2 eyepieces plus barlow = all I need ?

[Paul73]

I'm currently 1 1/4" only. Preferring (this week anyway) the more relaxed views offered by a Panoptic 24mm 68° to a 20mm ish 100° eyepiece. This represents a massive saving on filters!

My travel gear is a Baader Zoom 8-24mm with matched Barlow and a Panoptic 24mm (and a couple of TV Possls)...

Paul

[David Levi]

You're a very experienced observer and so maybe this doesn't apply to you but if you're using a scope without a goto then for me an eyepiece around 25mm focal length is very useful for finding the initial starting point for star hopping. I have used my 17.3mm Delos to do this but it is definitely easier with the lower magnification. The exact eyepiece focal length will depend on the telescope set up but you get my point. On the other hand you can sell me your 24mm Panoptic  My inexperienced opinion about your plans - don't do it!

[John]

Some great and wise advice here folks - many thanks !

I have sold things in the past that I've regretted and in some cases, eg: the 24 Panoptic, re-purchased again. So I have the habit of hanging onto things now. I'm also a sucker for a bargain piece of glass

The "new toy" is the Leica zoom plus the VIP barlow so I can have fun experimenting with all the options that provides and comparing the views with my current EP's. Not today though

 

 

[Richard Hather]

26 minutes ago, John said:

Some great and wise advice here folks - many thanks !

I have sold things in the past that I've regretted and in some cases, eg: the 24 Panoptic, re-purchased again. So I have the habit of hanging onto things now. I'm also a sucker for a bargain piece of glass

The "new toy" is the Leica zoom plus the VIP barlow so I can have fun experimenting with all the options that provides and comparing the views with my current EP's. Not today though

 

 

I've heard nothing but good things about the Leica I'm sure you won't be disappointed ?

But for it to replace all those lovely eps I'm not sure, a great grab and go option certainly.

Clear skies ✨????

[Mark at Beaufort]

John an interesting suggestion. Certainly if you have  2" and 1.25" focusers - I know all your scopes apply here - (my Heritage 130P is only 1.25") I think with a high quality zoom then reducing EPs, especially at the higher magnification level, appears a logical move.

I sold all my Ethos EPs (21mm, 13mm and 8mm) and bought ES82 EPs. I regretted this move and now have 20mm Myraid, 13mm Ethos and 9mm Myraid - these 3 EPs are used 95% of the time in the 12" Dob and Orion VX8. I use the ES68 24mm, 11mm ES82, 6.7mm ES82 and 4.7mm ES82 mainly in the Heritage 130P. The 6.7mm and 4.7mm are used in the larger scopes for Planets, Double Stars etc

If the Leica is on a par with your Pentax and Ortho EPs then I can imagine a set up like you indicated. However, I still think I would keep the 13mm  Ethos for DSOs in the Dob. The Leica + Barlow would become your Moon, Planet and Double Star.

I have a TeleVue 8-24 zoom which is pretty good and spends all its time in the PST.

So what am I saying - 3 EPs + a barlow would cover your needs (only if the Leica is that good). Look forward to looking through it when we next meet up.

 

 

[michael.h.f.wilkinson]

11 hours ago, John said:

Ok, here goes:

31mm Nagler, 21mm Ethos, 13mm Ethos, 8mm Ethos, 6mm Ethos, 24mm Panoptic, 17.3mm Delos, 10mm Pentax XW, 7mm Pentax XW, 5mm Pentax XW, 3.5mm Pentax XW, 2-4mm Nagler Zoom

4mm Hutech Ortho, 6mm Baader Classic ortho, 10mm Baader Classic ortho, 18mm Baader Classic ortho, Baader Q-Turret 2.25x barlow, Vixen NPL 30mm

Leica ASPH zoom 17.8mm - 8.9mm, Baader VIP barlow in the pipeline

 

I must show my missus this list. I just have the LVW 42mm, Naglers 31T5 "Panzerfaust", 22T4, 17T4, and 12T4, Delos 14mm and 8mm, XW 10, 7 and 5mm as the main set, and MaxVision 24mm 68 deg, Vixen SLV 15 and 5mm plus WO Zoom-II 7.5-22.5mm for travel and solar. I also have A 2.5x Powermate, and two Meade TeleXtenders (2x and 3x) for planetary imaging, and a Baader TZ-4 tele-centric for H-alpha solar.

One reason (OK, excuse) I have is that my scopes are quite different in focal ration (F/10 and F/6), and I am looking to get myself a big Dob, which would be faster still. I also do not like the extra faff of inserting a Barlow, which tends to through focus position all over the place. Especially with planets, I like parfocality.

Things might be different if I had a top notch zoom like the Leica

[Piero]

2 hours ago, Mark at Beaufort said:

John an interesting suggestion. Certainly if you have  2" and 1.25" focusers - I know all your scopes apply here - (my Heritage 130P is only 1.25") I think with a high quality zoom then reducing EPs, especially at the higher magnification level, appears a logical move.

I sold all my Ethos EPs (21mm, 13mm and 8mm) and bought ES82 EPs. I regretted this move and now have 20mm Myraid, 13mm Ethos and 9mm Myraid - these 3 EPs are used 95% of the time in the 12" Dob and Orion VX8. I use the ES68 24mm, 11mm ES82, 6.7mm ES82 and 4.7mm ES82 mainly in the Heritage 130P. The 6.7mm and 4.7mm are used in the larger scopes for Planets, Double Stars etc

If the Leica is on a par with your Pentax and Ortho EPs then I can imagine a set up like you indicated. However, I still think I would keep the 13mm  Ethos for DSOs in the Dob. The Leica + Barlow would become your Moon, Planet and Double Star.

I have a TeleVue 8-24 zoom which is pretty good and spends all its time in the PST.

So what am I saying - 3 EPs + a barlow would cover your needs (only if the Leica is that good). Look forward to looking through it when we next meet up.

+1 with what he said. I would also keep the 31 T5 (or the ES30 82 equivalent) for low power observation of nebulae. So, 3 EPS + Leica/barlow. ..Oops that's my 2" eps set!  

 

 

2 hours ago, michael.h.f.wilkinson said:

I also do not like the extra faff of inserting a Barlow, which tends to through focus position all over the place. Especially with planets, I like parfocality.

Things might be different if I had a top notch zoom like the Leica

The Baader / Zeiss barlow is parfocal at 2x. The click-lock is also very handy.  

[Moonshane]

If it's feasible to buy the proposed eyepieces before you sell the others, I'd put the ones they are replacing away in a drawer for a few months and see if you miss them. If you don't then they can be sold without regret?

 

[Pig]

I am down to four plus the VIP for the dark side...

I have 3 low power eyepieces for solar and a Count Fracular style cloak to keep the light out ?

So kind of minimalistic.

Can I have first refusal on your TV Zoom ?

[GavStar]

I have refractors ranging from f6.3 to f7.4 so use very similar eyepieces with each one to have similar exit pupils. I also have a small astigmatism and prefer viewing without glasses so try to keep the exit pupil not bigger than 3-4.

For mono viewing I find the Leica zoom excellent. I use the Leica 1.8x extender permanently attached and this gives a zoom eyepiece of 5mm to 10mm which gives a good high mag range for my fracs. The Leica with the extender is I think the most compact Barlow solution for the Leica and also has little impact on the focus position of the Leica (I tried the baradv with the Leica  but the focus position changed so much I found it difficult from a practical POV). To get additional magnification I also have a 4mm  delite and a 3.5mm Pentax xw which I use as needed. 

My travel kit is 3 eyepieces, the ethos 21mm, Leica zoom with 1.8 extender and 4mm delite. This gives me a range of 30x to 150x with my travel tv85 which works well for me. This is also the combo I use in SW London with my AP130GTX to give 40x to 200x.

For my dark site on the iow I have the Tak FC100DF and use ethos 17mm, and Delos 10mm, 8mm, 6mm and 4.5mm. However it's the E17 and D6 and D4.5 that really only get used so only 3 eyepieces again.

This is for mono viewing, for binoviewing it's all different.

I also have Pentax xw from 3.5mm to 30mm which rarely get used but I can't bring myself to sell them. I use a powermate with the 4mm delite for high power double star viewing.

So I would keep your existing eyepieces if you can particularly the ethos for the lovely widefield views. I have the Es 92 12mm and 17mm which have great eye relief but at the moment my preference is for the ethos due to the extra fov.

 

[John]

Sounds like you have even more EP's than I do Gavin

 

[jetstream]

I personally wouldn't get rid of the 13E or the XW's.... you might want to see how "deep" the LZ goes and whether or not it meets your needs for this purpose and as well for doubles.

Very nice EP selection John BTW.

[Louis D]

Don't forget that more than one observer over on CN has complained about the ASPH's edge of field brightening making it less than ideal for viewing nebulae.  Some don't see it, but enough have reported it that there must be something to it.  Most are not terribly bothered by it, though.

[John]

5 hours ago, Louis D said:

Don't forget that more than one observer over on CN has complained about the ASPH's edge of field brightening making it less than ideal for viewing nebulae.  Some don't see it, but enough have reported it that there must be something to it.  Most are not terribly bothered by it, though.

This is one of the factors that has put me off trying one of these eyepieces, until now. I will be looking for this as I'm using it and comparing it with other eyepieces.

I had a couple of hours under dark skies with the zoom and the VIP barlow in my ED120 F/7.5 refractor and observed a wide range of targets from Saturn through to galaxies with very interesting results

Much more testing and comparing to be done though, before any decisions are made.

 

[Littleguy80]

I obviously don't have the experience of all the other wise commenters but one piece of advice I received time and again is keep it simple. I wouldn't rush into selling everything else off but it would make for a great experiment to only use two eyepieces and a Barlow for a few sessions

[Pig]

I will give my kit away if John ends up with just 3 occulars ?

[swamp thing]

3 hours ago, Pig said:

I will give my kit away if John ends up with just 3 occulars ?

Bags the 21mm Ethos  

[Pig]

8 minutes ago, swamp thing said:

Bags the 21mm Ethos  

I hope you mods don't stitch me up ?

[swamp thing]

1 hour ago, Pig said:

I hope you mods don't stitch me up ?

.......Us? 

Where would you get such an idea.......

[scarp15]

Getting the right fit when you have multiple scopes and observing circumstances takes a lot of time (in years), eye watering expense and considerable learning. Perhaps it depends on how you relate each of your current oculars to your present format of scopes and whether or not you just may make changes in terms of selling any in the foreseeable future. Just a personal thing, I like and prefer singular focal length eyepieces rather than a barlow or zoom, I also like a comfortable wide field with good eye relief. I enjoy the characteristics of each of my eyepieces. There are two eyepieces that receive less use than the core bunch, my 25mm TeleVue Plossl and 10mm Delos, no plans to part with either, the Delos in particular when it does receive use is spot on for a particular target. As with other comments, three to four eyepieces on average applied for each scope during an observing session. Cannot wait to unleash the 31T5, 21E combo on the return to dark skies with my 14" dob.

[John]

23 minutes ago, scarp15 said:

Getting the right fit when you have multiple scopes and observing circumstances takes a lot of time (in years), eye watering expense and considerable learning. Perhaps it depends on how you relate each of your current oculars to your present format of scopes and whether or not you just may make changes in terms of selling any in the foreseeable future. Just a personal thing, I like and prefer singular focal length eyepieces rather than a barlow or zoom, I also like a comfortable wide field with good eye relief. I enjoy the characteristics of each of my eyepieces. There are two eyepieces that receive less use than the core bunch, my 25mm TeleVue Plossl and 10mm Delos, no plans to part with either, the Delos in particular when it does receive use is spot on for a particular target. As with other comments, three to four eyepieces on average applied for each scope during an observing session. Cannot wait to unleash the 31T5, 21E combo on the return to dark skies with my 14" dob.

Thats a thoughtful post Iain

I know what you mean about enjoying the characteristics of the eyepieces - they all have their little quirks and all are very good in their own way

In the past, when I've sold a nice one, there is that awful empty impression still left in the foam lining of the eyepiece case ...... mustn't get emotional about them though

[iPeace]

Interesting and thought-provoking.

The "minimalist" approach has its appeal for saving space, weight (perhaps) and money (perhaps). It can reduce faff-in-the-dark time (perhaps). It can increase peace of mind regarding whether you're using the right eyepiece at any given time (perhaps).

Unless I've overlooked something, you haven't explicitly stated the goal(s) to be achieved. This gives anyone so inclined the space to deploy one's own assumptions - which may well be the point.

If you observe mainly from a single fixed location - say, your own home - and are something of a connoisseur and have no real financial incentive to do otherwise, you may as well have a custom made green-velvet-lined oak chest full of the finest eyepieces available for your enjoyment during your stay on this planet.

It's not everyone who can truly appreciate the very-very-very best view you can get. I certainly can't, but if you can, there's absolutely no reason whatsoever to settle for less (within your own means, of course).

Should you find yourself really not caring a white dwarf which eyepiece you're using because they basically all show you (personally) the same views, well, that's another form of enlightenment, I suppose. And worthy, at that.

So if you feel like you've done the eyepiece thing and just want to get on with it, well...but wait - I believe the eyepiece thing has never really held you back when it comes to quality observing.

All right, I'll just say it. What you propose sounds like AC/DC announcing plans to only use acoustic guitars from now on. Very nice ones. It's just nuts.

[John]

My goal now is to take Pig up on his offer above - but I suspect I'll have to fake it !

This eyepiece journey could turn out to be a "Highway to Hell"

An acoustic set from AC/DC ? - No way !!!!

 

[Highburymark]

After two years of owning a Leica it is my most used and loved EP. It's also a very comfortable eyepiece to use I find - an important consideration if it's going to replace your XWs. Personally I would be perfectly happy with the Leica plus a Panoptic 24 and 3.5-4mm Nagler/Delite if I had to cut down to 3 EPs.

Of all the points raised above, I think the EOFB is the most important one to settle in your mind if you are proposing a big EP sell off. I had never experienced EOFB until three nights ago in Menorca. It was very warm and humid, and the sky was unusually orange low down over nearby towns - I was seeing how much detail I could get on Saturn, M22 and a couple of Sagittarius nebulae, and for the first time a very noticeable and substantial band of light was circling the fov at higher mags. I hadn't seen anything like it before. Happily, the past two nights have also been humid (though less so), but virtually no edge of field brightness has been evident on the same targets. So I can only assume it's a problem that's restricted to a very limited and specific range of atmospheric and lighting conditions. But certainly worth checking thoroughly for yourself John. I suspect it's more often reported by observers who have very different weather conditions to us Brits. 

 

[avtaram]

I've been inspired by this thread to try and use 2 eyepieces and a barlow, in my case a Panoptic 24 and a Baader mklll 8-24 zoom with a 2.25 matched Barlow. Not sure how long it will last before I will feel the need to reach for other eyepieces but I will persevere for at least a month .

All I need now are clear skies.

Avtar