Help With Laser Collimation

[Thinkaholic]

   Hi! So, I'm new to laser collimation, and I recently bought an Orion Lasermate Deluxe. So, I have tested it out and everything. However, when I put the collimator in, it looks like a big smudge on the primary mirror. I've seen videos of this collimator, and when they show it in the primary mirror, it looks like a red dot, not a red smudge. Is this normal! Sorry if it's a stupid question, I'm a newbie with it.

[laudropb]

Have you collimated the laser ?

[Ally8446]

Do you have a bird-jones design scope, that is,  does it have a built in Barlow lens in the focuser ?

[Thinkaholic]

   Yes, I do have a bird-jones design. (Hoping to get something like a Dobsonian, though.)

[John]

The bird-jones design has a corrector lens at the bottom of the focuser tube. This has the effect of spreading the laser beam out so that it can't be used to collimate that particular design of scope. The laser collimator will be of use when you get your dobsonian though.

 

 

[Thinkaholic]

Alright. Thank you!

[Ruud]

Here is a video of someone collimating a Bird Jones with a laser collimator. 

Maybe you can give this method a try.

Good luck

[Charic]

1 hour ago, Ruud said:

 

Here is a video of someone collimating a Bird Jones with a laser collimator

 

Its not a Bird Jones without the corrector!

Thinkaholic.......The reason you see a messy laser, that is larger than life, is because the corrector lens acts like a Barlow, it diffuses and  spreads out the laser beam, and if your mirror was  centre spotted, it may be possible to see a reflected  shadow  of that centre spot reflected back into the laser collimator, a method  that is often used successfully  on standard Newtonian telescopes.
Your telescope is not a Bird-Jones if you take the corrector out, and without a centre spot on a mirror, its just guess work on the behalf of the author of that video!

Even centre spotting a Spherical mirror is going to make little to no  improvement  visually to the final image, and IMHO a waste of time trying to follow that method( I've tried myself, and it made no improvement) The telescope is setup at the factory, and  as long as the secondary is centred, and you can see the primary mirror clips, laser collimating without a  primary centre spot, on that scope is a waste of your time, and no-where in the instructions is it deemed feasible to remove the corrector Barlow/lens, in-fact there's no mention of it in the instructions ( Celestron 127EQ).
The spherical mirror on these scopes  does not require much to collimate.

Then  after trying to laser collimate, you have to strip out the focuser yet  again,  to re-install the corrector,  so how much  more disturbance have you caused to the focuser and the optical system?

Just make sure the secondary mirror in your scope is  properly aligned and centred to the focuser tube, then make sure you can see the primary clips though a collimation cap, tilting/adjusting the secondary if required in order to see the mirror clips ( the focuser  dust cap with 0.5 - 1.0mm hole in the middle of the cap is sufficient for the task of collimating this scope) then check the out-of-focus image when looking at Polaris, ensuring the airy disk is central, defined,  but do allow the scope to cool first!

I only use my  laser with a Barlow,  but the Star test proves more accurate. 

[Ruud]

46 minutes ago, Charic said:

Its not a Bird Jones without the corrector!

Isn't it standard procedure to remove the corrector when collimating a Bird Jones?

By the 13th minute into the video he has the corrector out, by the 28th minute it goes back in.

 

[Charic]

5 minutes ago, Ruud said:

Isn't it standard procedure to remove the corrector when collimating a Bird Jones?

...... if your not using a laser,  then no, its not standard to remove the corrector! They don't provide the tools or the instructions to do so?
Its my assumption that it shouldn't be, or not required to do so by the end user, on a Bird-Jones with a run-of-the-mill Spherical mirror!
There was  no reference at all in the Celestron manual, only to return the telescope to factory for collimation, should it be required?
That alone would deter me, it did!  wanting to try and fix it myself, rather than sending it back, but  having tried the same, with absolutely no improvement, the only thing I discovered was I needed a better scope? the OP has  already inferred they will own a Dobsonian one Day?
And is it not recommended that the primary mirror is fitted with an aiming mark of some description, be that a donut or a trefoil, in order to aim the laser beam, if you go down that route.
This  would mean removing the primary mirror to carefully and correctly apply a donut. again not required on a small spherical mirror.
Having  tried and achieved nothing, its not my recommendation to try and laser collimate a Bird-jones telescope. 

[Dave In Vermont]

Just a note on the Orion-USA 'LaserMate Deluxe II' collimator: I have this in my collection, among others. Orion swears up & down these will arrive in perfect collimation, and mine did. It's one of the best one's in my book - without breaking the bank. It's targetting return-site does a very good job of showing where, if at all, the problem(s) are if the scope needs adjustment. It's my Take-With laser for the parks I visit. If I'm going to where many other people may be set-up, I bring my adjustable-intensity model - just to be polite and not accidently blind someone else.

Enjoy -

Dave

[Charic]

5 minutes ago, Dave In Vermont said:

LaserMate Deluxe II' collimato

My GENERATION II  is very similar, but I had to fine tune mine!