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Binoculars upgrade


Olli

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Hi all ,

i currently have an old pair of 7x50 Chinon  binoculars and I’m looking to up grade them, I’ve been looking around and have found some 15x70 binos which look good value. How much of a difference will I notice with these is it a big difference?  If you could recommend me some binos in this price range (<£100) I’d  be much appreciated. As I don’t really have a clue what to look for in binos. Mainly used for star gazing of course :) 

Thanks for the help 

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15x70 binos will probably need a tripod or something to keep them steady. I find that the more jittery the view the less time you spend concentrating on the target. I use a pair of 10x50 Nikon Aculon's. Their around £100 and I like them a lot, just about stable for me to get a good view but with enough aperture to show fainter detail.

There are plenty of different types of binos you can get for £100 (compact, porro, larger observation, zoom...etc) and doubtless other people will have differing opinions.

HTH Dan :happy7:

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I've not heard of 5x70 before? They would have a 14mm exit pupil, bigger than you can take in (nenerally max 7mm), so plenty of lost light and a washed out sky at night I should think.

15x70 are good astro binoculars and will show you a great deal. Probably best mounted on a tripod for stability, they can be hard to hold steady for longer periods.

My most used astro binos are 8x42s. Lightweight with an excellent field of view, they are easy to hold and the low mag means shakes are well controlled.

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2 hours ago, Stu said:

I've not heard of 5x70 before? They would have a 14mm exit pupil, bigger than you can take in (nenerally max 7mm), so plenty of lost light and a washed out sky at night I should think.

15x70 are good astro binoculars and will show you a great deal. Probably best mounted on a tripod for stability, they can be hard to hold steady for longer periods.

My most used astro binos are 8x42s. Lightweight with an excellent field of view, they are easy to hold and the low mag means shakes are well controlled.

My apologies it’s 7x50 :) think I’ll look at those 8x42s

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Hello, Dinoco,

given your reasonably dark skies you've mentioned in other posts, I'd stay with the Chinon 7x50, if they are in good shape and well collimated. Chances are, that they are vintage Japanese binos of the '60 to '80 decades (try to spot a JB+number at the hinge's front end), which were well-built all-metal constructions, not cheap at that time, and with a high level of quality control. 7x means steady views without tripod, and a bright image, good for faint, extended DSO's as galaxies or gaseous nebulas. I'd save the money for the new scope.

You can improve the steadiness of views with your binos considerably by building a image-stabilizing frame (almost from scrap, within an afternoon):

http://www.skyandtelescope.com/astronomy-equipment/image-stabilize-your-binoculars/

here shown with my Zeiss Jenoptem 10x50 vintage binos:

DSC_0702.thumb.JPG.8e7b62835da278c1ef1c082f19fbfb92.JPG

The "Bi-zooka" combines comfortable viewing without any jitters with freedom of movement (as with hand-held binos); it's a joy to use, costs almost nothing, and needs no batteries!

Stephan

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56 minutes ago, Nyctimene said:

Hello, Dinoco,

given your reasonably dark skies you've mentioned in other posts, I'd stay with the Chinon 7x50, if they are in good shape and well collimated. Chances are, that they are vintage Japanese binos of the '60 to '80 decades (try to spot a JB+number at the hinge's front end), which were well-built all-metal constructions, not cheap at that time, and with a high level of quality control. 7x means steady views without tripod, and a bright image, good for faint, extended DSO's as galaxies or gaseous nebulas. I'd save the money for the new scope.

You can improve the steadiness of views with your binos considerably by building a image-stabilizing frame (almost from scrap, within an afternoon):

http://www.skyandtelescope.com/astronomy-equipment/image-stabilize-your-binoculars/

here shown with my Zeiss Jenoptem 10x50 vintage binos:

DSC_0702.thumb.JPG.8e7b62835da278c1ef1c082f19fbfb92.JPG

The "Bi-zooka" combines comfortable viewing without any jitters with freedom of movement (as with hand-held binos); it's a joy to use, costs almost nothing, and needs no batteries!

Stephan

What a wonderfully crazy, but brilliant idea!

I guess you just have to make sure you don't 'slew' to a different part of the sky and clout someone standing near you ;)

Almost tempted to try this myself.

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1 hour ago, Nyctimene said:

Hello, Dinoco,

given your reasonably dark skies you've mentioned in other posts, I'd stay with the Chinon 7x50, if they are in good shape and well collimated. 

Yep, I would stick with the 50mm lenses too. Aperture is important at night. Keep the magnification low so you have a chance to use them without support.

If your current binos are knackered then the Helios Stellar seem well priced just over your budget 

https://www.firstlightoptics.com/helios-binoculars/helios-stellar-ii-50mm-wp-binoculars.html

http://binocularsky.com/binoc_choosing.php#3 

(see the 10x50 section)

 

if stability is an issue with your current binos then consider buying a monopod and trigger grip (as long as your binos accept a bracket). Monopod makes a big difference to usage and folds up small for going in a suitcase.

I followed this advice when buying my monopod

http://binocularsky.com/binoc_mount.php

Alan

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1 hour ago, Nyctimene said:

Hello, Dinoco,

given your reasonably dark skies you've mentioned in other posts, I'd stay with the Chinon 7x50, if they are in good shape and well collimated. Chances are, that they are vintage Japanese binos of the '60 to '80 decades (try to spot a JB+number at the hinge's front end), which were well-built all-metal constructions, not cheap at that time, and with a high level of quality control. 7x means steady views without tripod, and a bright image, good for faint, extended DSO's as galaxies or gaseous nebulas. I'd save the money for the new scope.

You can improve the steadiness of views with your binos considerably by building a image-stabilizing frame (almost from scrap, within an afternoon):

http://www.skyandtelescope.com/astronomy-equipment/image-stabilize-your-binoculars/

here shown with my Zeiss Jenoptem 10x50 vintage binos:

DSC_0702.thumb.JPG.8e7b62835da278c1ef1c082f19fbfb92.JPG

The "Bi-zooka" combines comfortable viewing without any jitters with freedom of movement (as with hand-held binos); it's a joy to use, costs almost nothing, and needs no batteries!

Stephan

That’s a unique idea never seen that before, I was just wondering if it was worth the upgrade on my original binos.I’ve found a number ( think it’s right) A03278. Don’t know if it means anything to you. They are Japanese. Haven’t used them properly on dso yet but I get nice views on Orion and Pleiades :) also how can I check if they’re colimated probably didn’t know binoculars  could be colimated 

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29 minutes ago, Dinoco said:

also how can I check if they’re colimated probably didn’t know binoculars  could be colimated 

Collimation for binoculars just means that the two channels are aligned properly. So long as you don't get double images of stars your binos are ok. Misalignment normally happens when they get dropped or bashed in some way.

Main question I would ask is what do you want to achieve with new binos? Are you just wanting higher quality wide field views, or to have more power for a little more detail?

My view (totally personal opinion) of binos is that they are best used hand held so you have the freedom to move around and quickly see other things. If I'm going to the trouble of putting a tripod out then I want the benefits of a scope.

So, 8x42 are nice and light, give a 5.25 mm exit pupil, actually a little larger than in 15x70 (4.7mm), so images will be slightly brighter but objects will be much smaller obviously. Image scale is important for detecting faint objects though, so the 15x70s will certainly show you more of the fainter stuff i.e. DSOs such as m81 and 82. These will be visible under a dark sky in either binos, but much easier in the larger binos. 15x70s will likely just about split the Trapezium and more easily show you the Galilean moons around Jupiter but no more detail.

So, it's image scale vs field of view, tripod mount (or more shakes) vs easier hand hold.

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11 minutes ago, Stu said:

Collimation for binoculars just means that the two channels are aligned properly. So long as you don't get double images of stars your binos are ok. Misalignment normally happens when they get dropped or bashed in some way.

Main question I would ask is what do you want to achieve with new binos? Are you just wanting higher quality wide field views, or to have more power for a little more detail?

My view (totally personal opinion) of binos is that they are best used hand held so you have the freedom to move around and quickly see other things. If I'm going to the trouble of putting a tripod out then I want the benefits of a scope.

So, 8x42 are nice and light, give a 5.25 mm exit pupil, actually a little larger than in 15x70 (4.7mm), so images will be slightly brighter but objects will be much smaller obviously. Image scale is important for detecting faint objects though, so the 15x70s will certainly show you more of the fainter stuff i.e. DSOs such as m81 and 82. These will be visible under a dark sky in either binos, but much easier in the larger binos. 15x70s will likely just about split the Trapezium and more easily show you the Galilean moons around Jupiter but no more detail.

So, it's image scale vs field of view, tripod mount (or more shakes) vs easier hand hold.

I’m looking for some lightweight ones really I mean I can use these ok but after a while I do start to shake. But they are capable. I’ve only just found these around the house haven’t really tested them properly. Is it  possible to get the same 7x50 but in a smaller size or no?

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28 minutes ago, Dinoco said:

I’m looking for some lightweight ones really I mean I can use these ok but after a while I do start to shake. But they are capable. I’ve only just found these around the house haven’t really tested them properly. Is it  possible to get the same 7x50 but in a smaller size or no?

Probably won't get anything dramatically smaller/lighter but maybe post a picture of them so we can see?

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7 minutes ago, Stu said:

My view (totally personal opinion) of binos is that they are best used hand held so you have the freedom to move around and quickly see other things. If I'm going to the trouble of putting a tripod out then I want the benefits of a scope.

 

The only pair of binoculars I possess that are truly hand held are my 80's style Bresser Hunter 7x50's, simply due to the fact they do not have any tripod adaptation?

All the other binoculars are mountable  and its a feature I use more often than not, even when viewing through my 8x40's, the view is better.

Agreed, binoculars are essential for finding stuff, but a telescope provides the detail.

Also having just the right kit for your own use also helps. My Tripod and trigger grip are the perfect combination for my needs both astronomy and photography, and with the ability to side extend the shaft on my tripod, its a joy to use from a seated position.
Its just as useful during the day, making light work when moving around to any position on the horizon, I have no issues with the setup, it's quicker and lighter than my scope, the binoculars unclip at the flick of a lever, should I want to swap them out. 

I'm still trying to locate/discover the type of IS binoculars I used once?  I'm sure they were Nikons, but against the high cost of IS ownership whilst using them on a solid  foundation, then not much can better the price of a decent solid tripod, but on/from a moving structure, then if your needing stability, IS is a serious contender, unless you have some other form of image stabilised mounting system.

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7 minutes ago, Stu said:

Probably won't get anything dramatically smaller/lighter but maybe post a picture of them so we can see?

Here’s a picture of them, they aren’t too big just got some weight to them.

DAEC8BEF-8FB8-4249-97DD-0542CD1A6A1B.jpeg

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10 minutes ago, Charic said:

The only pair of binoculars I possess that are truly hand held are my 80's style Bresser Hunter 7x50's, simply due to the fact they do not have any tripod adaptation?

All the other binoculars are mountable  and its a feature I use more often than not, even when viewing through my 8x40's, the view is better.

Agreed, binoculars are essential for finding stuff, but a telescope provides the detail.

Also having just the right kit for your own use also helps. My Tripod and trigger grip are the perfect combination for my needs both astronomy and photography, and with the ability to side extend the shaft on my tripod, its a joy to use from a seated position.
Its just as useful during the day, making light work when moving around to any position on the horizon, I have no issues with the setup, it's quicker and lighter than my scope, the binoculars unclip at the flick of a lever, should I want to swap them out. 

I'm still trying to locate/discover the type of IS binoculars I used once?  I'm sure they were Nikons, but against the high cost of IS ownership whilst using them on a solid  foundation, then not much can better the price of a decent solid tripod, but on/from a moving structure, then if your needing stability, IS is a serious contender, unless you have some other form of image stabilised mounting system.

Im using These at the moment until I have a scope and I’ll still use them when I get a scope if I don’t feel like setting it all up or to use it to find targets when the scope is up.. As I’ve just said to Stu they aren’t big just slightly heavy. 

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15 minutes ago, Dinoco said:

As I’ve just said to Stu they aren’t big just slightly heavy. 

Sometimes having a bit of weight to a binocular is not all bad as it can damp the shakes a little. Its a finely judged thing and will vary from person to person and there will obviously come a point when the mono-pod will make things a whole lot better. Nice looking binos by the way.

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On 01/02/2018 at 21:55, Dinoco said:

........currently have an old pair of 7x50 Chinon  binoculars and I’m looking to up grade them, I’ve been looking around and have found some 15x70 binos which look good value. How much of a difference will I notice with these is it a big difference?

The major difference I found was the field of view, much narrower using the 15x70's, yet the  actual target image your looking is a tad larger.
The 7x50's effectively allow me to see more, the image appears brighter, but no real detail if/when I'm trying to study a planet,  say Jupiter, which displays as just a bright white disk through binoculars. 

Modern 7x50's may have better coatings and or glass, that could help the overall viewing appearance compared to what your Chinon's provide today. My most used binocular is the Helios 8x40, it was my upgrade for low power, wide field, my most used binocular.

I had for the shortest duration? some Helios Apollo 15x70's which  get very good reviews, and on initial first light they looked promising compared to my present 15x70 Revelations.

Sometimes  though, you'll just pay for the brand, but having the right conditions may be more important to the end result than cost alone, having found my Revelations are more capable from a darker site than from my light polluted  back garden, but I'm still  tinkering with my mind (on this occasion ) to purchase some brand specific 15x70's, that have better  overall optical reports and better build quality. 

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39 minutes ago, Stu said:

They look nice, but probably heavier than a pair of 8x42s, or even a modern pair of 7x50s.

 

Thanks I mean the build quality is really good most of it’s metal. think I’ll stick with them have been fiddling around with them and have made the views slightly better I think the lenses need a good clean. Can see specs of dirt. Any advice on how to clean them? Here’s a photo other side look similar 

image.jpg

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46 minutes ago, Alfian said:

Sometimes having a bit of weight to a binocular is not all bad as it can damp the shakes a little. Its a finely judged thing and will vary from person to person and there will obviously come a point when the mono-pod will make things a whole lot better. Nice looking binos by the way.

Alright,  thank you :) 

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Assuming the particles are on the outside I'd first use a puffer brush or similar to clear them away to avoid scratching the lenses. Then I'd use something like Baader wonder fluid and cloth to gently clean the surface of the lens. This is very good stuff, a bit pricey but a bottle goes a long way. Generally I think its best to avoid cleaning unless its really necessary, but grime does build up over time.

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23 minutes ago, Alfian said:

Assuming the particles are on the outside I'd first use a puffer brush or similar to clear them away to avoid scratching the lenses. Then I'd use something like Baader wonder fluid and cloth to gently clean the surface of the lens. This is very good stuff, a bit pricey but a bottle goes a long way. Generally I think its best to avoid cleaning unless its really necessary, but grime does build up over time.

Thanks, they have been looked after well with lense caps and in a bag for a long time but they still seem pretty dirty and I think there are some particles on the inside as well.  I’ve seen flo do that spray so I’ll order some and I’ll see where I can get that brush

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