Remote imaging experiances

[peter shah]

There are some great arguments here. I'm seeing its more of what you are comfortable calling your own. Could you put it in its own category? Should there be a separate section for Deepsky images obtained by commercial remote scopes??? 

[Allinthehead]

52 minutes ago, peter shah said:

There are some great arguments here. I'm seeing its more of what you are comfortable calling your own. Could you put it in its own category? Should there be a separate section for Deepsky images obtained by commercial remote scopes??? 

That seems to be the argument on Astrobin. Some want categories, others want it to remain as it is. I think you end up making things complicated as often you could have mixed data to make an image. As long as everyone is truthful regarding the source of their data then there shouldn't be a problem. After all, a nice image is a nice image, regardless of the source.

[swag72]

5 minutes ago, Allinthehead said:

That seems to be the argument on Astrobin. Some want categories, others want it to remain as it is. I think you end up making things complicated as often you could have mixed data to make an image. As long as everyone is truthful regarding the source of their data then there shouldn't be a problem. After all, a nice image is a nice image, regardless of the source.

Sadly there are people out there who are far from honest....  

[Allinthehead]

8 minutes ago, swag72 said:

Sadly there are people out there who are far from honest....  

A fact of life. Like the guy that cropped your image and posted it here as his own.

[wxsatuser]

1 hour ago, peter shah said:

Nothing wrong with your processing......The data looks good with a strong signal, which is what you need. Do you think you get enough data in each set?

Not sure on what basis the amount of subs is set, certainly more would'nt hurt.
This is a testing phase and I'm sure Paddy will make sure there is a decent amount for each target.

Gus has now been upgraded with a FLI 16200 camera, was an 8300 and the front optics have been refined by OS
We wait to see what this brings in performance, should be interesting.

I might be tempted to subscribe to Gus as at the moment I'm subscribed to Tim the Borg setup.

[wxsatuser]

40 minutes ago, swag72 said:

Sadly there are people out there who are far from honest....  

That's why I always make sure it's obvious where my data comes from, be it DSW, home or ITU.

 

[geoflewis]

16 hours ago, Demonperformer said:

If it is about imaging being done remotely, why is it all right to image remotely from 20 feet away (from the warmth and comfort of your lounge instead of being outside in the cold) and not from 200/2000 miles away (ditto)?

I think this depends on which meaning of 'remote' was intended by the OP, so perhaps Peter could clarify. My thinking is that it is likely to be one of these...

(of a place) situated far from the main centres of population; distant.

or possibly even...

having very little connection with or relationship to.

rather than just automated, or as in a remote controlled car. Remote meaning not local, or nearby...

I operate my equipment 'remotely' from within the warm room of my observatory some 8 feet away from the pier/mount, or even 100 feet away, from the warmth of my lounge, but I do not even remotely consider it remote....!!

I have only ever once used dowloaded 'remote' data, which was a year or so ago from DSW when they used to make a small data subset available for free, for trial purposes. I don't see that free download option on their site anymore, but I would not be too surprised if Lloyd would share data with a potential genuine customer (I don't know that, just guessing), so that might be a way to find out - surely no harm in asking...

Cheers, Geof

[geoflewis]

49 minutes ago, geoflewis said:

I don't see that free download option on their site anymore

Correction - I just found the link....

http://deepskywest.com/give-away/

 

[peter shah]

1 hour ago, geoflewis said:

I think this depends on which meaning of 'remote' was intended by the OP, so perhaps Peter could clarify. My thinking is that it is likely to be one of these...

(of a place) situated far from the main centres of population; distant.

or possibly even...

having very little connection with or relationship to.

 

A bit of both, so somewhere where there are clear dark skies. Like I said before when its clear here I have some of the best skies you can get, other than it being further North and not being able to see some of the more Southerly objects.

I run my scope remotely already... (meaning) I've set the kit up to run hands free I start by putting together an imaging plan, fill in the boxes with filter types/exposure times and object press Go!,  go to bed and wake up in the morning and the work is done. The telescope is parked and the observatory is closed.... In essence am I already running the observatory remotely? is there a difference being several hundred or thousand miles away? I guess the fact that I set it up myself to be able to do it in the first place and my equipment choice etc. ?

I think with technology advancing so quicky its difficult to make the transition and evolve with the hobby. I wonder when astronomers started to put cameras on telescope was it difficult to adjust and was it thought to be cheating if you didn't have your eye at the eyepiece? is it cheating to let a GOTO mount move the telescope and plate solve? I think these are all things that have advanced the hobby.

[swag72]

10 minutes ago, peter shah said:

A bit of both, so somewhere where there are clear dark skies. Like I said before when its clear here I have some of the best skies you can get, other than it being further North and not being able to see some of the more Southerly objects.

I run my scope remotely already... (meaning) I've set the kit up to run hands free I start by putting together an imaging plan, fill in the boxes with filter types/exposure times and object press Go!,  go to bed and wake up in the morning and the work is done. The telescope is parked and the observatory is closed.... In essence am I already running the observatory remotely? is there a difference being several hundred or thousand miles away? I guess the fact that I set it up myself to be able to do it in the first place and my equipment choice etc. ?

I think with technology advancing so quicky its difficult to make the transition and evolve with the hobby. I wonder when astronomers started to put cameras on telescope was it difficult to adjust and was it thought to be cheating if you didn't have your eye at the eyepiece? is it cheating to let a GOTO mount move the telescope and plate solve? I think these are all things that have advanced the hobby.

So the scenario that would suit you best would be something like physically going to a remote site and setting up your own kit..... staying for a few days to test and make sure it's working.... then take advantage of the on site help at times when required..... then keep a separate rig at home that you can tinker with and use on your fantastic skies when it's clear.... ❓❓❓That's how I read your dilemma 

[RayD]

2 hours ago, Allinthehead said:

A fact of life. Like the guy that cropped your image and posted it here as his own.

I didn't know this.  On this forum someone posted an image which wasn't theirs but claimed it in the open forum as their own work? 

[cfpendock]

On 3/17/2018 at 11:42, Demonperformer said:

no chance of me blaming the data this time

Yes indeed.  That would always be a snag for me......

Chris

[carastro]

Quote

I didn't know this.  On this forum someone posted an image which wasn't theirs but claimed it in the open forum as their own work? 

Apparently so Ray, Sara will know more about it as I believe it was one of her images.

It also happened recently on Astrobin and it was only the sharp eyes of one of the moderators who remembered the original image that it was spotted.  On close inspection, the game was given away by spotting identical very zoomed in satellite trails.

What on Earth do these people get out of doing things like that, if you get imaging rewards and respect you must know in your heart you don't deserve it?

Carole

[ollypenrice]

On 3/17/2018 at 11:31, Tomatobro said:

I saved myself a few bob by going to the Hubble image galley and selecting the item of interest to view. There is no way an earth based remote imaging system can beat these images. Just a few key presses is all it takes.........All from the comfort of my armchair

Is the same argument to be advanced for all our activities? Nobody plays an instrument because the person on the stereo does it better? Nobody gets on their bike because Froome does it better? That's going to lead to a lot of time in the armchair... 

What matters is not the looking but the doing.

Olly

[RayD]

30 minutes ago, swag72 said:

So the scenario that would suit you best would be something like physically going to a remote site and setting up your own kit..... staying for a few days to test and make sure it's working.... then take advantage of the on site help at times when required..... then keep a separate rig at home that you can tinker with and use on your fantastic skies when it's clear.... ❓❓❓That's how I read your dilemma 

Is this not what @Barry-Wilsonand @gnomusdo with E-Eye (I think that is the place) with all their own kit installed by them, and then operated remotely by them, including selecting targets etc?

It's hard enough planning my own remote observatory at my own house in Spain, so kudos to those who go this route.

I think @ollypenrice had it spot on when he said that you always need a "muggins" on the ground to reset something or change a cable etc. which is what makes setting up your own remote site so hard.  This is what I am working hard in trying to overcome now, so the hosting sites are great for this scenario.

[RayD]

3 minutes ago, carastro said:

Apparently so Ray, Sara will know more about it as I believe it was one of her images.

It also happened recently on Astrobin and it was only the sharp eyes of one of the moderators who remembered the original image that it was spotted.  On close inspection, the game was given away by spotting identical very zoomed in satellite trails.

What on Earth do these people get out of doing things like that, if you get imaging rewards and respect you must know in your heart you don't deserve it?

Carole

That's terrible!  What a kick in the teeth for the owner who has probably spent hours and hours of work on it.  I didn't know people did this.

[Demonperformer]

11 minutes ago, ollypenrice said:

That's going to lead to a lot of time in the armchair...

Not so ... because I can do that better! 

[ollypenrice]

Just now, RayD said:

That's terrible!  What a kick in the teeth for the owner who has probably spent hours and hours of work on it.  I didn't know people did this.

This has just come up with a Facebook poster who has posted images, some belonging to SGL members, and attributed them to Hubble. Rather different, but certainly not right. Rather bizzarely he cited his nationality (which nobody knew) as the reason for the criticism. Very odd.

Regarding processing competitions, I don't think they'd be for me. I've been a competitive little tyke most of my life, racing karts, trialling motorbikes, racing bicycles etc etc. I like imaging because t's NOT competitive! But I think an online symposium would be great fun. People could record their steps, explain their thinking etc.

Olly

[ollypenrice]

2 minutes ago, Demonperformer said:

Not so ... because I can do that better! 

I can feel a cartoon coming on: a gymn full of people on rowing machines, running machines, others skipping, doing press-ups, lifting weights, all glued to the telly showing a lardy geezer comatose in his chair. They're saying things like,

'Four days, nineteen hours and 17 seconds - and he hasn't flinched!'

'Nineteen cans of Stellar and twelve pizzas...'

'They say he's got his resting IQ down below 80!'

Olly

 

[peter shah]

1 hour ago, swag72 said:

So the scenario that would suit you best would be something like physically going to a remote site and setting up your own kit..... staying for a few days to test and make sure it's working.... then take advantage of the on site help at times when required..... then keep a separate rig at home that you can tinker with and use on your fantastic skies when it's clear.... ❓❓❓That's how I read your dilemma 

No dilemma really....I originally wanted some feed back to get a better understanding of these systems..... But yes that's what Id like to do.... While I'm in the planning stages I will be buying telescope time from either ITU, iTelescope or like to fill in that gap......

[peter shah]

21 minutes ago, ollypenrice said:

 I think an online symposium would be great fun. People could record their steps, explain their thinking etc.

Olly

sharing work flow to help other images to improve their technique.....I'm all for that Olly. I know that's kind of what goes on here anyway but it would be much easier if everyone was working from identical data and very interesting to compare different renditions.

[Demonperformer]

20 minutes ago, ollypenrice said:

I can feel a cartoon coming on: a gymn full of people on rowing machines, running machines, others skipping, doing press-ups, lifting weights, all glued to the telly showing a lardy geezer comatose in his chair. They're saying things like,

'Four days, nineteen hours and 17 seconds - and he hasn't flinched!'

'Nineteen cans of Stellar and twelve pizzas...'

'They say he's got his resting IQ down below 80!'

Olly

 

Have you been hacking the phone in my camera???

[Allinthehead]

1 hour ago, peter shah said:

is there a difference being several hundred or thousand miles away?

I see this as completely different to downloading data. It makes no difference where you take the photographs as long as you do. Your gear, set up by you. Target selection, framed, exposure lengths decided by you, etc etc. Whether this is remotely done in your backyard from your armchair or remotely done in the Alps.

If someone else takes the photos for you, it has become astro image processing, not astrophotography. Nothing wrong with it, just different.  

[Allinthehead]

54 minutes ago, carastro said:

if you get imaging rewards and respect you must know in your heart you don't deserve it?

It seems some people will do anything for a little attention. 

[Demonperformer]

36 minutes ago, Allinthehead said:

Your gear, set up by you.  

So, presumably, using Olly's gear, set up by him doesn't count.