Do I need the Baader Cloth?

[emadmoussa]

In the process of cleaning my SCT's corrector and a bit of the primary mirror. I've got all the chemicals, but can I still use normal microfibre cloths (used for glasses and camera lenses), or a Baader cloth is worth buying?

It's not the price, I'm just in a hurry to get the scope up and running for this weekend. Clear weather expected, apparently. 

Thanks

[Peter Drew]

I clean my SCT correctors with mildly soapy water and cotton wool balls. No problems so far.    ?

[Stu]

The coatings on the correctors seem to be fairly hard wearing. I cleaned an old C925 which had snail trails all over it and had to use less conventional methods with no problem. I’m sure any soft clean lens cleaning cloth will be fine.

The mirror is another matter though, don’t use Wonderfluid on that, plentybof advise on cleaning mirrors on here or the web, so best to refer to that.

[emadmoussa]

11 minutes ago, Peter Drew said:

I clean my SCT correctors with mildly soapy water and cotton wool balls. No problems so far.    ?

That's what I intend to do initially. Then I'll give it a nice finish with Baader fluid. Not sure why using a cotton for final finish always looks like a cat has licked the optics. 

I intend to mix distilled water, with a drop or two of Fairy and then, perhaps, a drop of Isopropyl alcohol 70%. 

 

[emadmoussa]

2 minutes ago, Stu said:

The coatings on the correctors seem to be fairly hard wearing. I cleaned an old C925 which had snail trails all over it and had to use less conventional methods with no problem. I’m sure any soft clean lens cleaning cloth will be fine.

The mirror is another matter though, don’t use Wonderfluid on that, plentybof advise on cleaning mirrors on here or the web, so best to refer to that.

I do have a spot or two of fungus on the primary, hardly noticeable. But I'd like to eliminate them anyway. So, what should I do? Dab ith soap and water?

[Peter Drew]

I would be happy with that mix for cleaning. For whatever the reason, I've found Wonderfluid to leave the corrector streaky on 12"-16" ones.?

[emadmoussa]

Look at this mess!!

I cleaned the outside already (roughly) and the corrector now looks a bit better. 

 

[JOC]

At the end of the day Wonderfluid is probably just an aqueous mixture containing a cheap mutual solvent being sold at an inflated price.  At the end of the day surely all telescope optics are is glass?  Provided you don't scratch them I should have thought any good brand of solvent based glass cleaner would be fine, personally the cheapest product I found for 'sensitive' glass in the house like TV screens was the TV Deals LCD Screen cleaner that I picked up in Pound Stretchers one day.  A nice sized bottle of clear liquid (must be 200ml + with a cloth with a natural air pressure squirter - I've had it years and it still only half empty - brilliant value and I've cleaned all sort of 'sensitive' glass with it, TV screens, monitors, binocular lenses, camera lenses and I've never had a problem, I should imagine a clear windowline type product would also work, or even a bit of dilute white vinegar (which is what is in window products).  Unless someone else arrives with a good reason not to use any of these on telescopes because they are maybe are not 'regular' glass if I ever needed to clean something I'd use one of these, probably the TV deals product.

[Ruud]

Ouch, Emad! That looks like one of Alexander Fleming's Petri dishes.

The Baader cloth will just gather stuff from one element and spread it onto another. Disposable tissues are better. Kleenex regular has a good reputation: very soft, very clean. 

I prefer: A a blower, a really soft make-up brush if needed, alcohol on surgical cotton balls (real cotton, extremely soft) and Kleenex.

[Davey-T]

14 minutes ago, emadmoussa said:

Look at this mess!!

I cleaned the outside already (roughly) and the corrector now looks a bit better. 

Looks like mildew from getting condensation inside it when stored somewhere cold and damp, best removed as it can carry on growing into bigger spots.

Take it out and try a few things warm soapy water shouldn't hurt it.

Dave

[emadmoussa]

4 minutes ago, JOC said:

At the end of the day Wonderfluid is probably just an aqueous mixture containing a cheap mutual solvent being sold at an inflated price.  At the end of the day surely all telescope optics are is glass?  Provided you don't scratch them I should have thought any good brand of solvent based glass cleaner would be fine, personally the cheapest product I found for 'sensitive' glass in the house like TV screens was the TV Deals LCD Screen cleaner that I picked up in Pound Stretchers one day.  A nice sized bottle of clear liquid (must be 200ml + with a cloth with a natural air pressure squirter - I've had it years and it still only half empty - brilliant value and I've cleaned all sort of 'sensitive' glass with it, TV screens, monitors, binocular lenses, camera lenses and I've never had a problem, I should imagine a clear windowline type product would also work, or even a bit of dilute white vinegar (which is what is in window products).  Unless someone else arrives with a good reason not to use any of these on telescopes because they are maybe are not 'regular' glass if I ever needed to clean something I'd use one of these, probably the TV deals product.

I did actually use screen cleaner on my 12" Reflector mirror. It was fine.

[Stu]

Well, the are not the same as ordinary glass because they are accurately ground and have coatings applied to them. You perhaps need to be a bit more careful with scopes which have fluorite elements.

I have used alcohol free lens cleaner from Specsavers when cleaning my Tak objective which was recommended to me and worked very well.

For the sake of a few pounds, I would always choose something from a supplier that I trust is not going to put some unknown additional 'ingredient' in the bottle. So, I stick with wonderfluid or the specsavers stuff, works fine.

[emadmoussa]

2 minutes ago, Ruud said:

Ouch, Emad! That looks like one of Alexander Fleming's Petri dishes.T

 

I know, right?

[emadmoussa]

I used this on the outside... 

 

https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B07JNLSQQV/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o00_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1 

[paul mc c]

Be carefull if you are taking the corrector plate off to mark the exact position,and replace in that position.

[Davey-T]

Put cleaning telescope corrector plate in the Y'Tube search and it comes up with lots of results.

Dave

[JOC]

50 minutes ago, Stu said:

because they are accurately ground and have coatings applied to them

So they are more like an expensive pair of spectacles then?  In that case I expect any cheap brand of spectacle cleaner would be fine.  I still don't think you need to spend fortunes on a special cleaner just because it's called 'Wonder fluid'  Someone's making a small fortune out of a bottle of dilute solvent that's no doubt mostly water. 

[Carbon Brush]

I support the idea of buying a 'proper' cleaning fluid and microfibre cloth.

As a spectacle wearer for many years I can state with certainty that the supplied cleaning cloth quality and fibre coarseness varies with time and supplier.

A further consideration is that spectacle lenses these days are plastic - not glass. They are intended to last for only a year or two before you go back to the shop for new ones.
I appreciate we do not use and clean our scopes daily, but we do expect them to last longer than a pair of specs.

Spectacle lenses from reputable opticians have very different coating to scopes and cameras.
I have had cracked and crazed coatings from leaving specs in their case on a car dashboard on a sunny day.
I have had coatings turn foggy after exposure to hot water.
I have had coatings part company after exposure to isopropanol - a chemical used with water in scope mirror cleaning.

I have asked opticians several times about maximum temperaure for specs lenses and the answer has always been a variant of 'dunno'. There is nothing published.
So if you wreck some lenses by dropping them into a pan of boiling potatoes and not noticing until serving them up, the supplier cannot say you have abused them and should swap them or free!

To me, a big worry about buying any high street specs cleaner is consistency of recipe.
You have no certainty that today's cleaner that does no harm to coatings will contain the same chemicals next year - despite having the same brand.

Baader fluid and a cloth are a tiny fraction of the cost of a decent scope.

David.

[emadmoussa]

39 minutes ago, Davey-T said:

Put cleaning telescope corrector plate in the Y'Tube search and it comes up with lots of results.

Dave

Yep, I know in theory how to do it. I just don't trust my hands

[JOC]

Here we go http://www.alpineastro.com/Reference_Docs/OW-SafetyDataSheet-P.pdf it would appear to be a mixture of ethanol, propanol and no doubt deionised water.  Surely you can make up something similar for far less cost? 

I know that SDS sheets only need to declare hazardous ingredients, but I find it highly unlikely that the fluid contains anything else.  I would venture that a drop of diluted methylated spirits to a similar concentration wouldn't do much harm either.  Methanol (often used for denaturing) is only 2 carbons less than propanol.  Or even a drop of clear vodka diluted in DI water!  We are mostly scientists here, and I am amazed that so many of you are being swayed by claims of 'Wonder' fluid - it def. sounds a little like 'Magic Snake Oil' IMO LOL.  I'm a scientific chemist by trade and I certainly wouldn't pay a premium for it, esp. given the limited amount of times we are actually advised to clean telescope optics anyway.

[emadmoussa]

14 minutes ago, Carbon Brush said:

 To me, a big worry about buying any high street specs cleaner is consistency of recipe.

You have no certainty that today's cleaner that does no harm to coatings will contain the same chemicals next year - despite having the same brand.

Baader fluid and a cloth are a tiny fraction of the cost of a decent scope.

David.

 

True. I've got a Baader fluid but waiting for the cloth now. Can't take any chances. 

[emadmoussa]

2 minutes ago, JOC said:

  We are mostly scientists here, and I am amazed that so many of you are being swayed by claims of 'Wonder' fluid - it def. sounds a little like 'Magic Snake Oil' IMO LOL.  I'm a scientific chemist by trade and I certainly wouldn't pay a premium for it, esp. given the limited amount of times we are actually advised to clean telescope optics anyway.

 

Well, personally, I can't be bothered mixing chemicals. 

[Stu]

Well, I'm not a scientific chemist and have neither the time nor inclination to go and source this stuff myself. I'm not swayed by it being called wonderfluid, just the knowledge it works. I don't want to be worried about impurities or anything else causing issues, so am happy to pay the premium every now and then (and it really isn't very often). Everyone else is free to make theirown choice of course, based on knowledge and time.

[CraigT82]

15 minutes ago, JOC said:

We are mostly scientists here, and I am amazed that so many of you are being swayed by claims of 'Wonder' fluid - it def. sounds a little like 'Magic Snake Oil' IMO LOL.  I'm a scientific chemist by trade and I certainly wouldn't pay a premium for it, esp. given the limited amount of times we are actually advised to clean telescope optics anyway.

You really think most people who buy this stuff are swayed by its 'wonderous' name,  rather than the positive reviews it gets from hundreds of users?? You obviously don't think a lot of your peers in here!

Personally... the time taken to source, mix and test the constituent ingredients is worth more than the puny cost savings, and hence not worth the effort.

[JOC]

3 minutes ago, CraigT82 said:

You really think most people who buy this stuff are swayed by its 'wonderous' name,  rather than the positive reviews it gets from hundreds of users?? You obviously don't think a lot of your peers in here!

It's not that, but I always have issues when I see big companies making large profits from the sale of pretty basic stuff.  Of course it gets positive reviews from hundreds of users.  They've obviously swayed loads of folks to try it and when they have well clearly it works, but then they would hardly sell something that doesn't and so you get loads of positive reviews - I used it - wonderful stuff - won't buy anything else etc.  The thing is if the first person had tried Bill Bloggs product X first and it had worked then Baader Wonderfluid probably wouldn't have sold as everyone would be raving about Bill Bloggs product X.  The thing is that its really nothing special and there are probably loads of alternatives which would do every bit good a job. 

Still I guess it's not my pocket, and if you want to use it then you absolutely will do no harm, but I won't be buying any myself!