M57 Ring Nebula in Lyra

[Red Dwarfer]

Hello SGL , this is my first new topic and it is in relation to M57 in Lyra ... I have tried to see this Nebula in different scopes since starting " telescope astronomy " a couple of months ago but to no avail so far ... Might it just be the time of year with no truly dark skies in Midsummer ? I have had much more luck with DSOs in the form of star clusters , like for example the M29 in Cygnus last night while trying to find the Nebula near by ( again to no avail ) ... The equipment used last night was a Meade Infinity refractor 90mm 600mm f/6.7 and a 40mm Plossl for wide field views . 

[Davey-T]

It should be fairly easy to see in most scopes, I've seen it clearly in 80mm binoculars so your Meade should show it.

Looks like a smoke ring.

Dave

[wookie1965]

You will need more mag than that I can see it in my Tal (4") but I`m using a 18mm BST and then it is only small. I Have a goto now but before I used to point the scope between Sulafet and Sheliak with a 25mm then put more mag on once I found it.

[John]

You can easily overlook the Ring Nebula when using low power eyepieces - it would look just like a slightly fuzzy star. It's quite a small object. Try something like a 15mm eyepiece to make it stand out as "not a star"

The ring like structure gets clearer with larger aperture scopes. With a 90mm you might see it more as a small misty circular patch of light with brighter edges.

[knobby]

And try averted vision (looking with edge of eye)

[Piero]

Your telescope is sufficient for spotting hat target. I managed to with a 60mm. It will appear like a small grey circle. Just make sure the sky is reasonably dark, no twilight, and use not less than 30x. You can detect it with less, of course, but it will be a bit more difficult. Have fun!

[rockystar]

it is pretty small, aa John says, easily missed. I've once had it right in the middle of the EP at about 100x mag, really easy to see, no averted vision required, I then let a new member of the club have a look and they couldn't see a thing.

once you have seen and identified it, you'll wonder how missed it

I also had the same issue with M32, and you can guarantee that is in the fov when M31 is there, now I can spot it every time

[Red Dwarfer]

4 hours ago, John said:

You can easily overlook the Ring Nebula when using low power eyepieces - it would look just like a slightly fuzzy star. It's quite a small object. Try something like a 15mm eyepiece to make it stand out as "not a star"

The ring like structure gets clearer with larger aperture scopes. With a 90mm you might see it more as a small misty circular patch of light with brighter edges.

 

1 hour ago, rockystar said:

it is pretty small, aa John says, easily missed. I've once had it right in the middle of the EP at about 100x mag, really easy to see, no averted vision required, I then let a new member of the club have a look and they couldn't see a thing.

once you have seen and identified it, you'll wonder how missed it

I also had the same issue with M32, and you can guarantee that is in the fov when M31 is there, now I can spot it every time

Thanks for the response ... I think the problem might be the Star Walk app I use which depicts the M57 as quite big ... see the attached screen shot to show what I mean ... 

[des anderson]

YEP that`s BIG, but its in the right place. Des

[Piero]

6 minutes ago, Red Dwarfer said:

 

Thanks for the response ... I think the problem might be the Star Walk app I use which depicts the M57 as quite big ... see the attached screen shot to show what I mean ... 

The proportions are too optimistic..!  

It is way smaller than that. Can you see the Double Double on the left of Vega. Roughly, M57 diameter is smaller than the distance between those two stars (which are doubles themselves..)

[wookie1965]

This is a good approximation of what you can see easily missed.

[John]

The above photo is a very good indication of what to look for.

The Star Walk app is, um, very, very exagerrated

Not surprised that you got a little confused if you were using it as a guide.

 

[Red Dwarfer]

51 minutes ago, wookie1965 said:

This is a good approximation of what you can see easily missed.

Thanks for the attachment ... It does look like a faint star , rather than the giant donut depicted in my Star Walk app ! I think my 6mm lens will be more useful in the next hunt . 

[wookie1965]

I wouldn't go so high it is not that bright to much mag darkens the view you wont see it, go for 15mm to 18mm  better views then. I have looked at it with an 8mm but that was in a 6" reflector.

[Red Dwarfer]

4 minutes ago, wookie1965 said:

I wouldn't go so high it is not that bright to much mag darkens the view you wont see it, go for 15mm to 18mm  better views then. I have looked at it with an 8mm but that was in a 6" reflector.

Will do ... have to use my 32mm Plossl in a Barlow to get that focal length though ... EPs atm are 6mm Celestron Omni , 6.3 Meade kit lens with 9mm and 26mm , 10mm , 20mm , 25mm kit lenses and 40mm Plossl ... 

[wookie1965]

Try your 20mm first then you could barlow your 25 or 26 see which gives you the best view.

 

[Red Dwarfer]

42 minutes ago, wookie1965 said:

Try your 20mm first then you could barlow your 25 or 26 see which gives you the best view.

 

Found it ! Faint at 10 mm but definitely there with the help of that attachment was able to create a triangle of two sets of close stars with the M57 at the top ... now I know what people on here were talking about when they mentioned " faint fuzzys " ! 

[Dave In Vermont]

Ring Nebulae, or planetary nebulae, are rather common and very reclusive - dim and quite hard to spot in small instrument.

An astronomer named George Abell, using equipment from Mount Palomar, compiled a list bearing his name in 1966. They can be fun to try for!

Here's a good copy of the Abell Planetaries:

http://www.deepsky-visuell.de/Projekte/AbellPN_E.htm

Have fun!

Dave

[Astro Imp]

10 hours ago, Red Dwarfer said:

Found it ! Faint at 10 mm but definitely there with the help of that attachment was able to create a triangle of two sets of close stars with the M57 at the top ... now I know what people on here were talking about when they mentioned " faint fuzzys " ! 

Well done!!! Another triumph for your perseverance and the help of the members here.

[wookie1965]

11 hours ago, Red Dwarfer said:

Found it ! Faint at 10 mm but definitely there with the help of that attachment was able to create a triangle of two sets of close stars with the M57 at the top ... now I know what people on here were talking about when they mentioned " faint fuzzys " ! 

Brilliant it is one of my favourite objects I keep going back to it. Well done it helps when you know what you a going to see rather than apps that show you a distorted view.

[JOC]

On ‎19‎/‎06‎/‎2017 at 22:55, Piero said:

Can you see the Double Double on the left of Vega. Roughly, M57 diameter is smaller than the distance between those two stars (which are doubles themselves..)

 

On ‎19‎/‎06‎/‎2017 at 22:55, wookie1965 said:

This is a good approximation of what you can see easily missed

I think Piero's description and wookie1965's photo are both excellent pointers.  I too have looked for this and failed to find it, on the night when I easily spotted the Double Double location, but I think I was looking for something too big too.  I think with the size reference from the Double Double and that photo I could well be successful the next time I go and try it.  This sort of information - referenced to a subject I have already found is the best sort of guide for me and something I can easily relate to.  So many thanks to both of you from me too.

[Piero]

1 hour ago, JOC said:

I think Piero's description and wookie1965's photo are both excellent pointers.  I too have looked for this and failed to find it, on the night when I easily spotted the Double Double location, but I think I was looking for something too big too.  I think with the size reference from the Double Double and that photo I could well be successful the next time I go and try it.  This sort of information - referenced to a subject I have already found is the best sort of guide for me and something I can easily relate to.  So many thanks to both of you from me too.

You are welcome! Forums like SGL are made for sharing information and our passion for this hobby!  

[John]

I found M57 last night using my Vixen ED 4" refractor @ 22x. The Ring was very small indeed - like a tiny fuzzy spot. If I'd not know just where to look I could have overlooked it. Viewing at 66x made the shape and nature of the object much more obvious although the view was not bright - rather a milky night for deep sky objects here last night 

On nights like this a UHC filter enhances the contrast of M57 which makes it easier to spot. Normally I prefer to view it "filterless" though.