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Advice on eyepices


Rune

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On 23/12/2017 at 12:50, Rune said:

I have some Baader Hyperion eyepces 5mm, 10 mm and 24mm and one TeleVue Plossl 32mm 1.25"

After I got the TV Plossl 32mm I actually dont want to use the Hyperions anymore because I find them "inferior" to the TV Plossl. 

So back to the advice I need from more experienced observers. Im drooling on the TV Nagler 17mm and TV Ethos 17mm. The latter is several hundred dollars more expensive. Which one should I get for my 120 ED scope? 

/Rune

Hi Rune and welcome to the forum :) 

I have tried neither the 17mm Nagler T4 nor the 17mm Ethos, but some time ago I had three Naglers T6 (more recent than T4 models) and two TV Delos (which is considered to have the same optical quality as the TV Ethos). Both types were fine, but in my opinion the new Delos design was better than the Nagler T6. This was particularly detectable on planetary targets, but also on DSOs. Another interesting eyepiece is the Vixen SLV which has 50 degrees FOV (like a Plossl), but 20mm eye relief. The SLVs are considerably cheaper than the Delos, and substantially revealed the same amount of details to my eye. The more obvious difference between the two is the colour tone, which (to my eye) is a bit more neutral in the SLVs. A few experienced members have reported that the SLVs are very very close to the Pentax XW, apart from the FOV (50 vs 70). Although I have never owned an XW, the eye cap mechanism seems more functional than the eye cap in the Delos. If you spend some time reading reports about this, you will probably find mixed opinions. To my eye, Pentax simply got the eye cap design just right. The Ethos line will offer you 100 degrees of FOV. For a few members this is a highly desirable feature.

There are other eyepieces aside from TV and Pentax of course. For the cost of 2-3 XW/Delos, you can get a Leica ASPH zoom or Zeiss zoom 20-75x. 

My advice is:

- look up in the s/h market before buying new;

- possibly consider options that are cheaper but optically very good. Eyepieces with a large FOV tend to cost more. To me, it is wiser to spend more money when one has a clear idea of his own tastes. To acquire this, some experience is needed;

- make sure you understand the focal lengths you need before choosing an eyepiece brand. This guide might be helpful: 

 

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Perhaps a consideration could be for an 18.2mm DeLite eyepiece. 62 degree field and 20mm E/R, field stop: 19.1mm. I use Ethos, Delos, XW and DeLite. I particularly enjoy using a 4mm DeLite, largely with my 76mm frac, which until recently was the only focal length I had in this range. Eye placement is very comfortable, enabled to see the field stop I consider the image to be highly engaging, contrast and sharpness on par with Delos. I have recently included a 7mm DeLite, which I look forward to using later this week for Lunar observing. The 7mm was to complete an incremental focal length gap (4mm, 5mm, 6mm, 7mm and 8mm), the DeLite's will complement my other, wider AFOV focal length e.p's, an exciting eyepiece range very worth while considering.    

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10 hours ago, Timebandit said:

The ES 92 may be good, but I would be surprised if optically wise it is as good  as the XW and Nagler .

The ES-92 is definitely better than the 17mm NT4.  I've done multiple comparisons with my Dob and frac.  There is very noticeable field curvature and astigmatism at the edge of the NT4 that is completely absent in the ES.  Contrast and scatter control is a tie.  Since the 16mm and 20mm NT5s don't have enough eye relief for eyeglass users, I couldn't ever do those comparisons.  My understanding is that both are sharp to the edge, so probably a tie.

WRT the XW, the ES is flat of field, unlike the 14mm and 20mm XWs.  Sharpness wise, basically a tie, but wider.

WRT the Delos, I can only compare it to the 10mm Delos for sharpness, contrast, scatter control, etc.  It's basically a tie with the ES-92 simply being wider and a lower power.  WRT the 17.3mm Delos, it's probably the ES being the better one since several folks report that the 17.3mm Delos is the weakest of the line.  WRT the 17mm Ethos and Nikon NAV-HW, based on what I've read, the Nikon probably takes the win with the Ethos and ES close behind.

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11 hours ago, Timebandit said:

I don't call using the likes of XW at 70d a compromise

For me, it wasn't the 70 degree AFOV so much as the curved field.  I tried replacing my 14mm Pentax XL with the Baader Morpheus.  The Morpheus is flatter and wider, but it has significant edge of field astigmatism visible without even having to rack focus to detect it.  The XL is astigmatism free once in focus at the edge.  The 14mm XW is supposed to behave similarly.  I still like the Morpheus for its combination of size, AFOV, and eye relief.  The 17.3mm Delos wasn't under consideration for edge of field astigmatism issues I've read about.  I'll have to take a wait and see attitude about the 17mm Morpheus whenever it is finally released.

My other thought was the 14mm Delos, but I'd have to spring for an ultra-low profile adapter permanently attached to it to bring it into parfocalness with the rest of my eyepieces for proper coma correction.  Otherwise, it would have been a good option.

13 hours ago, Moonshane said:

Personally I prefer lighter eyepieces with refractors as balance is thrown moving from say a smaller 1.25" like a 32mm plossl to a larger say a 2" 17mm Nagler.

For my 120mm Equinox I have mainly used 24mm Panoptic, 11mm Delite, 7mm Delite and 6-3mm Nagler zoom. On solar system objects I use binoviewers with pairs of TV plossls.

If I was really into critical planetary observing, I could see getting an 18mm Delite in this range, no doubt.  It is supposed to be superb.

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4 hours ago, 25585 said:

There is a Nikon NAV-SW 17.5mm 70 deg fov, eye relief 27mm on sale @ ebay.com. They are 1.25 inch barrel. 

Bought mine from apm.de but the ebay ones are from a US seller. 

I had forgotten about the Nikon because so few folks have reported on it.  Here is one report relative to the Delos giving a slight edge to the Nikon.  If I need a 1.25"-only solution at that focal length, I just might try one out in the future.  The problem had been with the NAV-SW was price.  Cross-shipped from Japan or Germany (APM), they were (and still are) in the $450 range with S&H.  Now that Agena Astro carries them for about $340, I might give them a second look since that makes them price competitive with the XW and Delos lines.  The 14mm and below don't interest me due to the 18mm of designed eye relief which is going to translate into even less usable ER.

IIRC, you have the 17.5mm NAV-SW.  How is the eye relief with eyeglasses?  I'm a bit concerned because they recessed the eye lens quite a bit for no particular reason like the Pentax XW.  They could have just made the eyeguard more extendable instead.  How is the view in it?

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@Rune  

I forgot to mention another eyepiece you might want to consider! The Lunt HDC! It offers 100 degrees AFOV and a very well corrected field. Gerry ( @jetstream ) has compared the 20mm Lunt HDC to his 21mm Ethos on his fast newtons and they were on par most of the time. He really knows what he says. I have the 20mm Lunt HDC and find it a very fine eyepiece on my dobson f/6. An advantage of the Lunt HDC over the Ethos is the reduced weight. This can be convenient on a refractor. Another more obvious advantage is the cost.

Have a look at them here: http://www.apm-telescopes.de/en/eyepieces/more-74-ultra-wide-angle/apm-lunt-eyepieces.html 

The HDC version is the last one.

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12 hours ago, Louis D said:

I had forgotten about the Nikon because so few folks have reported on it.  Here is one report relative to the Delos giving a slight edge to the Nikon.  If I need a 1.25"-only solution at that focal length, I just might try one out in the future.  The problem had been with the NAV-SW was price.  Cross-shipped from Japan or Germany (APM), they were (and still are) in the $450 range with S&H.  Now that Agena Astro carries them for about $340, I might give them a second look since that makes them price competitive with the XW and Delos lines.  The 14mm and below don't interest me due to the 18mm of designed eye relief which is going to translate into even less usable ER.

IIRC, you have the 17.5mm NAV-SW.  How is the eye relief with eyeglasses?  I'm a bit concerned because they recessed the eye lens quite a bit for no particular reason like the Pentax XW.  They could have just made the eyeguard more extendable instead.  How is the view in it?

View in the Nikon is good for my eye! Very relaxing viewing. Compared to my Vixen LVW 17mm, it has more eye relief but I need to do more comparisons of edge etc before  deciding if the extra cost is worth it. ER was my main reason for choosing the SW. 

On CN the SW is considered a good ep for bino viewing. Delite 18mm, though smaller FOV has good things said about its performance. 

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