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CERN Plan for 100Tev Accelerator

Macavity

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ronin

ronin

Posted
Posted

A 100 km-circumference collider would address many of the outstanding questions in modern particle physics and secure our exploration of the microscopic world for generations.

I am sure they have used that arguement before to make it bigger and more powerful. It would be nice if they could sort of guarantee an advancement in partical physics but any advancement seems very minor at each stage. And not sure it will actually address much at all. Often wonder if they are going down the right lines, much of it seems more aimed at grabbing headlines.

Last nights program on Cern followed much the same. You certainly had the impression that Dark Matter was known, identified, seen, measured and sold by the Kilo in all good supermarkets. Then it slowly leaked in that they were still debating what DM may even be in terms of possible particals that they have never detected in any form> I have heard of WIMPS and Super Symetry for at least 20 years and as yet nothing. So far they are seeing effects that are attributed to DM. Wonder if they should be looking at GR more.

 

 

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saac

saac

Posted
Posted

If you want to look further you need higher energy collisions it's a simple as that. If Europe does not do it then China will; they well recognise that the benefit goes far beyond pushing back the boundaries. I hope it happens but I don't fancy the odds.

 

Jim

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Macavity

Macavity

Posted
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Posted

I think most people would (and rightly) question such things... ;)

I believe in the basic merit of fundamental (abstract?) research.
I also believe, as a social experiment, organisations like CERN, 
provide an unparalleled example of international collaboration. :)
(I never buy the "non-stick pan" argument particularly either!)

Ultimately scientists can (do) repay society by acknowledging
their privileged position and uhm... working hard? MOST DO!
Some don't (c.f. "Lazy Gits"!) But we all know a few of those? :evil4:

I don't think one can think entirely in "value for money" here?
I was reminded recently: "tax payers" spend ~1/3 of the UK
CERN budget to clear up random *Fly Tipping* of rubbish...  :eek: 

I have few doubts re. abilities of the SWISS to dig tunnels!
The "alluvial plain" turned out to be larger than thought? lol
Ultimately, it was/is the technology that always enthuses... 
The fact that human endeavour can actually make stuff like:

ATLAS-cern_large.jpg.24c502e3add17dba4f8735bcd33e225b.jpg
 

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Yearofthegoat

Yearofthegoat

Posted
Posted

What about LISA, it was supposed to measure gravity waves / space-time stresses but was rejected by NASA (I think that's right)? Wouldn't that help us get insight into dark matter?

Watched Jim Al Khalili / 'End of the Universe' the other night and yes it seems we're no further forward re. DM yet.

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saac

saac

Posted
Posted
10 hours ago, Macavity said:

I think most people would (and rightly) question such things... ;)

I believe in the basic merit of fundamental (abstract?) research.
I also believe, as a social experiment, organisations like CERN, 
provide an unparalleled example of international collaboration. :)
(I never buy the "non-stick pan" argument particularly either!)

Ultimately scientists can (do) repay society by acknowledging
their privileged position and uhm... working hard? MOST DO!
Some don't (c.f. "Lazy Gits"!) But we all know a few of those? :evil4:

I don't think one can think entirely in "value for money" here?
I was reminded recently: "tax payers" spend ~1/3 of the UK
CERN budget to clear up random *Fly Tipping* of rubbish...  :eek: 

I have few doubts re. abilities of the SWISS to dig tunnels!
The "alluvial plain" turned out to be larger than thought? lol
Ultimately, it was/is the technology that always enthuses... 
The fact that human endeavour can actually make stuff like:

ATLAS-cern_large.jpg.24c502e3add17dba4f8735bcd33e225b.jpg
 

Re the cost justification.  A few years ago I attended a CPD event run by the IoP at Stirling University. One of the guest speakers was from the Culham Fusion Research Centre; in his lecture he commented that we spend (globally) more on mobile phones than is directed towards fusion research.  I guess you have got to spend it on something :) 

 

Jim

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Alien 13

Alien 13

Posted
Posted

The problem as I see it is that the ultimate end goal would be building one as big as the universe with preceding steps being galaxy/solar system sized accelerators so its all a complete waste of money from now on.

Alan

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  • 3 weeks later...
ollypenrice

ollypenrice

Posted
Posted

Well I hope you lot are all comfy in your beds! I have CERN to my north east and the ITER project just to my south and Neils Bohr's thoughts on the inexplicable nature of quantum theory ringing in my ears and, and, oh my gaaawd.

Not reallly. My Neighbour's son (a serious fellow) supervised the concrete pouring round the main generator plant, my stepson is a luminary in the project's safety research and one of my robotic guest's sons is an engineer on the project. If I get blown to bits I'll give 'em hell, trust me...

:icon_mrgreen:lly

 

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Macavity

Macavity

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On 5/19/2017 at 13:47, Grotemobile said:

Every thing sees to have gone quite since they found the Higgs Boson. I presume the next step

to spend loads more £££££s  finding something else , to keep every employed. Good life if U can get it

Have we met before, Mate? Geneva CH... "British" Pub... Mid '80s? :D
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ks7AwE3Xpfk

It's actually quite HARD to fit in the CIA stuff:
https://truthernews.wordpress.com/2015/08/01/cern-complex-in-switzerland-identified-as-cia-headquarters/
Not to mention those pesky Occult Sacrifices:
https://www.theguardian.com/science/2016/aug/18/fake-human-sacrifice-filmed-at-cern-with-pranking-scientists-suspected

Better be NICE to us though... :evil4:

Aside: Unfortunately the sort of stuff that makes the Tabloid Headlines
(and wins Nobel Prizes) cannot be repeated to order? "Nature and all". 
And, before you ask: No, we didn't ALL get a share in the dosh... :p 

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N3ptune

N3ptune

Posted
Posted

waaa 100 kms tunnel that's quite a walk! 

I believe the Chinese will build their own either so.. At the pace we are destroying the earth, maybe it's a good idea to have competition between countries (assuming at the end everyone will share the new break through discoveries, to control gravity and access infinite energy.)

The incredible ITER project is progressing too! The latest pictures of the construction site, the concrete Tokamak pit. Wow! Huge structure!!!

https://www.iter.org/fr/construction/tkmcomplex

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