Nagler vs Delite

[Jordan Konisky]

Astro Colleagues,

Has anyone had the opportunity to compare the TV Nagler 6 5mm to the Delite 5mm for Jupiter viewing?  Just wondering which would perform better with my Sky Watcher Pro ED100.  Used the Nagler 5mm with a Baader Neodymium filter last night for some pretty good views of Jupiter.  However did experience some distraction by those floaters that are common among my fellow seniors. Astro Colleagues,

Has anyone had the opportunity to compare the TV Nagler 6 5mm to the Delite 5mm for Jupiter viewing?  Just wondering which would perform better with my Sky Watcher Pro ED100.  Used the Nagler 5mm with a Baader Neodymium filter last night for some pretty good views of Jupiter.  However did experience some distraction by those floaters that are common among my fellow seniors.

[Apharov]

I just got the 7mm Delite for my 100ED precisely for Jupiter viewing. I felt it's the optimal focal length in terms of magnification (large enough Jup), brightness (can see colours) and exit pupil size (some floaters but not too bad).

In my 5mm X-Cel LX Jupiter was washed out in terms of color, seeing issues were very apparent and floaters distracting. With the 7mm got to see GRS in color

[Jordan Konisky]

Thanks for your comment.  So you think the 7mm Delite a better choice than the 5mm Delite for Jupiter watching?

[Stu]

At 5mm you will be at just over 0.5mm exit pupil which is why you seeing the floaters. That is obviously independent of eyepiece type, it's just a factor of the short focal length/higher power.

Sticking at 7mm or even 6mm will help to reduce these. x150 with perhaps a 6mm Delos might be worth considering, although more expensive!

[Apharov]

1 hour ago, Jordan Konisky said:

Thanks for your comment.  So you think the 7mm Delite a better choice than the 5mm Delite for Jupiter watching?

Yes, at least subjectively for me. I was originally considering a Vixen SLV 6mm, but decided to go for the 7mm since I felt the problems at 5mm were quite significant and wanted to get a clear difference.

The 7mm Delite (which is, BTW, excessively comfortable with eye placement) fits all Galilean moons in FOV, so I would hazard a guess that for Jupiter the wider FOV of a Nagler would be wasted.

[Louis D]

Spend the same money on an entry level binoviewer and a pair of eyepieces.  This will take care of 75% to 90% of you floater problems, improve the ability to see low contrast detail markedly, and make extended viewing much more comfortable.  Just use a 2x or 3x nosepiece to increase power and to reach focus.  I use a vintage Meade 140 2x barlow optics section in mine.  Even basic GSO plossls work great in binoviewers.  You don't want to go much above 60 degrees AFOV I've found because it's hard to look around the FOV and maintain both views simultaneously.

[Piero]

Another eyepiece you might want to consider is the Pentax XW 7mm. 

[Apharov]

12 minutes ago, Louis D said:

Spend the same money on an entry level binoviewer and a pair of eyepieces.  This will take care of 75% to 90% of you floater problems, improve the ability to see low contrast detail markedly, and make extended viewing much more comfortable.  Just use a 2x or 3x nosepiece to increase power and to reach focus.  I use a vintage Meade 140 2x barlow optics section in mine.  Even basic GSO plossls work great in binoviewers.  You don't want to go much above 60 degrees AFOV I've found because it's hard to look around the FOV and maintain both views simultaneously.

An innocent question here: wouldn't a binoviewer + barlow in 100ED, which is already pretty dim at ~150x, make Jupiter pretty much undesirably dim?

[scarp15]

I have a 4mm DeLite which will provide a 0.6mm exit pupil used with my TeleVue 76. I have used it on a few occasions to observe Jupiter, it is an incredibly relaxing and engaging ocular, even more than my Delos 10mm. Image definition and contrast is clean and sharp, at 0.6mm, I experience no floaters or any other issues. 

[Louis D]

20 hours ago, Apharov said:

An innocent question here: wouldn't a binoviewer + barlow in 100ED, which is already pretty dim at ~150x, make Jupiter pretty much undesirably dim?

Yes, it will be a bit dim with a 0.66mm exit pupil and the image being split in two.  However, with two eyes, I find I don't have to push the magnification as high to see detail.  Try reading fine, low contrast print from a distance with only one eye open for an example of this.

Putting two eyes to task on two dimmer images actually doesn't scale like you would think.  It appears maybe 75% as bright rather than 50% as bright.

I was just out comparing images of Jupiter through my 72ED, 127 Mak, and 8" dob, and the dob provided the best image detail of the three in mono mode, so you might try increasing your aperture to maintain exit pupil and brightness while increasing image scale rather than trying exotic eyepieces.  I haven't had my 15" dob out in years, but views of everything in it are massively better than in the 8".  Hauling it out with my bad back is the main reason it sits idle in the back of the closet.  My back was strong when I bought it 20 years ago.

[Apharov]

17 hours ago, Louis D said:

Yes, it will be a bit dim with a 0.66mm exit pupil and the image being split in two.  However, with two eyes, I find I don't have to push the magnification as high to see detail. 

...

Putting two eyes to task on two dimmer images actually doesn't scale like you would think.  It appears maybe 75% as bright rather than 50% as bright.

I was just out comparing images of Jupiter through my 72ED, 127 Mak, and 8" dob, and the dob provided the best image detail of the three in mono mode, so you might try increasing your aperture to maintain exit pupil and brightness while increasing image scale rather than trying exotic eyepieces.

While I understand that going with binos helps with detail scaling, i'd hazard a guess that color loss due to dimness is still there as cones do not get enough light to get stimulated to begin with.

Increasing aperture is would naturally help in many ways, but does not address the question "what's a good EP for my telescope X for seeing object Y". With 100ED there's also the benefit that e.g. for me setup from zero -> tracking takes <5min.

Finally I don't think the Delites qualify as exotic, they're just basic high-quality EPs

[Alien_Photons]

Delites are high quality for sure maybe not exotic and maybe not basic. 

As for floaters two eyes help  with one eye one or another types of eyepiece wont make much difference. With one eye shut my floaters are their with any eyepiece even with or without my glasses. 

The trick is learning to ignore them. When I see them I change my eyefocus to a point behind the planet this defocuses the floater my brain filters them out  after a second or two then when I refocus my eye on the planet my brain still filters them out. 

You can do this at home. Look at somethngi close like a book or phone. Then look at a plain wall and you might see a floater. Look to the far corner of the room focus on it then look back to the first wall the floater will disappear. It works for me. 

[25585]

I have a 5mm Radian which has good eye relief like Delos, Delite being 20mm.

[Davesellars]

I think a 7mm would be more useful giving almost 130x and still reasonable exit pupil. The Pentax XW is a really nice eyepiece and gives you more view than the Delite for the same price.  I've never tried a Delite but the Delos are very good.  Perhaps see if you can pick up a second hand 6mm Delos which i found was awesome on Jupiter.

[Moonshane]

I have a 7mm and a 11mm Delite. They are fantastic eyepieces but I have nor really used them on solar system objects  since  I started using binoviewers with my fracs - 120ed, 100mm Tal and 102mm f7 ed in which I use TV plossls from 25mm to 8mm with a 1.7x or a 2.6x glasspath corrector (acts a bit like a barlow).