Heritage 100p f/4 (Mini Quattro) EAA experiment

[Chris]

2 hours ago, Demonperformer said:

Well, I guess that is better than wanting to sell-up completely.

Nah   Some good came from it, I got to show that the 100p focuses to infinity with CMOS type astro cams, and that the 100p is 'reasonably' well collimated out the box, but could be improved with a little tweak. 

 

2 hours ago, Demonperformer said:

Also, you got an additional star on the right of the pic (HD 5914 - m6.46?) - I suspect the dot at the bottom is a hot pixel as it also appears on the way-out-of-focus shots. Don't know what your exposure time was like, but I would guess that it was not particularly long for focussing on Polaris. So that would be promising.

Yes, that faint star was really handy for getting a good focus, Polaris was too bright to know when this was achieved. Exposure was less than a second!

 

2 hours ago, Demonperformer said:

I used to try to use my 6/8SE mount with a refractor and found that (for some reason I could never fathom - don't you just hate those?) it would only align if I put the scope into the mount facing what I always considered to be backwards. If I put it in "the right way round" it would always say it was aligned and then head off in precisely the opposite direction. Sounds as if it might be a similar problem? No guarantees, but if the same thing happens next time you try it, you could try removing the ota, turning it round and putting it back on the other way round. Stranger things have worked! [This is assuming that the "last time [you] used it" was with the SE scope, not with this one]

I reckon you could be onto something there, the same thing, said it had aligned then headed the long way round to stuff and ended up about 10-15 degrees out. Worked fine last time with the C5. I'll try putting the 100p the other way round, thanks  

I'll put a bit more effort in before I give up on this venture. 

I was impressed with the 100p's ability to pick out M82 and M81 visually. Framed them both nicely with a 20mm Plossl. 

Edited April 18, 2018 by Lockie

[RobertI]

Well done for finally getting out there Chris and really sorry it didn't go as planned. It's infuriating when technology doesn't do what it's supposed to, especially when observing opportunities are so scarce.  Was it WAY off (like half the sky away) or 'just' a degree or so? EDIT- you've answered this while I was typing.

I've had so many wasted EAA session over the last few years but finally have a setup which I know well and pretty much works each time, as long as I follow the same process. I'd love to upgrade the mount, scope, camera, etc , but even if I did have the funds, I'd be loathe to touch it, so sitcking with a less than perfect setup!

At least you salvaged the evening with some outreach, perhaps you have a budding apprentice there?

I popped out for a quick look before bed but conditions were so nice I ended up staying out until 1pm! This was largely thanks to the Heritage 130P+GiroWR+tripod which was so easy to setup (up and runnig in literally 60 seconds) and performed beautifully. If I had been faced with lugging out the C8, Skytee and 2" tripod, I may well have just gone to bed instead! I'll post a report later on.

Hope you get the goto sorted.

 

[Chris]

On 18/04/2018 at 07:51, RobertI said:

Well done for finally getting out there Chris and really sorry it didn't go as planned. It's infuriating when technology doesn't do what it's supposed to, especially when observing opportunities are so scarce.  Was it WAY off (like half the sky away) or 'just' a degree or so? EDIT- you've answered this while I was typing.

I've had so many wasted EAA session over the last few years but finally have a setup which I know well and pretty much works each time, as long as I follow the same process. I'd love to upgrade the mount, scope, camera, etc , but even if I did have the funds, I'd be loathe to touch it, so sitcking with a less than perfect setup!

At least you salvaged the evening with some outreach, perhaps you have a budding apprentice there?

I popped out for a quick look before bed but conditions were so nice I ended up staying out until 1pm! This was largely thanks to the Heritage 130P+GiroWR+tripod which was so easy to setup (up and runnig in literally 60 seconds) and performed beautifully. If I had been faced with lugging out the C8, Skytee and 2" tripod, I may well have just gone to bed instead! I'll post a report later on.

Hope you get the goto sorted.

 

Thanks Rob, I'm not going to lie it was driving me nuts! I knew time was ticking by and who knows when I can try again. As you say some good came from it with the little out reach session, he really was impressed with Jupiter when I last observed with him but I don't think he'll be buying a scope any time soon so not a convert.

I'm glad you've got a setup that works for you, I know realise how tricky that can be! 

Yes it was such a lovely crisp dark night, glad you got out also, and there is a lot to be said for something you can just grab and plonk down. The 130p giroWR sounds perfect for this, such a light weight setup with decent aperture by my standards at leasts   

p.s. I'm not going to lie, I did have a little thought about selling the lot (apart from the 100p) and using the money to buy a fluorite Tak now FLO are stocking them This probably won't happen I'm always shocked by the price when window shopping  

 

[RobertI]

I can see the appeal of buying a quality piece of kit like a Tak, the ownership experience must be wonderful, and it would be nice just to say you've owned one. £665 is a lot for 60mm of aperture though, though not bad for a Tak I guess?I remember looking through an 80mm  Tak (approx - don't know the exact model) at the ring nebula at Kelling Heath once and being sorely disappointed, but that was just after I had viewed the Veil nebula through 20" dob! They probably cost about the same! 

[Chris]

I reckon it must have been the Tak76 which costs a mere £1,300 to £1,600! depending on the exact model and included kit. Very tricky to justify that much dosh for 76mm of aperture even if it's 76mm of perfect aperture.

I reckon a 20" Dob must be at least 4k and would probably show you 20x more than the Tak from a dark site. Then again, you would probably set up the big Dob 20x less than a little Tak which would even out the odds. 

Fantasy shopping, I don't think I'd go for a Tak76, but I could see the point for either the 60mm or the 100mm. The 60mm is relatively affordable and would be handy as a super finder, travel scope, grab n go on a photo tripod, or for imaging/EEA, and I can imagine you get the warm fuzzy feeling of being a Tak owner. The Tak100 is 2K for the OTA but it's a very useful aperture, and very light weight scope. You could argue that in an urban environment it would be all you needed...ever. 

Then again Synta and WO offer 85% of the above performance per aperture at half the price! 

Anyway, back to EEA.

 

[Chris]

I've had a couple of peeps message me since my last post asking if I've made any kind of progress using the 100p for imaging/EAA. The truth is I hadn't really owing to selling my 5SE goto mount. I currently don't have any kind of tracking mount I can attach the 100p to, but I am on the lookout for one.

These messages did spur me on to doing a little further experimentation, and I've managed to do a bit of testing of the corner stars on the ASI120's chip by pointing the Dob mount that comes with the 100p at Polaris. I was keen to see if the stars remained round across the FOV as you can't really use any kind of coma correction with the 100p's 1.25" focuser.  

Please see the below vid for the results:

 

[Demonperformer]

Looks promising.

[RobertI]

Looks very promising Chris and it's a lot cheaper than a 100mm APO + reducer! Perhaps you could continue the test by piggybacking the scope on the CPC800 for some longer exposures/integrations (when you get it back)? Should be fine for up to 30 seconds in most areas of the sky.

[Chris]

2 minutes ago, RobertI said:

Looks very promising Chris and it's a lot cheaper than a 100mm APO + reducer! Perhaps you could continue the test by piggybacking the scope on the CPC800 for some longer exposures/integrations (when you get it back)? Should be fine for up to 30 seconds in most areas of the sky.

I think the rail needed to attach it to the cpc would cost a fair portion of a basic driven EQ mount, also I want a small EQ mount for the Tak60 anyway. 

I'm wondering if the SA mount would work well will the 100p, I can't see why not? 

[Chris]

p.s. Another thought, I've been looking at Olympus and Panasonic micro four thirds (M4/3) cameras for my video work as they have great in body stability. I wonder if one of those cameras would work with the 100p some how? The sensor is further forward as it's mirrorless, and it's smaller than APC so coma might still be acceptable. I guess it depends on how much length any kind of adaptor would add, as I would need to attach it to the scope some how? 

[Alan White]

I use micro 4/3 Chris and when I tried to use with my scopes found the adapter too long as I needed in focus.

The sensor to mount distance with a 4/3 is much shorter than a traditional dslr.

When I got it to work it was very good. I was using an Olympus EM10 mark 2.

 

[Chris]

34 minutes ago, Alan White said:

I use micro 4/3 Chris and when I tried to use with my scopes found the adapter too long as I needed in focus.

The sensor to mount distance with a 4/3 is much shorter than a traditional dslr.

Thanks, Alan, that ain't going to work with the 100p then lol 

 

34 minutes ago, Alan White said:

When I got it to work it was very good. I was using an Olympus EM10 mark 2.

I was thinking of picking up the EM10 mk1 or EM5, I've heard great things about the IBIS and the EM10 has in camera timelapse which would be really cool. Also looking at Panasonic cameras as the downside to the Olympus is supposed to be poor video which I do quite a bit of, but the budget Pany's don't have the IBIS. It seems hard to get everything you want in just one camera.

Edited August 23, 2018 by Lockie

[Alan White]

2 hours ago, Lockie said:

Thanks, Alan, that ain't going to work with the 100p then lol 

 

I was thinking of picking up the EM10 mk1 or EM5, I've heard great things about the IBIS and the EM10 has in camera timelapse which would be really cool. Also looking at Panasonic cameras as the downside to the Olympus is supposed to be poor video which I do quite a bit of, but the budget Pany's don't have the IBIS. It seems hard to get everything you want in just one camera.

All the Olys have decent Ibis

[Artik]

Sorry for bumping up 5 years old topic.

 

But I wonder about such a setup. I use 60/400 achromat as it is small and lightweight and 400mm FL frames lots of objects very well in my asi224mc and I wonder if I can actually use such a scope as much faster scope. And even if I put for example a small barlow x1.6 I still can get fast enough setup with better "zoom"

Protruding focuser tube can be cut... But what really worries me is collimation. Also secondary can be collimated, but primary isn't... How well is it factory collimated?

Thanks!

Here is my current rig I wish I could make F/4 with 400mm focal length.