Barnards loop

[jetstream]

Sqm 21.5, excellent trans @ -15c provided the foundation for some pretty good views.

After warming up the eyes on M42 and the Pleiades I turned the scope to Auriga to try something new -no filter- on the Flaming Star and I was shocked to see it and even in boomerang form. I repeatedly went back and forth to it and then swung the scope over to the Monkeyhead, a faint glow was there as well. Pushing my luck I went unfiltered again down to the Rosette... a large very faint featureless patch was just visible, what a change from the filtered views I enjoy so much.

This little filterless jaunt through some favorites had a purpose...

Barnards Loop is a challenging target which I failed to see after trying twice this year with the 200mm - I have seen it in the fracs numerous times last year. The first try tonight failed and I use M78 as a rough guide to the Loop, so I took a break. Back on the eyepiece I went into the thousand yard stare and slowly panned trying to catch the shade difference and that section of the Loop appeared thankfully. This can be a tough one.

I toured this section of the Loop until I looked like Marty Feldman, trying to burn the object in the brain some more.

All in all a rewarding night with the 200mm f3.8/30 ES 82/21E.

[FenlandPaul]

Great catch, Gerry.  That stubby Newt really sounds like it's giving some impressive views.  No chance on the Loop from my skies (especially at the moment as they're cloudy!!) but love reading your tales from Astro-paradise!

Paul

[Stu]

Nice one Gerry! I have a funny image of you in my head now

Very tough target but the little stumpy one seems to be doing ok despite the challenges.

[scarp15]

Good one and interesting new technique Gerry! Good to learn that you are getting out again after so much snow, a filter-less view of the Loop will absolutely require eye popping tactics I expect. I plan to visit this area again, interesting to see if the refractor will pick it up with a H-beta filter.  Really keen to take my 8" dob out for some of these larger diffuse nebulae , I feel that for next time, I have unfinished business in confirming with clarity the Jellyfish, the 14" dob may be more suited for this.

[jetstream]

3 hours ago, scarp15 said:

Good one and interesting new technique Gerry! Good to learn that you are getting out again after so much snow, a filter-less view of the Loop will absolutely require eye popping tactics I expect. I plan to visit this area again, interesting to see if the refractor will pick it up with a H-beta filter.  Really keen to take my 8" dob out for some of these larger diffuse nebulae , I feel that for next time, I have unfinished business in confirming with clarity the Jellyfish, the 14" dob may be more suited for this.

Thanks Iain, I'm surprised at the Flaming Star, this showed surprisingly well with no filter. Previously I reported that my OIII showed this object well and I think raised some eyebrows, well I tried the slightly wide Astronomik OIII again on it last night and there it was again showing it well. I'm puzzled about this object and the light it emits, I wonder what the spectrum is?

I also saw a faint, small nebula (?) unfiltered a couple of degrees from M78 that I can't identify yet, a refection nebula maybe?

I have a long way to go optimizing not only the scope but my dark adaptation and viewing techniques- the "thousand yard stare" is relatively new for me, rumor has it that the eye/brain can "build" the image for a few seconds...if the eyes don't move.

[jetstream]

11 hours ago, Stu said:

Nice one Gerry! I have a funny image of you in my head now

Very tough target but the little stumpy one seems to be doing ok despite the challenges.

Thanks Stu!

I put the VX10 63mm sec in to help contrast which it did, but I must say that this scope has challenges viewing bright stars or near them. I did get the view sharp on the moon past 200x after tweaking the cell. There is room for improvement, but I believe the basic design works well for this stuff and these scopes are not for everyone however.

I will proceed with the evolution of this telescope.

[estwing]

very nice Gerry...and unusual challenges!...i've only just got used to the filtered views of the rosette! (it was stunning on Skye)!...clear skies!

[Stu]

1 hour ago, jetstream said:

Thanks Stu!

I put the VX10 63mm sec in to help contrast which it did, but I must say that this scope has challenges viewing bright stars or near them. I did get the view sharp on the moon past 200x after tweaking the cell. There is room for improvement, but I believe the basic design works well for this stuff and these scopes are not for everyone however.

I will proceed with the evolution of this telescope.

Do you still get good illumination with the 63mm? Can't remember what the original secondary was?

I guess such a specialist scope can't excel at everything. What effects do you see on bright stars?

[PeterW]

You need some flockin baffling! Mel Bartels uses a touch to help look for and eliminate straylight getting where it shouldn't go... thus helping faint fuzzy contrast. The full loop is a really amazing sight. Maybe the "little stumpy one" needs a name?

 

Peter

[jetstream]

2 minutes ago, Stu said:

Do you still get good illumination with the 63mm? Can't remember what the original secondary was?

I guess such a specialist scope can't excel at everything. What effects do you see on bright stars?

Well...

the reason for the adjustable mirror position is to not only allow focusing with CC's but to be able to "suck" the focus down reducing the sec to focal plane distance. Here is the stock VX10

"Remember that illumination may drop to 70 % for visual use.

---

Off-Axis	Illum.	Light Loss
0.00 mm	100.0%	0.00 mag
2.00 mm	100.0%	0.00 mag
4.00 mm	100.0%	0.00 mag
6.00 mm	100.0%	0.00 mag
8.00 mm	100.0%	0.00 mag
10.0 mm	98.07%	0.02 mag
12.0 mm	94.99%	0.05 mag
14.0 mm	91.46%	0.09 mag
16.0 mm	87.69%	0.14 mag
18.0 mm	83.78%	0.19 mag
20.0 mm	79.79%	0.24 mag
22.0 mm	75.75%	0.30 mag
24.0 mm	71.70%	0.36 mag

 

 Here is the 63mm/shorty 200mm f3.8

 

Remember that illumination may drop to 70 % for visual use.

---

Off-Axis	Illum.	Light Loss
0.00 mm	100.0%	0.00 mag
2.00 mm	100.0%	0.00 mag
4.00 mm	100.0%	0.00 mag
6.00 mm	100.0%	0.00 mag
8.00 mm	99.32%	0.00 mag
10.0 mm	96.90%	0.03 mag
12.0 mm	93.93%	0.06 mag
14.0 mm	90.68%	0.10 mag
16.0 mm	87.29%	0.14 mag
18.0 mm	83.82%	0.19 mag
20.0 mm	80.30%	0.23 mag
22.0 mm	76.75%	0.28 mag
24.0 mm	73.20%	0.33 mag

  So to answer this illumination question- it is basically the same as what OO provides on their stock VX telescopes- the focal plane is "way up there"...

[jetstream]

Stu, this primary does exhibit scatter on bright stars, which was made better by setting up the mirror cell, but the glow is still there and with 2 different primaries. It does split stars well and is sharp on the moon. I plan to reduce the "L" dimension(sec to focal plane) to get more illumination and/or to run a very small sec down the road... The original sec is 75mm.

Sorry for the huge post ^^ and I must say this is not my program used to calc the illumination, it is Mel Bartels.

[jetstream]

17 minutes ago, PeterW said:

You need some flockin baffling! Mel Bartels uses a touch to help look for and eliminate straylight getting where it shouldn't go... thus helping faint fuzzy contrast. The full loop is a really amazing sight. Maybe the "little stumpy one" needs a name?

 

Peter

Yes!

It is in the works Peter, I will do behind the focuser at the minimum and also blacken the secondary edge.

[PeterW]

keep the optics CLEAN to also minimise scatter. I would flock everywhere I could and add a nice flocked dew shield. Behind the primary too... anywhere that evil photons can creep their way into your eye!

 

Peter

[scarp15]

1 hour ago, jetstream said:

Thanks Iain, I'm surprised at the Flaming Star, this showed surprisingly well with no filter. Previously I reported that my OIII showed this object well and I think raised some eyebrows, well I tried the slightly wide Astronomik OIII again on it last night and there it was again showing it well. I'm puzzled about this object and the light it emits, I wonder what the spectrum is?

I also saw a faint, small nebula (?) unfiltered a couple of degrees from M78 that I can't identify yet, a refection nebula maybe?

I have a long way to go optimizing not only the scope but my dark adaptation and viewing techniques- the "thousand yard stare" is relatively new for me, rumor has it that the eye/brain can "build" the image for a few seconds...if the eyes don't move.

You are getting excellent and suprising observations with the Flaming Star Gerry and yes achieving good observation with a filter type that is not considered to be necessarily effectively applicable, is an interesting circumstance and in which to a lesser degree I have also encountered. That reflection nebula near to M78 is likely to be perhaps NGC 2071. I picked this up last time when I was drifting towards Sh2-276, I was also using my H-beta filter suprisingly (to me) the reflection nebula's showed up well with the filter, as had, (on the same occasion) what I suspect had been IC 443 Jellyfish back in Gemini.