2" Hb, so it can be done in tiny scopes but it was tiny at only x46 magnification. If you know where it is then you can find it (with patience and skilled eyeball) but the conditions need to be good or great.

Edited by alanjgreen
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On 12/01/2019 at 08:35, GavStar said:

Picking up on the night vision electronically presented image, one of my concerns before purchasing my NV monoculars was that the visual views would be too artificial and electronic looking.

However, the resolution on the monoculars is higher than the eye can distinguish and importantly my monoculars allow the ‘gain’ to be adjusted to suit my preference (which varies from object to object and dark site vs LP site).

By turning the gain down you can get views that seem like you are viewing through normal glass with no artificial feel to them

 

B10ABE22-EB1E-405B-A6AF-9E8C1CA87039.jpeg

Wow.  Just wow ;)

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