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steppenwolf

ZWO ASI 1600MM-PRO USB 3.0 Mono Camera

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Is anyone on here using a ZWO ASI 1600MM-PRO USB 3.0 Mono Camera with a standard USB 2.0 port. Early reports with the original  'Cool' indicate that there were issues.

Thanks.

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 Hi, I haven't the camera but looking at the 'new' version with 256MB buffer memory, 'to improve image transfer' on Flo's site perhaps speaks volumes. You may have seen the information on FLO's site for the new version which states-"ZWO Pro cameras feature a 256MB DDR3 memory buffer to help maintain data transfer stability and reduce amp-glow issues caused by the slow data transfer speed when using a USB2.0 port.'

I'd like to think members actually using the older camera version will be able to substantiate the 'slow data transfers' and 'amp-glow issues and any other issues one way or the other for you . :icon_santa:

Regards,
Steve

 

 

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I have a new Atik Horizon on order and similar to the latest ZWO AS1600 it too has an added 256MB buffer. The Horizon's manual is quite interesting. It suggests that "....whilst there will be an impact on speed if using USB2  (rather than USB3) there will be no impact on image quality".  The buffer is evidently critical, and if this is a new feature of the latest ZWO I guess it is intended to fix the reported data transfer problem. These advanced CMOS cameras are massively data transfer hungry.

Going further......Atik Support has confirmed to me that its current wireless solution (Atik Air + Raspberry Pi) "might stutter" due to the Horizon camera's high data demands. The current Pi 3 being limited to modest 802.11n rates of wireless transfer (see below). There appear to be no plans to launch a Pi with 802.11ac wireless until 2019.

I will probably use USB3 active cable with my Horizon as with my Evolution WiFi and wireless remote focuser control it will mean only a single cable trailing into my (warm) 'office' (converted garage). However, I will also try with USB2 as I have both cable types and will report results when I get my camera.

However,  I have recently  been successful with a different, but innovative wholly wireless solution for my DLSR over my 802.11ac wireless home network (BT Infinity/Hub 5 or greater). 

 I run a short USB cable from camera to laptop A situated next to my telescope. Then control laptop A from laptop B wirelessly using (free) 'TeamViewer'. All the heavy data processing (AP data capture)  is being done on laptop A with no speed degradation due to the short USB cable. My DLSR is 24 megapixel with large chip so fairly similar to the Atik and ZWO. What I found really  interesting is that on laptop B which is receiving (I think) merely compressed video data I didn't notice any image degradation or control lag between the two laptops (hence, still great for 'live view' EEA on laptop B in the warm with no loss of image quality for AP processing on laptop A).

Laptop A might obviously be replaced by a  miniature Intel Compute Stick,  but I gather that you need to avoid the entry level 2GB versions as they too might suffer like the Pi. Indeed, my laptop A has a broken screen and was destined to be junked. But in this master and slave set up, I can read it's screen output perfectly on laptop B via TeamViewer. So dig out that busted old laptop from the loft/garage and have fun with TeamViewer (other remote desktop solutions available, but TeamViewer is free for non-commercial use). 

 

Edited by noah4x4
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22 hours ago, SteveNickolls said:

Hi, I haven't the camera but looking at the 'new' version with 256MB buffer memory, 'to improve image transfer' on Flo's site perhaps speaks volumes.

Yes, thanks, Steve, I have studied the specifications and was interested in the buffer but require clarification of this statement -

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

DDR Memory Buffer

ZWO Pro cameras feature a 256MB DDR3 memory buffer to help maintain data transfer stability and reduce amp-glow issues caused by the slow data transfer speed when using a USB2.0 port.

On the face of it, this is not a panacea but and improvement. This is no criticism of the camera itself, it has sensibly be designed to use USB 3.0 for quick data transfer of fast frame rate image capture, it just so happens that I won't be using it in this mode!

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

11 hours ago, noah4x4 said:

The buffer is evidently critical, and if this is a new feature of the latest ZWO I guess it is intended to fix the reported data transfer problem. These advanced CMOS cameras are massively data

Oh yes, this is a good feature for sure. I think that ultimately, I am going to have to accept that to run one of the new breed of cameras, I am going to have to upgrade the controlling PC in my observatory!

With regard to the comms. that you mention, I am a great fan of TeamViewer myself and use it to operate my remote observatory.

Thanks for your comments, folks, always appreciated.

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I have the freezing issue with the original and it is cured (completely) by dropping one of the settings down to 40. Just going to have to fire up sharp cap to remind myself what it is called.

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*!*! - can't get it to give me the control panel without the camera being connected. Will have a look tomorrow if no one has been able to give a definitive answer by then.

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1 hour ago, steppenwolf said:

Yes, thanks, Steve, I have studied the specifications and was interested in the buffer but require clarification of this statement -

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

DDR Memory Buffer

ZWO Pro cameras feature a 256MB DDR3 memory buffer to help maintain data transfer stability and reduce amp-glow issues caused by the slow data transfer speed when using a USB2.0 port.

On the face of it, this is not a panacea but and improvement. This is no criticism of the camera itself, it has sensibly be designed to use USB 3.0 for quick data transfer of fast frame rate image capture, it just so happens that I won't be using it in this mode!

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Oh yes, this is a good feature for sure. I think that ultimately, I am going to have to accept that to run one of the new breed of cameras, I am going to have to upgrade the controlling PC in my observatory!

With regard to the comms. that you mention, I am a great fan of TeamViewer myself and use it to operate my remote observatory.

Thanks for your comments, folks, always appreciated.

I'm using the gen 2 camera over USB2 via a powered USB3 hub and active USB3 extension cable. I run it at a USB speed of 80 and have not had any issues except when I accidentally try to capture simultaneously from two applications (e..g previewing while plate solving). I did try upgrading my old desktop with a USB3 port but that has been unreliable. With the USB2 setup image transfers take a few seconds and I've not noticed any amp glow issues although that could be a refelction of my mediocre imaging skills where a little amp glow is the least of my worries. From all reports and my own experience, any amp glow calibrates out. In my location I don't get problems with dew or ice so cannot comment on those features.

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13 hours ago, Demonperformer said:

I have the freezing issue with the original and it is cured (completely) by dropping one of the settings down to 40. Just going to have to fire up sharp cap to remind myself what it is called.

The setting in question is called "Turbo USB" in sharpcap and 40 is the minimum setting (screenprint here if that is of any help). This stopped the camera/laptop/USB2 connection falling over itself.

Edited by Demonperformer

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On 23/12/2017 at 16:22, steppenwolf said:

Is anyone on here using a ZWO ASI 1600MM-PRO USB 3.0 Mono Camera with a standard USB 2.0 port. Early reports with the original  'Cool' indicate that there were issues.

Thanks.

Hi gaffer,, there is a problem with some of the zwo camera's  ,, usb 3,, I have the zwo asi178mc and it led me a merry dance,, would freeze ,, I was using a usb3 extension and initially thought it was the problem.

Went with supplied usb 3 cable and after a while,, same again.

Suspected it may have been my usb 3 port on laptop

Works fine on usb2 port and with usb3 extension.

Seen the same problem discussed on sharpcap forum,, looks to be a driver problem,,

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Mine (pro version) works fine over the USB2. On the USB 3 port the computer did not always recognize the powered usb 3 hub. I think it is a driver problem. It is on old computer and the drivers are not updated anymore from the supplier. It is only used for deep sky with APT, so I don't really care. The DDR can handle 1 picture at the time.

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3 minutes ago, Astrobug said:

Mine (pro version) works fine over the USB2. On the USB 3 port the computer did not always recognize the powered usb 3 hub. I think it is a driver problem. It is on old computer and the drivers are not updated anymore from the supplier.

That's great, thank you. I am really loathe to change my observatory PC as it simply works but it is stuck in the time warp that is USB 2.0! All I need to decide now is whether I can justify another camera!

Thanks all.

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18 hours ago, steppenwolf said:

my observatory PC as it simply works but it is stuck in the time warp that is USB 2.0!

 Bit off topic ,Is your obsy pc running on a HDD or a SSD drive steve , SSd does make a big difference in being able to keep up with data and a small ssd can be added for a small output and run as a slave drive without having to reformat C drive if you have space for it , 

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3 minutes ago, andyboy1970 said:

Or add USB3 PCI card to your system. Assuming it's a PC.

Unfortunately, it would appear that a USB 3.0 port will automatically fall back to USB 2.0 with my observatory OS (Windows XP).

16 minutes ago, bottletopburly said:

Is your obsy pc running on a HDD or a SSD drive steve , SSd does make a big difference in being able to keep up with data and a small ssd can be added for a small output and run as a slave drive without having to reformat C drive if you have space for it , 

That's an interesting thought, it would remove one particular bottleneck.

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3 minutes ago, steppenwolf said:

That's an interesting thought, it would remove one particular bottleneck.

My laptop nothing fancy , I5 core and 8gb ram ,always buffered, dropped frames using a qhy5l-ii ,upgraded to a SSD drive for £45 , never drops fps now steady transfer ,massive difference ,though i put my OS on to it and use old as a slave, boots up in under ten seconds and hasn't slowed down, been running about two years now. Just something to bear in mind should anyone be upgrading to a usb3 camera running on a pc with usb3 if your on a HDD chances are this will be a weak link .

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I also replaced my HDD with a SSD in my laptop, used the suggested software to make a copy of the original HDD, very easy and very fast now.

 

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I run my new 1600PRO with USB3 with no issues. I upgraded from 1600v2 due to freezing problems. Now just in test period to see if it doesn’t reproduce (I hope not). I set it down to -25°C.

Edited by astrocatinfo

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