Baader Morpheus 17.5mm now available to pre- order...

[F15Rules]

I just noticed that Astroshop EU are advising that the long delayed Baader Morpheus 17.5mm 76 degree eyepiece is now available for pre-order...for delivery from April 2018! http://www.astroshop.eu/baader-morpheus-76d-17-5mm-eyepiece/p,47759. I wonder if our FLO colleagues could confirm if they have heard this too?

I do hope they have finally managed to overcome the design difficulties and get this eyepiece out to the market. It's a good focal length, IMO, and would fill in a gap nicely between my current 13mm and 22 mm Vixen LVWs.

I have owned the 14mm version and have to say it's a cracking eyepiece. At the time of launch I got mine for just £149 which was an absolute steal. It's now around £169-£179 but still competes well against other premium glass brands. The one weakness I felt was the flimsy eyecup, although it did come also with a second winged eyeguard which I really liked (I know some don't get on with winged guards).

I think they must be really pushing the limit of this design at 17.5mm, hence the long delay, but Baader do offer good products and were clearly not willing to launch a product they weren't happy with, which is to their credit.

The 14mm I owned had excellent contrast and colour rendition, a great wide field, sharp in my Vixen F7.7 out to about 72-73 degrees of it's 76 deg field, and a huge eyeglass which I found very comfortable in use. I had previously owned a Pentax XW14mm, and following some prolonged comparisons, I really did prefer the Morpheus, mainly due to the quite severe field curvature of the Pentax 14 (which I found also to affect the XW 20 to a lesser extent, and over which I found I preferred the Vixen 22mm LVW, a really lovely eyepiece). The 14mm seemed to me to offer quite a bit wider field than the XW, although the specs say the difference is only 6 degrees.

I don't know how the shorter FL Morpheus' are, but they would have to be pretty special IMO to beat the short focal length Pentax XW's which for me are almost unbeatable.. my Takahashi Hi-LE 3.6 and LE 7.5s compare well in sharpness and contrast, but have only a 40 degree and 52 degree FOV respectively versus the 70 of the XWs.

If the 17.5mm IS actually available from April 18, I may well be one of those in the queue to buy one ..

 

Dave

 

[Louis D]

I'll believe it when I see it.  ES claimed (via CN's Starman1 in Oct. 2016) that they would be announcing shorter focal length ES-92s (8.8mm , a 6.5mm) this year.  So far, nothing.

Just get the 17mm ES-92 or 17.3mm Delos and stop waiting.

[John]

It will be interesting if it shows up and I'd like to compare one to my 17.3 Delos. I've not yet tried a Morpheus of any focal length.

 

[Ruud]

April Fool's Day?

I'd like one, but the last word of Baader that I can find on the 17.5mm Morpheus is this apology:

http://www.baader-planetarium.com/en/blog/information-on-backordersrelease-of-17-5-mm-morpheus-76-widefield-eyepiece/

I'm not getting my hopes up. We've been able to pre-order the Morpheus 17.5mm all along. At least Baader said that if you ordered one for €245, you'll get it for that price (because when it finally becomes available the 17.5s may get a new price due to the extra development costs Baader had to make).

Included should be a 7.5 mm high ring to raise the eyecup. I got one as accessory for the wonderful 6.5 mm Morpheus. It really helps with eye placement. Without it you just have too much eye relief.

[F15Rules]

1 hour ago, Ruud said:

the last word of Baader that I can find on the 17.5mm Morpheus is this apology:

http://www.baader-planetarium.com/en/blog/information-on-backordersrelease-of-17-5-mm-morpheus-76-widefield-eyepiece/

Yes, I saw that a while ago. I do think they need to either launch soon or scrap it altogether..such a long wait already  and further prolonged delays would be a marketing disaster and damaging to the good reputation that Baader enjoys..

Let's hope it's a positive outcome.

Dave

[Ruud]

Baader now thinks the eyepiece will be available in January 2018

http://www.baader-planetarium.com/en/blog/information-on-backordersrelease-of-17-5-mm-morpheus-76-widefield-eyepiece/

An extension ring is not included, but the rubber eyecup will have a metal ring so that it won't come loose too easily. I think I'll order a 17.5 mm together with the 7.5 mm extension ring to raise the eyecup.

[John]

I'm quite happy to let others be "early adopters" on this one. I'll look forward to hearing how it does at F/5-F7.

 

[F15Rules]

1 hour ago, Ruud said:

Baader now thinks the eyepiece will be available in January 2018

http://www.baader-planetarium.com/en/blog/information-on-backordersrelease-of-17-5-mm-morpheus-76-widefield-eyepiece/

An extension ring is not included, but the rubber eyecup will have a metal ring so that it won't come loose too easily. I think I'll order a 17.5 mm together with the 7.5 mm extension ring to raise the eyecup.

I just looked at the site 2 days back and the update wasn't there then, typical! 

I'd seen a note that (in July, I think), the technical issues had been solved and production would begin soon..then nothing until now.

Good news though if they do actually launch in January. I'll be interested to hear first opinions ☺. If it's as good as the 14mm it will be a cracker.

Dave

 

[F15Rules]

According to FLO the long awaited Morpheus 17.5mm will be in stock by early February

Sadly I am on a self enforced buying embargo for a while, but if I wasn't I'd be sorely tempted by this one. I had the 14mm and it was a superb eyepiece.

I do hope someone on here will take the plunge and report back to us soon!

Dave

[Mark62]

My wife got me and payed for a full set in September 2015 with the promise from Baader that it was a full set.

I’m still awaiting the 17.5 and if they come out it will be good to finally have the eyepiece but I’m not holding my breath as iv been here before.

It’s a good job I had a good relationship with Greenwhich and they have done everything possible to get me the eyepiece even after they have closed  down due to retirement. A big thanks to Lee 

[F15Rules]

Hi Mark,

I hope you get yours soon☺.

How do you rate the rest of the series that you already have?

Dave

[Mark62]

18 minutes ago, F15Rules said:

Hi Mark,

I hope you get yours soon☺.

How do you rate the rest of the series that you already have?

Dave

So do I lol. They are excellent eyepieces well worth the money nice and clear right out to the edge and the stars stay round. I’m just hoping they have not rushed them and made any mistakes that could spoil the 17.5 eyepiece. Hahaha two and a half years and I’m worried about the rushing. The irony lol 

[John]

Still some skepticism on the CN forum from Don Pensack today that the 17.5mm Morpheus will actually show up. FLO seem confident though

Hope it's up to the standard of the others - the long delay in it's shipping has been due to complexities in getting the design to work well at the longer focal length I understand.

 

[Ruud]

Yes, Baader have taken down their promise that it would be available this January at latest.

I feel I've gotten to know them over the past three years. If they don't deliver on a promise, they just make another one.

EDIT

The boys over at Cloudy Nights found this: http://www.baader-planetarium.com/en/175-mm-morpheus-76°-widefield-eyepiece.html

It says there that the eyepiece is now out of stock.

Who would have guessed that? At the bottom of the page is a link with the text "Important note: Please read the following Information on Backorders/Release". The linked address is http://www.baader-planetarium.com/en/blog/information-on-backordersrelease-of-17-5-mm-morpheus-76-widefield-eyepiece/, the same link as above. It still has the 404 error.

I actually get the feeling that something is about to happen!

 

[Louis D]

19 hours ago, Mark62 said:

They are excellent eyepieces well worth the money nice and clear right out to the edge and the stars stay round.

Unfortunately, not my experience with the 14mm Morpheus at f/6.  It has noticeable astigmatism in the last 10% exacerbated by slight field curvature.  I've decided to keep it because the rest of the 76 degree field is very nice indeed.  I had hoped to completely replace my 14mm Pentax XL.  If it was masked off to 65 or 70 degrees, it might actually be sharp to the edge with imperceptible field curvature.

[Ruud]

There are reports about the Morpheus 14 mm going both ways. Some say it's near perfect, others say it's disappointing. At the same time everyone seems to agree about the excellence of the 4.5 and 6.5 mm.

It is as if there is a law for long eye relief super wides: the shorter the focal length, the better they are.

The longest Delos  (17.3 mm)  is reported to be the weakest of the lot. Pentax XW are best at 10 mm or shorter. The Morpheus 14 mm, currently the longest of that line,  is often said to lacking in edge sharpness. The even longer Morpheus 17.5 mm proved so disappointing that Baader decided to take it back to the drawing board.

According to the web page that Baader removed (see link above), the improved 17.5 mm is as good as it can possibly get, meeting all the criteria they set for the Morpheus line. If I don't die of old age in the meantime I'll buy one when it comes out. I have a Morpheus 6.5 mm to compare it with and also an 8 and 12 mm Delos. The new Morpheus had better be as good as those because if it is not they can put it where the light doesn't shine. I'll simply return it.

[Louis D]

1 hour ago, Ruud said:

It is as if there is a law for long eye relief super wides: the shorter the focal length, the better they are.

I think it's related to the strength of the Smyth lens in these designs.  Shorter focal lengths have stronger Smyth lenses slowing down the light cone before it gets to the positive group which actually forms the image seen by the eye.  The positive group is usually the same for focal lengths from 14mm on down in long eye relief, wide field designs such as the XW and possibly Delos.  Thus, it sees faster light cones in longer focal length incarnations leading to poorer edge correction.  That's my theory.

[Ruud]

36 minutes ago, Louis D said:

... the Smyth lens ... That's my theory.

You may well be right! A Smyth lens  does more than a barlow and a weaker smyth lens might put limitations on the performance of a design as a whole.

I have an idea myself: the Smyth lens is also used for the correction of chromatic aberration, which causes the ring of fire effect.

It goes like this: after the negative Smyth lens the light reaches focus at the field stop, pre-loaded with chromatic aberration, so that at the field stop, in red light, the image scale is larger than in other colours.

The field stop crops the image, and crops more of the red light image than of the rest.

The positive lens group brings the rays of all colours back together, but at the edge of the field there is a ring of red light missing! That why the edge of the field shows a cyan 'ring of fire'.

At least this would be what happens in the Delos: its 'blue ring of fire' is cyan. If the blue ring is truly blue, then the yellow image was cropped at the field stop.

I hope this makes sense.

[Louis D]

Ernest on CN has a good explanation for the ring of fire characterized by a red cast in the outer regions of the field of view.  That cyan ring is something else for which I've never heard a good name.  The Pentax XWs, ES-92s, Delos, and quite a few others all exhibit it.  It's a thin ring right at the field stop only visible with bright objects in the FOV.  It's a function of the design of many wide field eyepieces.  You might be right about what causes it.

I forgot to mention in my post that the positive group is actually a fairly long focal length eyepiece by itself.  The longer it is, the better its performance will be at focal lengths above 14mm because the Smyth group will still be fairly strong.  I'm thinking that's why the 17mm ES-92 works so well.  The positive group is huge because it's a very long focal length natively without the Smyth lens.

To bolster my theory that from 14mm on down the positive group is the same, look at this Pentax XW diagram from another SGL post.  Notice that the first 4 elements closest to the eye are all almost the same from 3.5mm to 20mm.  The fourth element changes slightly for 20mm while the 3.5mm and 5mm have a different spacing for the fourth element.  The 7mm through 14mm get an additional intermediate corrector lens.  The Smyth lenses vary quite a bit from one focal length to another.

[25585]

Shame there are no more Vixen 17mm LVW eps for sale. I can recommend them (as well as the more expensive Nikon SW 17.5MM).

However this 14mm ep is perhaps worthy of consideration, with 20mm eye relief and 80 deg FOV advertised  https://www.astroshop.eu/orion-lanthanum-1-25-14mm-80d-1eyepiece/p,54668

 

[Ruud]

@Louis D, 

I think Ernest of CN is wrong. Exit pupil issues disappear once the observer's pupil is sufficiently larger than the exit pupil. The 'ring of fire' stays.

Also, I'm not convinced there even is such a thing as chromatic aberration of the exit pupil. A Google search gave only three results, two from CN, one from a CN member over here. Outside that it does not seem to exist. (See the zipped screenshot.)

There will now be a fourth result and goodness knows how many more. Sorry for that.

screenshot.zip

[johnturley]

On ‎26‎/‎01‎/‎2018 at 13:08, 25585 said:

Shame there are no more Vixen 17mm LVW eps for sale. I can recommend them (as well as the more expensive Nikon SW 17.5MM).

However this 14mm ep is perhaps worthy of consideration, with 20mm eye relief and 80 deg FOV advertised  https://www.astroshop.eu/orion-lanthanum-1-25-14mm-80d-1eyepiece/p,54668

 

The price of the Orion 14mm 80 deg FOV is about double that of the ES 14 mm 82 deg FOV, which I consider to be a nice eyepiece, do you think that it is worth the extra.

Going back the the Baader Morpheus 17.5mm, First Light Optics website is indicating that it is now in stock.

[Mark62]

I had a message from Lee (formally of Greenwich) that David Hines had contacted him and were posting my  Morpheus 17.5mm out to day which is really good news.

The 30 month wait is nearly over ( fingers crossed) 

[Louis D]

31 minutes ago, Mark62 said:

I had a message from Lee (formally of Greenwich) that David Hines had contacted him and were posting my  Morpheus 17.5mm out to day which is really good news.

The 30 month wait is nearly over ( fingers crossed) 

If it arrives soon and you get clear skies, you might be able to post the first, first light report on it anywhere!

[Mark62]

1 hour ago, Louis D said:

If it arrives soon and you get clear skies, you might be able to post the first, first light report on it anywhere!

Clear sky’s what are they lol. 

If I do I will certainly give my view on it