Help needed with W10 Remote Desktop

[RayD]

2 minutes ago, Stroller said:

Guys, I don't mind which way Billy ends up doing it.  Merits in both and both can be done anyway. I'm only thinking what is the quickest and most simplest way for Billy to do it and see results right now (I'm guessing that he would like to see immediate results).   Then do a follow up in slow time to do either way or both. :-)

That's exactly the point I've been making, which is that you can either fix (on the machine) or reserve (on the DHCP server) an IP address for the remote machine, but either way you should do something as you can be chasing yourself around trying to find it.

Either way is fine, both are easy to do, and both will work.  In my office I reserve addresses for machines on the DHCP server, but in my obsy fix the IP on the machine, and both work just fine.  

As I said, the benefit for a home installation is that if your router claps out, or you upgrade it, you have no settings to change, it will pick up the already fixed IP and connect.

I'm only trying to help, as I'm sure everyone is.

[Stroller]

6 minutes ago, RayD said:

That's exactly the point I've been making, which is that you can either fix (on the machine) or reserve (on the DHCP server) an IP address for the remote machine, but either way you should do something as you can be chasing yourself around trying to find it.

Either way is fine, both are easy to do, and both will work.  In my office I reserve addresses for machines on the DHCP server, but in my obsy fix the IP on the machine, and both work just fine.  

As I said, the benefit for a home installation is that if your router claps out, or you upgrade it, you have no settings to change, it will pick up the already fixed IP and connect.

I'm only trying to help, as I'm sure everyone is.

Totally agree. I do all of that and more sometimes from my own office and the house and visitor networks.
I think that Dave @Skipper Billy may have signed out for now. Hopefully he has enough for the moment to help him but I am more than happy to carry on helping him get it sorted whenever he comes back to this post, Ray.

I'm going to knock it on the head for now and go a watch a bit of TV before bed. Up early to travel north for work stuff. 

Cheers for now.

Chris.

[Skipper Billy]

OK - I have fixed the IP address on the machine and RDP still works by pointing at the new IP address - these are words I have never uttered before!!!

Thanks everyone for your amazing help!

I will now have a play at using cables instead of wireless and report back with more daft questions to amuse you all !!

Thanks again.

David aka Skipper Billy

[LightBucket]

3 hours ago, Skipper Billy said:

I am toying with the idea of having a remote PC in the obsy controlled by a pc in the house.

Not decided yet whether to use the existing CAT6 cable that runs from obsy to house or to do it wirelessly.

I am having a play with two options - Teamviewer and Windows Remote Desktop Protocol

Teamviewer works but I cannot for the life of me get RDP to work.

I have entered the IP address of the computer I want to control but every time my 'credentials' fail - I am not clear on whether its my log in details for the master pc or the log in details for the slave pc - I am sure I have tried every combination but a box flashes up to fast to read then it tells me my credentials have failed.

Any ideas ?? Might I need to do something to the router ??

I believe RDP is superior to Teamviewer plus I dont like being beaten !!

Stick with the cat6 cable, forget wireless, trust me it’s more trouble that it’s worth, especially if the PC will be out in the freezing cold.....

 

[Skipper Billy]

4 minutes ago, LightBucket said:

Stick with the cat6 cable, forget wireless, trust me it’s more trouble that it’s worth, especially if the PC will be out in the freezing cold.....

Thats what I thought ! Just figuring out how to do it with wires..... 

[Stroller]

Dave,

Forgot to ask, is the CAT6 already in the trench?  If so, I take it that the house end is already 'into' somewhere in the house and again, if that is coming in from the back of the house and that your BT Router is by the front door I think you said earlier?  If the answer to all of that is yes, then as per my PM, you could use a couple of PowerLine plugs to make the leap from that CAT6 entry point to the Router without trailing wires through the house. 

[Skipper Billy]

13 minutes ago, Stroller said:

Forgot to ask, is the CAT6 already in the trench?  If so, I take it that the house end is already 'into' somewhere in the house and again, if that is coming in from the back of the house and that your BT Router is by the front door I think you said earlier?  If the answer to all of that is yes, then as per my PM, you could use a couple of PowerLine plugs to make the leap from that CAT6 entry point to the Router without trailing wires through the house.

The Cat6 cable is in the trench and terminates into a wall socket in the house where I image from - I use another Cat6 cable from there to my indoor pc. This cable is removed when I am not imaging.

My plan is to get a 'device' to sit next to my pc to take that extension cable then another short cable from that 'device' to my pc.

I dont know whether that 'device' should be a router - a switch or a hub - its all very confusing to the hard of thinking !!

I will check out your PM - thanks.

 

[RayD]

4 minutes ago, Skipper Billy said:

I dont know whether that 'device' should be a router - a switch or a hub

Just a basic 4 port (gigabit) unmanaged switch is fine.  Don't use another router.

[RayD]

7 minutes ago, Skipper Billy said:

My plan is to get a 'device' to sit next to my pc to take that extension cable then another short cable from that 'device' to my pc.

Don't forget you will still need a LAN cable from that "device" to the router also.

[Skipper Billy]

Last question - for now !!

If I dont want to use the BT hub as a connection point do I replace it with a 'router' or a 'switch' ?? (I don't understand the difference!)

Links to something suitable most welcome!

I dont want to connect this setup to the internet.

[RayD]

Just now, Skipper Billy said:

Last question - for now !!

If I dont want to use the BT hub as a connection point do I replace it with a 'router' or a 'switch' ?? (I don't understand the difference!)

Links to something suitable most welcome!

I dont want to connect this setup to the internet.

A router will act as a kind of distribution panel, and unless set up as a simple access point, will be the part that gives out all the IP addresses to the various kit on the network and connects your system to the internet.  A switch is simply that.  It is just a box that you plug network cables in to connect them to the network, and unless it is a managed switch it does nothing else.

Techie guys, this is a simplified explanation for a reason, so please don't go all daft on me.

[RayD]

This is a simple unmanaged switch.  You plug a LAN cable in to this from your main router (BT hub) and then you can plug another 4 devices in to this, and they will connect to the router via the cable above.  The router then dishes out IP addresses to the device you have just connected so devices can communicate with each other via this switch.

[Stroller]

Dave,

Your BT Hub is the Router (won't go into any more technicalities than that). 

17 minutes ago, RayD said:

Just a basic 4 port (gigabit) unmanaged switch is fine.

As Ray said here, a 4 Port Gigabit switch between your PC and the outside will do the job to connect them together.

This is a switch. (happens to be a 5 port but that doesn't matter for now)

  

It takes networks cables from a number of 'network enabled devices' and allows tem to all 'talk' to each other.

Question.  I take it that your indoor PC is connected to the internet?

At this point, Ray already came back with basically the same thing LOL.

4 minutes ago, RayD said:

Techie guys, this is a simplified explanation for a reason, so please don't go all daft on me.

Agreed Ray, was also trying to keep it simple.  And you beat me to it both times Hahaha

[Stroller]

Dave,

I saw you said earlier....

17 minutes ago, RayD said:

I dont want to connect this setup to the internet

Apart from the Obs PC, what else might you have hanging of the network in the Obs.  I would suggest if there is nothing else, that you are not to quick to say that you don't want that to NOT be able to connect to the internet as surely you will want to do system and other software updates on that machine?

[Stroller]

Don't know if you use Amazon or Evil Bay, Dave but this link shows you the type of thing to look at from wherever you prefer to buy your IT hardware.

https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B00A128S24?tag=amz-mkt-ie-uk-21&ascsubtag=1ba00-01000-org00-def00-dsk00-nomod-uk000-pcomp-feature-pcomp-wm-2-wm-3-wm-1-wl-askundefined&ref=bit_pcomp_ask

Again, a Google search for a 4 port Gigabit switch or how ever many ports you prefer will offer you up lots of choices.

Chris.

[Skipper Billy]

Thanks guys - I just want to connect the indoor pc to the outdoor pc - nothing else.

So I just need a switch ???

When I do want to update the obsy pc can I just plug the switch into the bt hub to get internet at the obsy pc???

Will the switch allow the two pc's to talk to each other when the switch is not connected to the BT hub ?

 

[pete_l]

Before you go spending money on different hardware, have you considered alternative (free) packages.

I use NoMachine and in simple terms it just works. I have a 16 port dumb TP-Link router that handles my house network, so there was nothing to configure - it just passes data from one network box to another. The client sits on my observatory boxes (all Windows computers) and I can access the full-size desktop either from Windows, Linux, or my Android tablets.

I should add that it even "plays nice" with Dexpot on the Windows 7 systems. That is a package on the obsy boxes that gives me multiple "virtual" desktops. So I can run Cartes du Ciel on one desktop, switch to another for PHD2 and another for Astrophotograhy Tool.

[RayD]

1 hour ago, pete_l said:

Before you go spending money on different hardware, have you considered alternative (free) packages.

I use NoMachine and in simple terms it just works. I have a 16 port dumb TP-Link router that handles my house network, so there was nothing to configure - it just passes data from one network box to another. The client sits on my observatory boxes (all Windows computers) and I can access the full-size desktop either from Windows, Linux, or my Android tablets.

I should add that it even "plays nice" with Dexpot on the Windows 7 systems. That is a package on the obsy boxes that gives me multiple "virtual" desktops. So I can run Cartes du Ciel on one desktop, switch to another for PHD2 and another for Astrophotograhy Tool.

Not sure I understand how this would differ from RDP, and how it stops him buying "different hardware"?  He already has free RDP built in to both machines and working, and all he needs is a simple unmanaged switch at £8, which he would still need to buy if adopting your suggestion as he wants a wired connection.  If his client is going to be allocated to connecting to the obsy only, he wouldn't even need the switch and could just utilise a direct connection using a crossover cable.

W10 has the facility for multiple desktops already built in, which works very well, and you can access through the RDP connection. 

[iapa]

 

9 hours ago, RayD said:

A router will act as a kind of distribution panel, and unless set up as a simple access point, will be the part that gives out all the IP addresses to the various kit on the network and connects your system to the internet.  A switch is simply that.  It is just a box that you plug network cables in to connect them to the network, and unless it is a managed switch it does nothing else.

Techie guys, this is a simplified explanation for a reason, so please don't go all daft on me.

No internet connection required*, and there’s RJ45 wall socket wired to the Obs.

cross-over cable from PC to the CAT 5 wall socket with fixed IP addresses at each end? Run RDP for control of Obs PC.

 

* @Skipper Billy, definitely no connection to internet? Thinking about how you will post images :).

[RayD]

4 minutes ago, iapa said:

 

No internet connection required*, and there’s RJ45 wall socket wired to the Obs.

cross-over cable from PC to the CAT 5 wall socket with fixed IP addresses at each end? Run RDP for control of Obs PC.

 

* @Skipper Billy, definitely no connection to internet? Thinking about how you will post images :).

Yes totally agree.  Ironically that's what I've just put in the post above.  I'm not sure if @Skipper Billyhas made his own ends off on the cable in the duct, but if so and it definitely isn't required to connect via the LAN, then make it a crossover.

I guess then if needed he could always flip to wifi to download software or do updates etc.

[Skipper Billy]

Having slept on it I realise that I WILL need wifi at the obsy for updates and downloading software etc etc

So I get a 'switch' then connect both indoor and outdoor pc's to it with CAT6 ethernet cables. A third CAT6 ethernet cable connects the switch to the BT hub/router.

Does that allow the two pc's to talk to each other and both have internet access ??

If that makes sense then once its working I will look at the TP plug in adapters to use the house wiring to save a few cables.

[RayD]

52 minutes ago, Skipper Billy said:

Having slept on it I realise that I WILL need wifi at the obsy for updates and downloading software etc etc

So I get a 'switch' then connect both indoor and outdoor pc's to it with CAT6 ethernet cables. A third CAT6 ethernet cable connects the switch to the BT hub/router.

Does that allow the two pc's to talk to each other and both have internet access ??

If that makes sense then once its working I will look at the TP plug in adapters to use the house wiring to save a few cables.

That will work perfectly.  You can still disable wifi on the obsy PC if you want to prevent anyone trying to connect to it as, your internet will connect through the LAN (CAT6 cable).

The homeplug things are very good now.  I have a couple of the new Devolo 1200 ones which use the ground conductor as well, so now provide a full and stable gigabit connection so you maintain your 1Gb network which, assuming your network cards are, is very nice to have.

Looks like you're nearly there.

[RayD]

Of course if you have access to your BT HUB for all the LAN cables, and you have enough spare ports on that, then it can all connect directly to that, without the need for an additional switch.  I just assumed your hub isn't next to both where the PC is sited, and the cable from the obsy enters, but if so, plug them both in the hub.

[RayD]

This is an extremely basic and poor diagram of what you're looking at.  Sorry it was a very quick mock up.

The cables are all your ethernet cables, and of course your router (BT HUB) connects to the internet via the phone line.

I have shown a laptop and mobile as wireless and they would connect directly to your router.

[SlimPaling]

Hi folks ...

I have been following this thread with great interest .... I am certainly not a computer-techie by any means! I hope that you don't mind me butting in here but I have a couple of questions that somebody here might be able to help me with.

I have a "House" computer (running Win7) and also a Laptop (running Win10) in my observatory which is at the end of my garden. Both computers are linked to my BT Home Hub Router by a Cat5 cable. All of the software used to control my mount and scope is on my observatory Laptop computer.

I know that I can get Teamviewer to work on the two computers when I have had to get some remote technical assistance with my mount. I have never used this setup to control my mount and scope from my house .... I didn't even think that it might be possible even???? I do know the IP address of both computers ... after reading some info on the Radmin site I can see that I need this information whan it is being installed onto the two computers.

After spotting some early comments about Radmin on this thread I am interested in trying out Radmin so that I can get full control of my mount and scope in the comfort of my house on cold evenings.

Will Radmin allow me to do this on my current set-up .... ie: using my BT Hub as the main link between to two computers?

Many thanks in advance ..... Mike