5 mW Green laser pointers.

[Louis D]

The only time I've become concerned about laser pointers and astronomy is at astronomy outreach events when unruly kids try to grab laser pointers to point at each other.  They just see them as cool light saber-like toys to play with in the dark without regard for others' vision.

[Paz]

16 hours ago, PhotoGav said:

Which laser pointer do you have? How does it cope in the cold?

Here's a link to an example, this happens to be in the US but exactly the same thing is available in the UK. 

https://m.laserpointerpro.com/303-1mw-532nm-green-laser-pointer-pen-with-key-lock-black-p-2444.html

I don't know how it does in the cold. Mine is always in my trouser pocket when not actually being used and tied to my belt and it doesn't come out often or long enough to get cold.

 

[Hallingskies]

I have had a 5mW laser pointer for years but never use it now.  If you can be arrested, held for 36 hours and have your life generally messed up for not flying a drone near an airport, the same can probably happen to you for not pointing a laser pointer at a aircraft.

Neither do I want to be even vaguely associated with the cretins who do.

[Jkulin]

I had an old 5mW which I dug up last night, only to discover why I had put it away in the first place as I remembered it was broken, so I ordered a new one from here https://ebay.us/RvcIK8 I am not sure if it will be seized at UK Customs, but if I do then it isn't a lot of money to gamble on

[Mr Spock]

Let's get our information right, at least as far as the UK is concerned. Here is a quote from the police:

"Owning a laser pen is not an offence, they are generally used by lecturers to highlight points when making a presentation. The vast majority of shop-bought laser pens will be relatively weak; meaning that exposure to the beam of such products would not result in an eye injury.

The website in 'Related Information' explains the different classes of lasers; classification based upon the power of the laser in question. There are no specific UK laws relating to laser pointers, however, the Health Protection Agency suggests that no laser pens more powerful than Class 2 be available for general sale, due to their potential to cause injury.

Whilst owning a laser pen is not illegal, if a person had one in the street and was using it (or intending to use it) to shine in people eyes, at cars or aircraft etc. then they would be committing an offence and, in the case of cars and aircraft, a particularly serious offence. They may also be personally liable to a Community Protection Notice for anti social behaviour, namely unreasonable behaviour of a persistent or continuing nature which has a detrimental effect on the quality of life of those in the locality."

Here's the website mentioned: https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/laser-radiation-safety-advice/laser-radiation-safety-advice

So, owning a laser is not illegal, however, pointing it at certain things is. Be aware.

[JG777]

On 25/12/2018 at 03:43, SIDO said:

When I first decided to use lasers for targeting due to my having a spinal cord injury I thought of all the hoopla about the danger to aircraft and decided to read up on it to see if any planes have ever been downed or any one had ever been injured by an unintended or intended 5mw laser point, no not ever not even one event only in the movies does such fantasy become reality.

Went to a load of concerts classical, country and rock and roll with lasers  cast about by the thousands with no one caring one iota about their pointing or where, for a couple decades a few concerts a year lasers everywhere, where was the outrage and where is it now.

Starshine a product to laser light your house and property for the holidays with millions sold each year and alot of indiscriminate points by these festive devices at every use, no complaints at all...Zero.

Search light candlepower in the millions used at airports and as advertising gimmics world wide indiscriminately shine planes with these high powered becons often and no one gives a hoot at all ever not in the history of flight itself.

So go use your laser, be respectful, have a blast and ignore those with a passion for fantastical drama ?

 

I get to see the weekly safety reports filed by the pilots of the airline I work for and this airline is one of the biggest. Barely a month goes past without a laser report and sometimes the temporary distraction or blindness,  and the aircraft are not always on approach, final or the zone. They don't know the power of the lasers being used either or whether they are kids, astronomers or otherwise. I guess you are very careful and know the Airways outside of the SIDS and STARS of an airport so considering the Google search has not uncovered a downed plane from a laser and that your very well informed from the Internet there is little or no risk, plus the fact I cannot release that sensitive materiel on this public forum let's just agree this is not "fantastical drama ?" 

 

[Gina]

Thankfully I don't have a use for a laser pointer so don't have one nor will be buying one.  I look on them as dangerous weapons as some can damage eyesight.  I'm not condemning those who do use them as long as they are used sensibly and considerately.

[wheresthetorch?]

I guess they are annoying for astrophotographers if the beam runs across their field of view? 

[John]

2 hours ago, wheresthetorch? said:

I guess they are annoying for astrophotographers if the beam runs across their field of view? 

Yes, indeed.

[Louis D]

2 hours ago, wheresthetorch? said:

I guess they are annoying for astrophotographers if the beam runs across their field of view? 

They are often banned from most non-outreach star parties for this reason.

[MilwaukeeLion]

Local news today.  These morons with a laser aren't helping matters...

 

 

 

[SIDO]

17 hours ago, JG777 said:

I get to see the weekly safety reports filed by the pilots of the airline I work for and this airline is one of the biggest. Barely a month goes past without a laser report and sometimes the temporary distraction or blindness,  and the aircraft are not always on approach, final or the zone. They don't know the power of the lasers being used either or whether they are kids, astronomers or otherwise. I guess you are very careful and know the Airways outside of the SIDS and STARS of an airport so considering the Google search has not uncovered a downed plane from a laser and that your very well informed from the Internet there is little or no risk, plus the fact I cannot release that sensitive materiel on this public forum let's just agree this is not "fantastical drama ?" 

 

Well you can assume the points are highly likely to not come from astronomers, I only am promoting laser use by astronomers here and by no others for any reason not even to tease cats. So I guess one would have to say I am in the pool of the least liberal opinion as to their use and that opinion is perfectly reflected in my posts here, I am very aware of the fools playing with lasers as my posts also indicate so you have not made any " Point" other than you work at an air port and your upset about the fools that are pointing lasers at planes and you think internet searches is all I have to base my opinion. Sounds like mostly drama...I don't think astronomers are your problem. I think an amateur astronomer shouldent have to be worried he or she risks bringing down an aircraft or blinding a pilot just for taking a responsible laser point at Orion. Stating otherwise would be the promotion of unnessesary and unwarrented fear and of course be overly dramatic in the highest regard.

Behavior not to be proud of ?

Note,

No aircraft in laser targeting area means no risk to aircraft.

Using examples of fools with lasers to convince those acting responsibly not to use lasers is not an effective means to diswade those acting responsibly and when this information is used in this fashion it is done so out of it's context and this is why I refer to the way it is presented as dramatic or hoopla...

 

 

[Louis D]

8 hours ago, MilwaukeeLion said:

Local news today.  These morons with a laser aren't helping matters...

 

 

 

Weird, the latest military grade night vision gear automatically limit gain to prevent just such a blinding occurrence on the battlefield.  It sounds like they need to upgrade their gear.

[SIDO]

1 minute ago, Louis D said:

Weird, the latest military grade night vision gear automatically limit gain to prevent just such a blinding occurrence on the battlefield.  It sounds like they need to upgrade their gear.

Yes this occured not far from my location, currently many are using the Starshine Laser Product to speckle their homes in laser light. These devices could be responsible as users don't always make sure there are no stray beams, from the altitude of the chopper when struck this tells me it was a low angle strike and likely from a neighboring Starshine Device. More likely a moron with high tech Christmas lighting by the sounds of it.

[Stub Mandrel]

The response of the eye is far from linear. At best a 5mW laser will appear twice as bright as a 1mW one, is it really worth crossing a safety threshold for such a small gain?

[JG777]

15 hours ago, SIDO said:

Well you can assume the points are highly likely to not come from astronomers, I only am promoting laser use by astronomers here and by no others for any reason not even to tease cats. So I guess one would have to say I am in the pool of the least liberal opinion as to their use and that opinion is perfectly reflected in my posts here, I am very aware of the fools playing with lasers as my posts also indicate so you have not made any " Point" other than you work at an air port and your upset about the fools that are pointing lasers at planes and you think internet searches is all I have to base my opinion. Sounds like mostly drama...I don't think astronomers are your problem. I think an amateur astronomer shouldent have to be worried he or she risks bringing down an aircraft or blinding a pilot just for taking a responsible laser point at Orion. Stating otherwise would be the promotion of unnessesary and unwarrented fear and of course be overly dramatic in the highest regard.

Behavior not to be proud of ?

Note,

No aircraft in laser targeting area means no risk to aircraft.

Using examples of fools with lasers to convince those acting responsibly not to use lasers is not an effective means to diswade those acting responsibly and when this information is used in this fashion it is done so out of it's context and this is why I refer to the way it is presented as dramatic or hoopla...

 

 

Wrong. You can't assume anything with regard aviation safety. If the risk exists you mitigate appropriately. As far as lasers are concerned astronomers can make mistakes as well, anyone can, its just that astronomers are likely to take more care. It does not always need to fall into a malicious category.

I made a point based on real world data, reports filed by our air crew and coordinated by our safety team. You did an internet search.  

It does not upset me, I don't get paid to be upset. You will require more than a condescending statement to knock down a reasoned argument based upon actual facts. That is to say the consensus here in this thread is probably not with you. 

Nevertheless I take note that you have downgraded the issue from fantastical drama to high drama. Some years ago nobody thought that somebody would enter the flight deck, attack the crew, and force the controls of the plane towards a potential catastrophe, but they did, and it proved that just because it had not happened before didn't mean that it couldn't happen. Are you basing your views on a similar theory, or is this out of context high drama?

You will find people here especially careful when using lasers and more likely to educate others rather than participate in unnacountable hyperbole or unnecessary drama as you describe it

Go figure. 

 

 

 

[SIDO]

8 hours ago, JG777 said:

Wrong. You can't assume anything with regard aviation safety. If the risk exists you mitigate appropriately. As far as lasers are concerned astronomers can make mistakes as well, anyone can, its just that astronomers are likely to take more care. It does not always need to fall into a malicious category.

I made a point based on real world data, reports filed by our air crew and coordinated by our safety team. You did an internet search.  

It does not upset me, I don't get paid to be upset. You will require more than a condescending statement to knock down a reasoned argument based upon actual facts. That is to say the consensus here in this thread is probably not with you. 

Nevertheless I take note that you have downgraded the issue from fantastical drama to high drama. Some years ago nobody thought that somebody would enter the flight deck, attack the crew, and force the controls of the plane towards a potential catastrophe, but they did, and it proved that just because it had not happened before didn't mean that it couldn't happen. Are you basing your views on a similar theory, or is this out of context high drama?

You will find people here especially careful when using lasers and more likely to educate others rather than participate in unnacountable hyperbole or unnecessary drama as you describe it

Go figure. 

 

 

 

Now your throwing everything in but the kitchen sink to attack me for not agreeing with you, interesting you assume you are the only one between us working in the airline industry as my current pension is of said and my disability occured on the tarmac.

I never said the airline industry should assume anything I said "you" / because "you" don't represent them any more than I do.

Note,

No aircraft in the laser targeting area means no danger to aircraft, No consensus required ?

This is my last post in this thread on this issue.

 

 

 

[JG777]

8 hours ago, SIDO said:

Now your throwing everything in but the kitchen sink to attack me for not agreeing with you, interesting you assume you are the only one between us working in the airline industry as my current pension is of said and my disability occured on the tarmac.

I never said the airline industry should assume anything I said "you" / because "you" don't represent them any more than I do.

Note,

No aircraft in the laser targeting area means no danger to aircraft, No consensus required ?

This is my last post in this thread on this issue.

 

 

 

Except I am not attacking you. Nor is anyone else. It has been a measured debate and it is of no consequence to me whether you agree with me or not. All I did was challenge your "Fantastical drama" statement based on what I know to be fact related. I also made no assumptions about you, your profession or position in life. I also never claimed to represent the airline industry. What I did was bring some facts to the table based on real data I have seen. You can do the same if you wish.

As for the laser targeting area statement this is like saying you wont be in an accident on an empty motorway. What can possibly go wrong?

[Stu]

This is a useful debate, thanks all for the contributions. Please let's just keep it friendly so we don't have to lock the thread.

Cheers,

Stu

[Hallingskies]

38 minutes ago, Stu said:

This is a useful debate, thanks all for the contributions. Please let's just keep it friendly so we don't have to lock the thread.

Cheers,

Stu

Well said.  

It seems that those of us/you who have and use laser pointers have to think less about what is legal, and more about perceptions of their use.  Unfortunately, I think there is now a risk that anyone seen using a laser pointer will be assumed to be trying to do harm with it.  You can argue the rights and wrongs of that (in a civilised, British way, I hope), but for us in the U.K. that is the reality.  

[Guest]

1 hour ago, Hallingskies said:

Well said.  

It seems that those of us/you who have and use laser pointers have to think less about what is legal, and more about perceptions of their use.  Unfortunately, I think there is now a risk that anyone seen using a laser pointer will be assumed to be trying to do harm with it.  You can argue the rights and wrongs of that (in a civilised, British way, I hope), but for us in the U.K. that is the reality.  

I have found this debate really enlightening. Thankyou for all of the contributions. 

There is unfortunately an increasingly hostile attitude growing in British society where people will express their opinions rudely and in a hostile nature. 

Once, my dog tried to run into the road.

After training him immediately after the incident, I was accused of extreme animal cruelty. This was by the ignorant, i'll informed person shouting out "Hang him". So perceptions formed by ill informed people can liturally form the law. 

 

[Merlin]

I like my laser pointer for locating sky objects. I have a back problem and the pen avoids having to bend.