First light with a BIG new scope! - 20th September report

[Andrew*]

All week, the weather forecast was predicting clear skies for Saturday. Saturday came, I was up early, and I drove down to Dundee. There I met with a lovely chap called Brian, AKA SolarB, and I drove back up to Aberdeen several hundred pounds poorer, but 16 inches richer.

That’s right – I am now the proud owner of a beautiful 16” LightBridge.

Come 9pm, there were some straggling clouds, but I was not deterred. The scope was collimated and out in the open and I got aligning the finder on Jupiter. I’ve never seen such a stupid finder adjusting system. You need an Allan key, and the height adjustment is in the way of the reticule, so you can’t actually adjust and view at the same time. Besides, turning the adjusters didn’t seem to move the dot at all. Still, I got it close, which was good enough for the night.

Seeing: poor - 2/5.

Transparency: Good. Milky way visible. LM 5+

I tried to look at Jupiter, but it was boiling so violently, and the mirror wasn’t properly cooled, so I didn’t see anything, really.

My dad came to join me for the first time. I actually bothered to invite him for once! I shot around the sky showing him the showpieces: M27, the Ring Nebula, the Double Cluster, M71, Owl Cluster, Andromeda Galaxy and Albireo. We also looked at Jupiter, but it was far from its best. I was getting on very well with the scope, considering I’d only used a dob once before. I found things quickly and without issues. Tracking was almost effortless with the LightBridge.

My dad enjoyed the sights a lot and it seemed to reignite his interest in naked eye astronomy, as he used to take me out and point out constellations. He asked all the right questions, and some wrong ones too: “So is 200x a good magnification for a telescope? How does it compare with others?”

I did look for some more targets to show him in between, but on seeing them decided against it, as his eyes are not at their best. For some reason I wasn’t overly impressed with the light gathering power of this monster and I expected better. M51 was still two vague smudges, as was M81/2. M31 showed no dust lanes, and only just the satellite galaxies. M56 was still faint. Even the Ring nebula and M27 was only just better than I’d seen it in my 8”. A number of things could be going wrong (not correctly collimated, no shroud, not flocked…), so I’ll see in due course whether or not I’m getting the most out of this huge telescope.

However, after Dad had gone inside, I managed to find the Veil Nebula with an OIII filter. I had failed before as I didn’t use one. This was quite extraordinary. Using a 27mm eyepiece (68x), I could see the shape of the EASTern portion quite clearly, with two “hooks” to the south. Panning over to the WEST, a stream of nebulosity divided west from east, with a larger misty patch towards the north. I could have been seeing none other than Pickering’s Triangle! The triangle part was obvious, but the string extending south from it was also clear. I found the WESTern portion even more beautiful than the EAST. The slender arc that curves towards 52-Cygni was divided into two slender streams, and south of 52-Cygni they spread out and faded. To imagine what I saw, look at Psychobilly’s beautiful image. It was not quite, but very almost as good as that!

While my Dad was still here, I wished to show him M13, but for some reason couldn’t identify Hercules. Afterwards I found it and viewed it. Again, I expected more of the telescope. It was more sharply defined than it appears in my 8”, but more what you would expect from a 10 or 12”, to be honest, and it wasn’t in-your-face bright. Still, it was an awesome view, as it always is! The propeller was clear, and the arcs that stream around and encircle the core were fantastic. There was also a clear pentagon shape of stars around the core I hadn’t seen before. I viewed with my 9mm ortho (200x) for best results, but I did pop in my Nagler zoom at 6 and 5mm (300-366x) and got good views. What’s more, at this insane magnification, tracking was still a simple affair.

I moved on to the obvious next target. M92 was smaller and tighter than M13.

Ring nebula again. Took a long look at this and could make out the central star with averted vision. The centre of the ring glowed clearly, although I couldn’t make out the dark bars that go through the centre. An OIII filter made it stand out better.

Keeping the OIII in, I viewed M27. It glowed quite brightly but for some reason it seemed poorly defined in shape, without the usual patterns you can often make out. When my dad viewed this earlier, he seemed to see a red tinge to it - is this possible?

The moon was starting to make a mess of the sky, but was obscured by a wall. I took the dob for another quick tour of targets I had already visited, and M15 in addition. This is quite a pleasing globular.

I also tried and failed the Blue Snowball, yet again.

Transparency now poor.

Still the moon was obscured by the wall, and my eyepieces were getting too cold, so I popped them all in the case and went inside for a quick drink.

When I came out again, only half the primary mirror was illuminated by the moon, as the rest was behind the wall. Still, it was an incredibly spectacular sight – EXTREMELY BRIGHT!!! It boiled like mad, but contrast was mind-blowing and the detail was superb. I attempted a sketch of Maurolycus and Barocius, the rim of which was only just illuminated by the setting sun – very dramatically shining out of the pitch black inside the crater. Not the sketch, unfortunately. I would have liked to have completed it, but I didn’t have the patience.

While picking a target to sketch on the moon, I wished that I could observe Hadley Rille for the first time, but as I hadn’t a clue where to find it, I picked something else. Now I realise it was an ideal time to view it – d’Oh!

As the moon fully cleared the wall and the boiling lessened, it only got better. I couldn’t believe how bright and clear it was, craters dotting the entire FOV. The seeing limited magnification to about 200x so I explored the surface with my 9mm ortho and as the air wobbled, various craters popped out clearly.

On a few precious occasions, I’ve found that eventually your mind fills up with these stunning sights and you can’t take any more. This was one of those nights. Besides, the moon now put any more deep sky viewing at the back of my mind, and I had been observing the moon for a long time. That meant it was time to pack up and go to bed.

I heaved the 16” away and went to bed with a kind of wild energy you only get from doing what you really love.

However, at present I have doubts about the 16". It didn’t show what I expected of doubling the aperture and rather felt like it was only adding two or three more inches. I will in due course flock the scope, make a shroud, and ensure perfect collimation and see if that does the magic I’m hoping for. Am I expecting too much?

Goodnight!

Andrew

[Astronut]

Good report

Sounds like you had a better night than me as I think I have to contend with more light pollution. Couldn't see the veil with the UHC filter but averted vision gave me a hint of it. I've not seen the propellor in M13 yet. I'll have to look at some sketches to see what I should be looking for.

The thing that impresses me the most with the lightbridges is the oh so smooth movement in alt/az - all that's required is slight pressure from a finger to move them. Spend some time collimating it and I'm sure it will deliver the goods.

[GazOC]

Welcome to the Big Dob club!!

Hopefully you'll get better nights when the seeing is up to using this scope, I don't bother getting mine out unless I think the conditions are up to it.

[blinky]

Sound slike you had a good night Andrew, you kept that purchase quiet! Does this mean you will be selling some of your other kit? The ed80? I am sure your views would have been spoilt by the moon, it's amazing how much it washes out even though it is still low in the sky.

[Andrew*]

Thanks for the comments everyone!

Sounds like you had a better night than me as I think I have to contend with more light pollution. Couldn't see the veil with the UHC filter but averted vision gave me a hint of it. I've not seen the propellor in M13 yet. I'll have to look at some sketches to see what I should be looking for.

The propeller is a bright little X-shape of stars right at the core of M13, like a chromosome.

The thing that impresses me the most with the lightbridges is the oh so smooth movement in alt/az - all that's required is slight pressure from a finger to move them. Spend some time collimating it and I'm sure it will deliver the goods.

Yes, I really need to get to the bottom of why the views were so fickle. I did do a star test in between, which seemed to improve things a little. Actually, now that I think of it, the mirror is not resting against the lockign screws - they're not long enough. Perhaps the mirror was tilting out of alignment in certain positions?

Welcome to the Big Dob club!!

Hopefully you'll get better nights when the seeing is up to using this scope, I don't bother getting mine out unless I think the conditions are up to it.

Thanks Gaz!

Yes, I'm sure the seeing did impact the views as well.

Sound slike you had a good night Andrew, you kept that purchase quiet! Does this mean you will be selling some of your other kit? The ed80?

The big dob was meant to wait until I wouldn't have use of the permanent set-up (when I move), but the deal was too good and I couldn't wait! I will make best use out of both set-ups for the time being, but a few years down the line I will sell my entire imaging set-up and concentrate on observing. I don't have the energy to bother with the hassle of imaging unless it's permanently set up.

I am sure your views would have been spoilt by the moon, it's amazing how much it washes out even though it is still low in the sky.

Yes, it would have made an impact, but still - I saw Pickering's Triangle... :scratch:

Cheers all!

Andrew

[Doc]

Fantastic report Andrew.

I also have this monster dob and am seeing roughly the same as you are. I have to contend with alot of light pollution and I think this really cuts down on what I see.

Also like yourself I was expecting great big images feeling up the eyepiece, it's just not like that. I came from a 10" dob and to me it's better then that but not by loads.

As you have found out where this really excells is on the moon, it's just an amazing sight, I have sat for an hour at a time just lookinng at the moon. You can really push the mag high on the moon and it just gets better.

My 16" also takes ages to cool down and thats with a larger fan fitted. I find it needs to be out a good 2 hours before use.

I bought this hoping the larger aperture could overcome light pollution, and it does slightly but really I need to get out to a dark site to really appreciate this scope.

[Doc]

Andrew I see you have the Baader 31mm Hyperion did you try this with your LB.

I'm thinking of getting this EP next.

[Astronut]

Remember that the light polluted background is magnified as well as the foreground object you're looking at. A higher power helps to increase the contrast somewhat. It's all relative but throwing more aperture at a light polluted site isn't going to decrease the effect of light pollution much. Flocking and shielding the light path from external light sources helps but you still have that light polluted background sky to contend with.

[Andrew*]

Andrew I see you have the Baader 31mm Hyperion did you try this with your LB.

I'm thinking of getting this EP next.

It's excellent. I thoroughly recommend it. A little field curvature but nothing too much to get in the way of some great views

Look out over the next few weeks - it might be replaced by a 32mm TeleVue Wide Field. If not, then the WF will be up for sale.

Cheers

Andrew

[dogfish]

Hi Andrew

Excellent report - I'm sure you'll be impressed when you view through it at Kielder (bagsy first in the queue). Funnily enough I was in Aberdeen last night (dropping my son off at Uni) and thought about getting in touch. I definitely would have if I'd have known what you had just taken delivery of. BTW, the seeing did look poor to me, with a touch of mist in the sky.

Cheers, Martin

[barkis]

Congrats on the new acquisition Andrew. Was this a spontaneous purchase, or did you plan it.?

Either way, it's yours now, and I envy you.

I'm sure you are well aware, and if you are not, then some of the previouis posts will have enlightened you, that you will never judge a telescopes performance on one nights use.

It may even take longer than you imagine, but eventually its capability will reveal itself.

It is a beast of a mirror, and will require more patience. I look forward to the report that tells the real story of the LB. The night when you found it impossible to leave the eyepiece.

Cheers, You Lucky man.

Ron.

[Andrew*]

Congrats on the new acquisition Andrew. Was this a spontaneous purchase, or did you plan it.?

Hi Ron, and thanks. Here is your answer:

The big dob was meant to wait until I wouldn't have use of the permanent set-up (when I move), but the deal was too good and I couldn't wait! I will make best use out of both set-ups for the time being, but a few years down the line I will sell my entire imaging set-up and concentrate on observing. I don't have the energy to bother with the hassle of imaging unless it's permanently set up.

I know it seems a bit extravagant, but it's only temporary! Better than the money being locked up in savings, when I could be enjoying it!

I'm sure you are well aware, and if you are not, then some of the previouis posts will have enlightened you, that you will never judge a telescopes performance on one nights use.

It may even take longer than you imagine, but eventually its capability will reveal itself.

It is a beast of a mirror, and will require more patience. I look forward to the report that tells the real story of the LB. The night when you found it impossible to leave the eyepiece.

All you say is very true. I honestly don't believe I revealed it's true potential last night, and time will definitely show what it can do.

I think the primary was rocking around a bit, because the locking bolts were not in contact with the mirror cell. This would explain the variability in the views. I'll get that corrected next time.

Excellent report - I'm sure you'll be impressed when you view through it at Kielder (bagsy first in the queue). Funnily enough I was in Aberdeen last night (dropping my son off at Uni) and thought about getting in touch. I definitely would have if I'd have known what you had just taken delivery of. BTW, the seeing did look poor to me, with a touch of mist in the sky.

Shame, I would have been pleased to show you! Bagsy granted, but you will be responsible for fighting off the invasion!

Andrew

[calibos]

As others have said, you simply can't judge on one nights use. I've seen 3 faces of M13 for instance in my 12inch Orion Intelliscope Dob.

Face 1 when I have viewed it with a half moon up which washes out a lot of detail and means ones eyes can never become truely dark adapted. Stars were just resolved about half way in to the core.

Face 2 was when there was no moon but I never made an effort to get dark adapted, ie. didn't turn off bathroom light, lighting up the garden, never mind block neighbours bedroom lights from my view. M13 was resolved about 3/5ths the way in.

Face 3 was a revelation. Observed during new moon, turned off all the lights at the back of the house, positioned the scope in an area that blocked most neighbours lights and hung a thick sheet on the washing line to shield the rest, then waited a good 30minutes to get fully dark adapted. Diamond dust resolved to the core, looking so much brighter than before.

You'll be remembering your best views from the 8in and chances are it was on a moonless night and you were fully dark adapted. Don't judge the 16in till you use it under the same conditions.

[asteria]

Hi Andrew - thanks for the report. I'm sure you'll get used to the new scope. I am only beginning to find out how to get the best out of my two, and that's after a year's observing! The Lightbridge I'm sure will be fantastic.

Ed

[John]

Hi Andrew - congratulations on the LB 16"

Thanks for posting the report. I'm sure the scope will take quite a while to get used to and the conditions will determine what it delivers, perhaps more so than smaller scopes.

I guess what you have there is enormous potential for performance when the conditions are right and you have got accustomed to it's little ways.

I'm looking forward to more reports ....

John

[Andrew*]

Thanks all for your comments!

I know this thing can offer the goods, and I'm not giving up, of course!!

Andrew

[ngc2403]

hello Andrew,

your report sounded amazing and i know the feeling all to well. however just a point that the moon might be harmfull to your eyes at low power in that scope!

i hope that you get the skies to enjoy at the scope

[Solar B]

Hi Folks

Just to let you know that Andrew sent me a very kind PM to say

that he,s getting on really well with the Big Scope.

Which is Great News Indeed.

Thanks Mate

Brian