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Having ventured from my all Japanese made varied Plossl to Vixen LVW and SLV and also TV Radians I am left with a big decision to make.

From the ep I have my favourites by a long way are my 22mm LVW, which I know is a wider f.o.v and then my 20mm TeleVue Plossl is my real favourite ep of all.

Has me wondering as I favour 50 degree views and an up close and personal ep experience, 

would I be mad to go Plossl and Baader Classic orthos.   I know some have gone back to plossl or never gone away from them.

I might due to slight OCD have to buy a full set of TV plossl though!

My mount is tracking manually soon to be driven.

Your thoughts please.....

Edited by Alan White
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I would have thought SLV`s would be a nicer ep to use

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I'd second that.. +1 SLV's... I changed from TVP's to them and haven't regretted it one bit.. there was not much in the 15mm, 20mm or 25mm but the ER on the 12mm and lower made viewing so much more comfortable..

For what it's worth it thought the 20mm SLV was better than the equivalent TVP, I did a side by side on the veil one night and the SLV defo edged it.. hence an ep case full of them.. 

Just my thoughts..

Ta

Fozzie 

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Go with whatever works best for you.  Everyone's eyes are different.  If you've done side by side comparisons already and come to these conclusions, don't second guess yourself.

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I went that exact same way. I go rid of my "wide field" eyepieces and went to Plössls and Orthos because I actually prefer the narrower field of view and the tight eye relief ont he shorter eyepieces does not bother me. I also hear you about the OCD part - my Plössls are a GSO 32mm, a Meade 26mm and then Tele Vue 20,15,11 and 8mm. The lone Ortho is a Fujiyama 6mm (my scope is a Meade 2080 8" SCT - so this eyepiece collection gives me all the various power steps I'll need... no Barlows required or wanted).

But the OCD side of me says... "Rick... you wanna replace the 32mm and 26mm with Tele Vue 32mm and 25mm Plössls, don't ya?"

I likely will do so before the summer. :)

Good luck! And, no... you're not mad (either that, or both of us are! LOL!).

Cheers!

Rick in Canada (eh!)

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3 hours ago, Rick Towns said:

Good luck! And, no... you're not mad (either that, or both of us are! LOL!).

Thanks Rick, nice for a fellow nutter to confirm my sanity ?

I like the easy view of a plossl, the Vixen LVW gives a similar ease of view, makes me a relaxed observer.

The 20mm TeleVue Plossl is the Goldilocks eyepiece in my collection, I always feel it's 'just right'.

The recent change of mount to a Vixen GP2 has also helped me with having more relaxed tracking.

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Your not mad at all!

Quality plossl's offer something special, a purity and sharpness that is often not as noticeable in wide field eyepieces. I love Pentax XW's, but a few days ago i used a famous named vintage plossl that gave a view of the moon and Mars that was considerably sharper. I'm not telling the brand of eyepiece I used until I've acquired a set of them, which may be some time, as they seem to be as rare as hen's teeth. Id willingly forsake my XW's for these eyepieces!

Mike

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For quite a few years a set of TV plossls was my eyepiece set. They were the 1st 1.25" eyepieces that I ever bought back in the last 1980's. Those were the "smoothsides".

Not too long ago I collected a set of the more recent ones (except the 40mm and the 2" 55mm which I had no particular use for). I added a 2.5x Powermate to them and that was going to be my lightweight set. I could have lived with them happilly I reckon.

If you have found some plossls that are sharper than XW's Mike then I'll take my hat off to you. The XW's have stood up well to all the orthos that I've compared them with over the years and even a TMB Supermono that I had for a while.

I'm guessing Clave plossls ? - but maybe not ?

"considerably sharper" ? - well your super acute vision will be seeing something there I'm sure. I'm equally sure that I'd not see it though ! :smiley:

Enjoy them and let us in on the secret when you feel able :thumbright:

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I have just sold my set of BCO's. I've hung onto the 20 & 25mm TV Plossls. I like the simplicity of the intimate viewing experience, but really can't enjoy the tight eye relief of their shorter brothers. They offer great clarity for reasonable money. In overal performance terms, there are many better. Unfortunately, the Plossl design has, IMHO, been left behind as a charming characterful relic. For this alone, mine are staying.

Paul

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1 hour ago, Paul73 said:

... the Plossl design has, IMHO, been left behind as a charming characterful relic...

Interesting... my wife described me that way earlier today! Perhaps that's why I love my Plössls! LOL!

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9 hours ago, Rick Towns said:

Interesting... my wife described me that way earlier today! Perhaps that's why I love my Plössls! LOL!

Are you being completely honest Rick, or were the words "strange, odd or down right weird" in anyway involved in her compliment? :happy7:

Mike

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17 hours ago, Alan White said:

.............20mm TeleVue Plossl is my real favourite ep of all.

Has me wondering as I favour 50 degree views and an up close and personal ep experience, 

would I be mad to go Plossl and Baader Classic orthos.   I know some have gone back to plossl or never gone away from them.

 

I also just prefer the smaller, simple design EP's.   A narrower useful FOV is all I need.  While my eyes can take the shorter eye relief I want to mop up those sharp views.  In the future my EP collection will probably have to change with my eyes. 

 

17 hours ago, Alan White said:

I might due to slight OCD have to buy a full set of TV plossl though!

I would not bother with the 32mm though..or the 40mm. 

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I used to have a real love for the plossl. But over time and as my eyepiece collection has evolved then this has changed. The TV  plossl  used to be used in both the refractor and the Dobson reflector all the time ,and with good results. But then I started to get some low magnification wide angle eyepieces 82d uwan and nagler,and these were then constantly used in the dob reflector, but not so much in the refractor to which the plossl was still mostly used.                                                                                                                         Then I managed to pick up the odd Pentax XW and a Baader Genuine Ortho. And after some use I seem to of favoured the Pentax XW for Dobson reflector use and the BGO in the refractor. I am not sure if this is a size thing in which unwittingly I am considering I am getting better views through the big dob using bigger eyepieces , and the smaller refractor using smaller eyepieces. Or maybe a more reasonable explanation is that the refractor is primarily used for planetary and lunar and the Orthos are just so good and light and easy to swap magnification in the frac(also much smaller in size and to handle) and tight in eye relief and smaller fov give a more intimate viewing experience with the target, and Orthos are just so Tak sharp. And the Dobson reflector due to me using it mainly for DSO just seem to suit my particular eye and fov preference with regards to the Pentax XW ,Nagler as these seem to be a much easier eyepiece to look through, due to eyerelief and frame the DSO so much better, and therefore to my eye these are better.

But for me at this present time the plossls have been a bit redundant and have not used these for Cyclops viewing getting on for about a year now. But as I have paired up a few of the plossl then I do use in binoviewing.

So for me at this moment in time, my particular eyes are preferred Orthos in the refractor and the XW, uwan in the Dobson reflector. The poor plossl is certainly taking a back seat.

 

 

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1 hour ago, jabeoo1 said:

...I would not bother with the 32mm though..or the 40mm. 

I liked the 32mm TV plossl but only really when I added the TV eyecup extender to it to help my eye find the correct position more easily rather than having to "hover" a few mm above the standard eye cup. The 40mm was well put together but is not par-focal with the others and does not show any more sky really than the 32mm. I had one once to "complete the 1.25" srt" but quite quickly sold it on to someone who wore glasses when observing for whom it would be more use.

My last point above is worth thinking about in a more general context IMHO. Many folks do wear glasses when observing so plossls and orthos, wonderful though they might be, are pretty impractical when the focal length drops much below 18mm or so and the eye relief dips to 12mm or less. Fortunately brands like Vixen, Pentax and Tele Vue have managed to produce eyepiece designs that deliver very fine performance in shorter focal lengths while maintaining longer eye relief. They have needed to use more glass to to this but without such designs I think there might be a few less astronomers able to enjoy high power viewing unless they were prepared to stick to very long focal length scopes.

Edited by John
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All other things being equal, I'd toss my £££'s at Vixen. They contain a Lanthanum rare-earth lens element - which imparts a nice & sharp view, often edge-to-edge.

This, and you'll save some money, too.

Starry Skies,

Dave

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Rank Kellners are worth considering too, especially the 28mm. WOW!!!

Mike

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3 hours ago, Timebandit said:

I seem to of favoured the Pentax XW for Dobson reflector use and the BGO in the refractor

Now that sounds like the Wider FOV for the scope suited to DSO and Narrower FOV for Planetary use.

 

4 hours ago, jabeoo1 said:

I also just prefer the smaller, simple design EP's.   A narrower useful FOV is all I need.  While my eyes can take the shorter eye relief I want to mop up those sharp views.  In the future my EP collection will probably have to change with my eyes.

That is sort of where I am now.

 

3 hours ago, Dave In Vermont said:

All other things being equal, I'd toss my £££'s at Vixen. They contain a Lanthanum rare-earth lens element - which imparts a nice & sharp view, often edge-to-edge.

Dave, I nearly chocked on reading your comment!
Your fellow countrymen would always normally say go TeleVue, nice to have an alternate view.

I already own the Vixen SLV abd they are very nice, however I somehow like the shorter eyerelief of a Plossl, I do not really know why.



Thank you all for your views, helps me think this through.

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There's absolutely no shame, detriment or 'making do' if you use good quality no matter what the characteristics are in my view. The view on axis of almost all eyepieces is as good within reason as any other eyepiece and there are very few examples of circumstances/targets where you can see something in one that you cannot see in another. I agree that a good set of plossls and / or orthos could satisfy most people for a lifetime and it's only where your preferences dictate otherwise that you need other type.

It could be argued that people (me included) buy into the newer, shinier, wider, bigger is better but I don't think it's as simple as that. I went down the route of ultrawides like Ethos and Naglers and they are fabulous at what they do. I did find though that I am very sensitive to CA and really don't like it. To my eyes these ultrawides produce a lot of off axis CA when looking at the moon with them, something I really enjoy. OK I could have kept them for all other observing and bought a simpler eyepiece for lunar but I changed my path and went down the route of buying ED fracs and other associated gubbins for binoviewing and solar observing, something I do even more than lunar. I found I preferred the 50-70 degree field and thus now have a good mix of plossls and similar for BVs and some good quality Panoptics and Delites for general observing.

That said, like John said, if I ever needed to find cash quickly, I'd sell the more expensive units in a heartbeat and retain the plossls and orthos and be completely happy with the quality.

Here's my current mix. I hope you find your own path soon :happy11:

20170304_164020-1.thumb.jpg.5bc44616203afb165c637f5b78230161.jpg

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18 hours ago, mikeDnight said:

Your not mad at all!

Quality plossl's offer something special, a purity and sharpness that is often not as noticeable in wide field eyepieces. I love Pentax XW's, but a few days ago i used a famous named vintage plossl that gave a view of the moon and Mars that was considerably sharper. I'm not telling the brand of eyepiece I used until I've acquired a set of them, which may be some time, as they seem to be as rare as hen's teeth. Id willingly forsake my XW's for these eyepieces!

Mike

Haloween ploss`l`s by chance......i have heard very good things about these

I used to like the humble Plossl but i would take a decent orthoscopic like the 9mm Antares HD

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I loved my TV Plossls, but one view through a 24mm Panoptic, and that was it!

I'll keep the 20mm plossl for use at puplic open evenings, but that's about it.

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I down sized from ES100's and various Vixen's etc to a set of Revelation Plossls almost a couple of years ago now, and they have proved to be all I NEED in my slow scopes. Occasionally I do WANT some Ortho's or Vixen SLV's back for the shorter focal lengths, maybe if I at some point get to observe more often I can justify it to myself.

I can't fault the humble Plossls from about 10mm to 25mm, any shorter than 10mm the tight eye relief can be uncomfortable, and any thing longer than 25mm you need to hover your eye above the eyecup. These are both of course first world problems and you get used to what you've got :)

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4 hours ago, Chris Lock said:

I down sized from ES100's and various Vixen's etc to a set of Revelation Plossls almost a couple of years ago now, and they have proved to be all I NEED in my slow scopes. Occasionally I do WANT some Ortho's or Vixen SLV's back for the shorter focal lengths, maybe if I at some point get to observe more often I can justify it to myself.

I was awaiting a post from you Chris, I knew you had changed to Plossls and wondered how you were doing.

The NEED and WANT definitions are so true.

I am wondering about keeping the 22mm LVW and the Plossls until 10mm or so, them Baader Classic Orthos in 18, 10 and 6.

 

 

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On 3/4/2017 at 16:22, Louis D said:

Go with whatever works best for you.  Everyone's eyes are different.  If you've done side by side comparisons already and come to these conclusions, don't second guess yourself.

+1................. just stick with what you like until  maybe you find an alternative?

I've had very little time this season to get any proper viewing done due to the crazy weather,  seems to be always cloudy, but possibly the mildest winter this part of Scotland for Years, even the street light at the rear of the house is on my side ( its not working) but its patchy cloud overhead)

All my  EP's were purchased  to simply trial them, see what suits me, and  I've  recently wanted to  test  various  6mm so I have a few, which has lead me to the brands in my signature. 
Its not just branding or their pricing ( although this is probably  the reason I have these EPs)  but what feels right for me and my eyes, and of the few Plössls I have tried, I favoured  the Revelations, the TV's and Meade are goodbye!
I now have a set of BCO's  to trial, and an even  greater need to get out to the darker site to properly test my Delos. I'm sure the first Delos must be near on a year old now, feels like it!

Go with what you feel is right for yourself, no-one will condone you for your actions, its your choice, and as Louis D said, were all different when it comes to looking through an eyepiece, whatever the brand/make.

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If you like the Plossl experience but find the eye relief on the shorter ones too tight (for me any plossl under about 9mm fits that bill) perhaps consider the University Optics HD orthoscopics. Very similar FoV and sharpness bit a shade more eye relief. 

I hear what you're saying about the wide angle vs 55°. There are times when I prefer to use a 25mm orthoscopic to something like an Ethos but there are times when it's the other way round. My collection is now being refined to contain a set of orthoscopics and a very much smaller set of Ethos/Naglers for wide angle viewing.

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I can see where you're coming from. Moved some time ago from plossls to Ex-Cel LXs, and while I prefer the edge correction on the LXs I don't find the additional fov especially beneficial.  I do prefer them to the 68 degree eyepieces I've used though - I find the extra field redundant and a source of glare / distortion (which is why I went for LXs over Hyperions). I also prefer the eye relief on Plossls to the LXs - to me the ideal is to push the eye into the eyecup and close to the lens, as I find this helps cut out any local glare from nearby lights etc. (I draw the line at 4mm though).

I'm keeping the Celestrons as they are decent eyepieces, but am now building a set of orthos, which if I'm honest I prefer.

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