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Good images with neglible effort in AZ mode - How?


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I became frustrated by imaging due to set up time, polar alignment, processing time, weather restrictions, guiding etc etc so I'm now a 95% visual astronomy who likes to take the occasional astrophoto - I'm not fussy about what I image so could be anything planets, moon, clusters, comets, DSO and I don't expect the quality to be brilliant as I'm happy to look at something that is recognisable.

I've sold most of my AP kit including my EQ mount but I've still got a ZWOASI120MC and a modified EOS600.

I have a 130mm Frac f/7 triplet with reducer at f/5.6; an 80mm Frac ED f/6.25 Primalucelab and a 9.25 SCT f/10 with reducer at f/6.3 to choose from.

I'm planning on buying a new GOTO AZ mount that will cope with the scopes above and will be used whilst taking any astrophotos.

So to cut a long story short I want to be able to take half decent colour astrophotos without the need for major reprocessing; quickly and easily.

Firstly what AZ mount would you recommend?

Secondly should I buy another camera that would suit my new set up better and give me the results I want, for example how about an Atik Infinity?

 

 

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Hi A40farinagolf. I have done some astrophotography on a CPC 1100 and a DSLR with and without a 6.3 reducer. It is quick to set up because you do not need a computer unlike a dedicated CCD camera. I have taken shots of up to 30 seconds on the AZ mount without visible tracking defects. With this set up I can see details (such as color in the Orion Nebula, 4 moons of Uranus, dim stars) that are not visible at the eyepiece. I have not seriously reprocessed the images (except cropping). I don't know which AZ mount you should buy but your modified EOS600 should get you very reasonable pictures if you do not want wide full frame fields. Good luck with your choice!

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16 minutes ago, beka said:

Hi A40farinagolf. I have done some astrophotography on a CPC 1100 and a DSLR with and without a 6.3 reducer. It is quick to set up because you do not need a computer unlike a dedicated CCD camera. I have taken shots of up to 30 seconds on the AZ mount without visible tracking defects. With this set up I can see details (such as color in the Orion Nebula, 4 moons of Uranus, dim stars) that are not visible at the eyepiece. I have not seriously reprocessed the images (except cropping). I don't know which AZ mount you should buy but your modified EOS600 should get you very reasonable pictures if you do not want wide full frame fields. Good luck with your choice!

Thank you, your CPC1100 is a great scope with a very long focal length and I'll probably be working at shorter focal lengths so should be easier. Have you ever used it on a wedge?

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This shouldn't be a problem: I suggest that you have a look at the looong thread "The No EQ Challenge" for inspiration! By taking many short (i.e. less than, say, 60s) subs and stacking them it's surprising what one can achieve. I think you will be limited in mounts though, and obviously it'll need to take the weight of your gear. I use a Nexstar SE, others the Nexstar EVO, and others the Star Disvovery. Next step up would be the AZ-EQ5 or the iOptron. I've not seen results of using these more advanced mounts, because if you are spending that much, well, you wouldn't do Alt-Az imaging, would you :icon_biggrin:. You may have problems with the SCT because it'll be very demanding of the mount owing to its long focal length.

But above all, keep at it, it certainly is do-able!

Ian

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I used a Celestron Evolution mount with both a 9.25" f10 SCT and a 80mm f5 refractor. I loved how easy it was to set up (I used it with the StarSense accessory for even quicker star alignment), that it had its own internal battery (though I eventually ran it from the mains as I needed mains for the camera and laptop).

EVO + SCT worked well for visual, and for imaging the moon and planets (using a 2.25 barlow and my ZWO 224MC and Canon EOS60d). I tried DSO with the SCT but it was painful because of the focal length. Not impossible but not enjoyable either. The best I achieved was this - very noisy but recognisable at least.

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EVO + 80mm frac worked well for DSOs that fit within the centre of the field of view. I could consistently get exposures of between 30s and 60s with both my ZWO1600MM-C and Canon EOS60d. Field rotation means losing the edges of the image, hence the need to pick targets that fit centrally. The best I achieved was this.

58b9cd8ed9520_NGC2239_20170301_v31HaRGB.thumb.jpg.ff36019844e122bf91bc0afc060719ac.jpglarge.58429617f0736_M042_20161202_v215cmx15cm.jpg.c33a496b68d57e08e8ebd5662e11f892.jpg

I've no doubt the EVO + 130 frac should be doable but you exposure length might be more limited.

As Stu and Ian have said: take a look at the "no EQ" thread for many more examples of mount/scope/camera/sky combinations.

2 hours ago, A40farinagolf said:

So to cut a long story short I want to be able to take half decent colour astrophotos without the need for major reprocessing; quickly and easily.

What I would say is that while the AltAz is easy to set up and the DSLR is simple for taking images, I found processing DSLR images quite tough and mine did need a lot of processing. They are also (unmodified) not very sensitive to Ha, so many nebula can look a little lack luster until you get many hours on target in dark condition. It was much easier when I moved to a mono-cooled camera.

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I have to ask why you would want to image like this, sell all your cameras and get some more eyepieces. A few lunar or planetary snapshots are ok I suppose but I wouldn't go further than that.

Alan

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For me, Alan, it was a means to be able to see what I wouldn't have been able to through an eyepiece. I started off with the kit, fully expecting to just use visual, but the challenge was there and I think it's been reasonably successful given the limitations of my gear. Not ideal, but certainly do-able without a lot of expenditure in both time and cash. It also tends to be warmer when not standing outside looking through the thing :icon_biggrin:. Each to his own.

Ian

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11 hours ago, The Admiral said:

For me, Alan, it was a means to be able to see what I wouldn't have been able to through an eyepiece. I started off with the kit, fully expecting to just use visual, but the challenge was there and I think it's been reasonably successful given the limitations of my gear. Not ideal, but certainly do-able without a lot of expenditure in both time and cash. It also tends to be warmer when not standing outside looking through the thing :icon_biggrin:. Each to his own.

Ian

I agree with you Ian; it's about getting the most use from the equipment you have given the restrictions that the UK weather etc imposes. I've tried AP on an EQ mount and it's just too much faff for my liking as I don't have a permanent setup. OK AZ astro photos might not be as "good" but that doesn't matter to me.

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Thanks for all the responses and help, much appreciated.

Going back to my original thread - "I want to be able to take half decent colour astrophotos without the need for major reprocessing; quickly and easily"

Would a colour Atik Infinity (video) type camera be more suitable for Alt Az astrophotography?

 

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Have you considered the 'camera lens on small tracking mount approach?' I'm thinking of mounts like the SW Star Adventurer or Vixen Polarie. Prime camera lenses are cheap and very fast. (You don't need the more costly ones loaded with electronics.) Short F ratios will make only light demands on tracking accuracy. In my view this will be fast, easy and rewarding in terms of a good result.

Olly

PS If aiming to go for the best possible result along these lines I'd use one of the new CMOS cameras with a camera lens and camera mount.

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13 hours ago, A40farinagolf said:

Thank you, your CPC1100 is a great scope with a very long focal length and I'll probably be working at shorter focal lengths so should be easier. Have you ever used it on a wedge?

No I have not tried a wedge, it is not easy to get equipment where I am :-) I am considering getting a field derotator if I decide I want to do long exposure stuff. A lot of EQ mounts do not work at my latitude (9 degrees) and shipping and handling the derotator would be easier than getting a mount or wedge. I imagine setting up a wedge for this latitude might be difficult, the fork of the CPC will be almost horizontal - which does not sound stable.

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I can see from your signature that you have the Skywatcher AZ EQ6-GT, which can be used in both AZ and EQ modes. Surely this will serve the purpose you're seeking? You can leave it tracking in Alt/Az mode if you want to take short exposures, or switch to EQ mode and polar align for longer exposures.

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10 hours ago, Shibby said:

I can see from your signature that you have the Skywatcher AZ EQ6-GT, which can be used in both AZ and EQ modes. Surely this will serve the purpose you're seeking? You can leave it tracking in Alt/Az mode if you want to take short exposures, or switch to EQ mode and polar align for longer exposures.

Well spotted but my signature is out of date so I'll update it now, that mount and Polemaster were sold last weekend in prep to buy something else.

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13 hours ago, ollypenrice said:

Have you considered the 'camera lens on small tracking mount approach?' I'm thinking of mounts like the SW Star Adventurer or Vixen Polarie. Prime camera lenses are cheap and very fast. (You don't need the more costly ones loaded with electronics.) Short F ratios will make only light demands on tracking accuracy. In my view this will be fast, easy and rewarding in terms of a good result.

Olly

PS If aiming to go for the best possible result along these lines I'd use one of the new CMOS cameras with a camera lens and camera mount.

Olly thanks and yes I've seen these and they look very tempting, when you mention CMOS do you mean something like a ZWO or ATIK etc that connects to a bayonet camera lens?

AS you'll know my EOS600 is not full frame so x1.6 factor needs to be applied to the focal length of a lens. Will that need to be applied to the CMOS cameras? Also what focal length will these mounts handle without guidance?

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On 5/9/2017 at 21:19, The Admiral said:

For me, Alan, it was a means to be able to see what I wouldn't have been able to through an eyepiece. I started off with the kit, fully expecting to just use visual, but the challenge was there and I think it's been reasonably successful given the limitations of my gear. Not ideal, but certainly do-able without a lot of expenditure in both time and cash. It also tends to be warmer when not standing outside looking through the thing :icon_biggrin:. Each to his own.

Ian

Nothing wrong with getting the max out of any mount but alt az realy needs something below f/4 and ideally f/2 to get the best results, I see far to many images of this type cropped and that spoils them.

Alan

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