Advice sought on photographing the solar eclipse with a DSLR

[Revaron]

Hi, I'm very excited to have booked myself a trip to the states for the eclipse!  So, the next thing to sort out is suitable equipment to take some pictures.  I've already decided to leave the scope at home, but will be taking my Nikon d3100.  My longest lens is a Tamron 18-270, which I have already determined to be insufficient.  I would prefer something that will get the sun/moon a little bigger, and it seems to me that a prime will make things easier.

I'm thinking around the 400mm mark should be pretty good, but would welcome any thoughts on this from people who have photographed an eclipse before.  I hope to get the sun/moon to a decent size in the frame, with of course plenty of room for the corona.

One thing that has occurred to me is that a 200mm plus a 2x teleconverter might be a cheaper alternative to a 400mm, and would probably help with luggage weight on the plane.  However, considering the event I don't want to be a cheapskate for the sake of it.  I've never used a teleconverter before (got barlows though - pretty much same thing?), so I'm wondering if it will overly compromise image quality.

My other concern is about my tripod.  My existing one is a lightweight ball head one which I very much doubt will cut it.  I'm guessing that a pan/tilt head would be better suited.  Also if the lens I end up with is heavy, I'd guess I'd want to be mounting the lens rather than the camera.  Any thoughts on any of this welcome!

Thanks in advance for any help!

 

[richyrich_one]

I used a 1200mm(250P-DS) at prime to shoot the last UK visible eclipse(only partial for me) and that filled my 600D frame very nicely, I believe it's the same 1.6 crop factor as your Nikon. Allowing for some extra to get the corona in I'd want to go more like 800mm.

I can't offer much help as far as lenses and teleconverters I'm afraid.

I don't have any shots of the solar eclipse to hand but this is a lunar eclipse shot with the 250P-DS.(1200mm)

HTH

 

[Revaron]

Nice shot!  Yeah I think the 600d will give the same image size as mine, so if thats at 1200mm then I guess 800mm might be more like what I'm gonna be wanting.  As the lens gets longer though, I guess it's gonna be getting a lot slower as well (and I guess teleconverters would affect this as well), so I wonder how that will work with an eclipse.  I've never seen a total eclipse before, but I assume it does actually get quite dark!  Your moon shot is nice and sharp though, any idea what sort of length the exposure was, and was it tracked or just sat on a tripod?

[Alien 13]

Hi and welcome to SGL.

I cant be specific about lenses because I am a Canon user but you are correct in thinking you will need about 400 mm fl, I have used my 70-200 mm f/4 L lens with a Kenko X2 teleconvertor with pretty good results on Lunar and the camera even manages to auto-focus even though the combination is at f/8.

I have used the above combination on a tripod with a ball head but I tilt it by 90 degrees so the camera is effectively in portrait mode but far more stable, my lens does have a tripod foot which helps with balancing.

I would advise you to get some practice in by taking lots of shots of the moon (same relative size as the sun) with your intended kit. The biggest problem will be getting the exposures correct, the Sun just prior to the eclipse and just after will require a proper solar filter fitted to the lens, at totality the filter will probably block any view of the corona so would need to be removed but there is always a danger in not putting it back on in time as totality starts to end.

If it where me I would opt for a wide field time-lapse to capture the event which is very special.

Alan

 

[richyrich_one]

5 minutes ago, Revaron said:

Nice shot!  Yeah I think the 600d will give the same image size as mine, so if thats at 1200mm then I guess 800mm might be more like what I'm gonna be wanting.  As the lens gets longer though, I guess it's gonna be getting a lot slower as well (and I guess teleconverters would affect this as well), so I wonder how that will work with an eclipse.  I've never seen a total eclipse before, but I assume it does actually get quite dark!  Your moon shot is nice and sharp though, any idea what sort of length the exposure was, and was it tracked or just sat on a tripod?

Sorry, didn't spot you are new here, yes welcome to SGL.

I don't have access to the original shots at the moment but guessing it was something like 1/500 but that is a complete guess. It was using a tracking mount.

[Revaron]

22 hours ago, Alien 13 said:

Hi and welcome to SGL.

I cant be specific about lenses because I am a Canon user but you are correct in thinking you will need about 400 mm fl, I have used my 70-200 mm f/4 L lens with a Kenko X2 teleconvertor with pretty good results on Lunar and the camera even manages to auto-focus even though the combination is at f/8.

I have used the above combination on a tripod with a ball head but I tilt it by 90 degrees so the camera is effectively in portrait mode but far more stable, my lens does have a tripod foot which helps with balancing.

I would advise you to get some practice in by taking lots of shots of the moon (same relative size as the sun) with your intended kit. The biggest problem will be getting the exposures correct, the Sun just prior to the eclipse and just after will require a proper solar filter fitted to the lens, at totality the filter will probably block any view of the corona so would need to be removed but there is always a danger in not putting it back on in time as totality starts to end.

If it where me I would opt for a wide field time-lapse to capture the event which is very special.

Alan

 

Thanks, much appreciate the response!  So if you have had decent results with a teleconvertor that is good to know.  I might start by getting one of them to try with my 18-270, see how it goes on some lunar shots.  My current thinking is an old but decent prime would be better though, autofocus won't really matter, but obviously I'd like it to be as sharp as possible, and the superzoom is a great lens but it's not sharp.  I'm asking these questions now because I want to have all the gear sorted out over the next few months so I can get accustomed to it.  I've seen 65mm white light solar filters that are relatively cheap, and as most lenses around the size I'm looking at seem to use 67mm filters, I figure one of them ought to do the trick.  That's a good tip on the tripod by the way, will give it a try.  I actually intend to do some widefield shots with a compact on a separate tripod, but a timelapse is a great idea, will look into that.  I've got some nice lunar eclipse shots though so quite want a nice solar one to go with them.  I have to say though that I aim to be careful not to get too caught up in photography - this is something I want to experience not just through a camera lens!

 

22 hours ago, richyrich_one said:

Sorry, didn't spot you are new here, yes welcome to SGL.

I don't have access to the original shots at the moment but guessing it was something like 1/500 but that is a complete guess. It was using a tracking mount.

Thanks!  I won't be using a tracking mount, but if that is roughly the sort of exposures that might do the trick, then I don't forsee any problems, excellent!

[Alien 13]

Teleconvertors can be a bit fussy with lens some lens/camera combinations, the Kenko I have seems to work with all my lenses but its best to check on the manufacturers website, there is a compatibility chart listed on the Kenko one dont know about Nikon.

Alan

[michael8554]

Not mentioned is a remote shutter - you don't want to be shaking the camera by operating the shutter with your finger.

During totality you will need to take exposures at quite a wide range of Manual shutter speeds - quite long to get "Earth Shine", and also a wide range of fast exposures  to capture the whole dynamic range of the corona, which you Layer in Photoshop etc.

Also research what elevation the sun will be at Totality - will you be able to see the LiveView screen at that angle ?

I agree with richyrich_one that 1200mm frames the sun nicely, but if you want to capture the corona, which extends a fair way, his figure of 800mm would be needed.

If you're taking your 18-280mm zoom anyway for "holiday snaps", that with a X2 converter would probably do - your d3100 isn't short of pixels for cropping.

Michael

[Revaron]

18 hours ago, Alien 13 said:

Teleconvertors can be a bit fussy with lens some lens/camera combinations, the Kenko I have seems to work with all my lenses but its best to check on the manufacturers website, there is a compatibility chart listed on the Kenko one dont know about Nikon.

Alan

Thanks, will read up on which ones are best for Nikons in that case

 

10 hours ago, michael8554 said:

Not mentioned is a remote shutter - you don't want to be shaking the camera by operating the shutter with your finger.

During totality you will need to take exposures at quite a wide range of Manual shutter speeds - quite long to get "Earth Shine", and also a wide range of fast exposures  to capture the whole dynamic range of the corona, which you Layer in Photoshop etc.

Also research what elevation the sun will be at Totality - will you be able to see the LiveView screen at that angle ?

I agree with richyrich_one that 1200mm frames the sun nicely, but if you want to capture the corona, which extends a fair way, his figure of 800mm would be needed.

If you're taking your 18-280mm zoom anyway for "holiday snaps", that with a X2 converter would probably do - your d3100 isn't short of pixels for cropping.

Michael

Thanks, very useful thoughts here!  I've got a shutter remote already so that at least is sorted.  I wasn't sure what sort of exposures I would be needing, but it sounds like the answer is quite a variety, which isn't really ideal, haha, but if I plan for that now then hopefully it won't be too much hassle on the day.  When you say 'the whole dynamic range of the corona' I have no idea what to expect, but it sounds exciting!  But I guess exposures of differing length will bring out different details?  And yeah the camera offers plenty of scope for cropping so I think my first move will be to pick up a teleconverter and see how it goes with my 18-270, might be that it'll be sufficient in terms of image size.  But I don't really fancy using that lens for the actual event as the trade-off for the great zoom range is it being a little soft on both extremities of the range, also it isn't great for manual focusing and lacks a zoom lock.  So will probably start looking at cheap lens options in the 300-400mm range.

[Alien 13]

Lenses get expensive in the 400 mm range, I did look at one of these a while ago for grab and go lunar http://www.wexphotographic.com/buy-samyang-500mm-f8-preset-t-mount-lens/p1572925?awc=2298_1474558851_77a31b89ba2bb721c4825c6edbab0e2a&utm_source=aw

Alan

[Revaron]

50 minutes ago, Alien 13 said:

Lenses get expensive in the 400 mm range, I did look at one of these a while ago for grab and go lunar http://www.wexphotographic.com/buy-samyang-500mm-f8-preset-t-mount-lens/p1572925?awc=2298_1474558851_77a31b89ba2bb721c4825c6edbab0e2a&utm_source=aw

Alan

That looks interesting, exactly the sort of thing I had in mind!  No need for anything fancy, don't need autofocus, can live without stabilisation, etc, so I figure something like this or an old secondhand one would be sufficient.  In fact, just did a bit of searching, and Samyang make the same lens but in a SCT style mirror setup - very ideal for travel I'd say!  And putting it on my crop frame sensor would make it equivalent to more like a 700mm I think, so potentially it's all I would need.  There also appears to be an f6.3 model for a little bit more.  Definitely gonna check out some reviews on these, could be just the thing!

[michael8554]

Erm, a 500mm lens does not become 700mm because you have installed it on a crop frame sensor, it only has the same FOV of a 700mm on a full frame sensor.

 You still need 1200mm  to give a full disk on a crop frame,  800mm to allow for the corona, and a 500mm Mirror lens will need some cropping.

I wouldn't worry about Teleconverter compatability, you definitely do not want to use autofocus or auto exposure.

There will be plenty of time to find correct manual iris and shutter settings at the start of the partial phase, which lasts a number of hours.

With a suitable white light sun filter in place of course.

At the start of Totality you will have to quickly remove the filter and take some shots to find a basic exposure setting, then start bracketing that and/or use AV Compensation.

Make use of the Histogram.

Michael

 

[frugal]

Have you thought about renting a lens? Whilst a high end lens may be out of your price range to buy, you could rent one just for the event.

[Horwig]

8 minutes ago, frugal said:

Have you thought about renting a lens? Whilst a high end lens may be out of your price range to buy, you could rent one just for the event.

I had been planning to go, but have pulled out. But I'd done my research, I was going to go to Madras Oregon, flying to Seattle. There is a lens rental place at Seattle, http://www.glazerscamera.com/rentals

For the Australian eclipse of 2012 I used a Tamron 500 f8 mirror lens, slow, but ok with high ISO. This is the result with a Canon 5d3, as you can see, we were clouded out at totality!

For a crop sensor I'd have said the lens was probably a bit on the long side.

Huw

 

[Revaron]

Thanks for all the replies on this so far!  I had not considered renting a lens but that could be a great idea, will definitely look into it.  Because I'm only flying in a few days beforehand, I'd probably need to rent it in the  UK and take it with me, which would mean a 2 week rental, but if I could get a really nice lens without breaking the bank, that would very tempting.  I've gotta say though, having looked into those 500mm mirror lenses a bit, they do seem a strong possibility, and at roughly the £100 mark to get on board with one, could easily try one out and sell it on if not suitable without losing out too much.

Horwig - first of all, gutted about that cloud!  But the picture you did get is pretty ideal I'd say, in terms of framing and whatnot, so is the Canon 5d3 a full frame camera, and is your shot cropped at all or is this straight out of the camera?

Also, just to clear this up as I have only ever owned my d3100 as far as 'proper' cameras go and I'm not hugely experienced in photography - as Micheal8554 points out a lens doesn't magically become longer, but the FOV is affected on a crop frame vs. full frame sensor - so in effect the image you see is the same, but you'll fit less content into the frame?

[carastro]

I am going to the USA for this.  Think I am going to practice on the full Moon before I go, i.e. how much zoom I need and length of subs and ISO.  I am not very experienced with normal photography and don't want to miss seeing the eclipse because I am spending time messing around with the camera.

Carole 

 

[Horwig]

That image was as far as I recall uncropped, the 5D3 is a full frame 36 x 24 sensor, but the magic of the image is what lies around the disk of the sun, so maybe wider is better than tight. On the Australia trip I had two cameras, the 5D3 with a 500mm lens and a 450D with a 200mm lens for a wider aspect.

Renting lenses for two weeks from a pro place like Calumet, for instance, will set you back the best part of the new cost of the lens, they are not cheap! They are charging £44 a day for a 300mm, and £60 a day for a 400mm, pro Nikon Lens.

Might be worth trawling Ebay for lenses, there are some tempting Samyang mirror lenses there:

300mm f6.3

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Samyang-Reflex-f-6-3-300mm-ED-UMC-CS-DSLR-for-Nikon-CLERANCE-SALE-EU-STOCK-/161863855880?hash=item25afd66f08:g:mykAAOSw9mFWH29I

500 f8

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Brand-New-Samyang-500mm-f-8-Mirror-Lens-for-Nikon-/282395081737?hash=item41c00efc09:g:9X0AAOSw32lYx-c9

There are many others there, the Tamron, as you say, would be of the order of £100, but remember that it's an 'Adaptall' lens, so if you can't get a Nikon version cheap, it might be worth investigating the price of an adaptall to nikon converter, just remove the present part and replace, my Tamron used to be Nikon, now it's a Canon.

 

Huw