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billyharris72

Petition to regulate light pollution

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Icertainly hope somebody does send this petition down-the-line to the International Dark-Sky Association:

http://darksky.org/

I'm sure they can 'muster the troops' in the UK - not all against LP are into astronomy - andspread the word further.

Dave

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1 minute ago, Physopto said:

Come to think about it, why could not every Astronomy supplier in the UK promote the petition. It is in their interests as well as not only us bet the whole nation after all.

Derek

Problem is that it may be classed as a conflict of interests? Not sure on that front.

I think Neil (Stub Mandrel) hit the nail on the head.

We've all got to know about the petition personally a little late and prep as usual in the astronomy community hasn't been strong. 

Bringing on board parties like Astro societies (fed astro), environmental groups, RSPB/A, retailers, social media groups and local authorities wanting to reduce lighting costs would be the way to go.

As Neil said proper studies need to be thrown at this 

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I helped organise a conference that Chris Packham chaired several years ago. I don't have his email, but I have sent him a message through his agent.

Fingers crossed.

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Can the petition be flagged up with a banner in the same way the mercury transit was? that was really effective.

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1 hour ago, Physopto said:

We have over 50,000 members here what is wrong!!!!!

It needs to be put up FRONT on our web site.

Come on FLO help us out.

Derek

Another though from your comment - Astro retail shops ass it to their own web sites.  Support the activity they depend on for their sales.

Ian

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none of the campaigns for dark skies have it on there websites as far as i can see either. They probably dont know about it

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what about sending to festival organisers? The north west Astro fest in Runcorn is coming soon, I suspect  others are around the corner.

I've signed it by the way, i'll also post on the HPAC Facebook page.

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They should do now (http://darksky.org/ ) I have emailed a message to them as of a couple of minutes ago.

 

"A  Petition to regulate light pollution was set up some time ago. Unfortunately many people were unaware of this. It has been brought to our (Members of Stargazers Lounge),attention in the last few days. From around 60 signees  we have brought this up to about 1940 as of this time. I would be grateful if somehow this could be helped along/promoted/advertised by the International Dark Sky Association, as it is in all our interests. Unfortunately it has been running for some time unnoticed and only has a couple of months to go. Any help would be appreciated
Regards,
"

Derek

Edited by Physopto
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yea i saw someone had posted it on the IDA facebook page, should get some exposure there id have thought. 

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The same basic  message has also been sent to the BAA a couple of minutes ago.

Derek

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ive just posted it to the Sky at night magazine facebook. Hopefully people might see it there

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I have just received  this reply from The BAA.

"Dear Mr Brown
Many thanks for your email.
We already have a Commission for Dark Skies Section. If you would like to get in touch with Mr Bob Mizon please email him on 
Kind regards
Madeleine Davey"

So unfortunately no help from the BAA !

 

Derek

 

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Just noticed this and signed.

Where I live the LP is horrendous. Car park lights on all night, local business insecurity lights on all night. Not to forget the fad for 'mood' lighting where businesses think it's a good idea to make their building look better (when everyone apart from us is in their scratcher) by drowning it in purple ruddy lights. Rant over...

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57 minutes ago, Physopto said:

I have just received  this reply from The BAA.


"Dear Mr Brown
Many thanks for your email.
We already have a Commission for Dark Skies Section. If you would like to get in touch with Mr Bob Mizon please email him on 
Kind regards
Madeleine Davey"

So unfortunately no help from the BAA !

 

Derek

 

Don't give up - why not contact Mr. Bob Mizon and see what he says?  He might be just the chap to make things happen and in a position to rattle a few cages.  (Not that I know anything about the internal functioning of the BAA!)

SR.

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Yes I'm contemplating it. But admit I was disappointed in the rather curt response.

 

Sent an email anyway see what comes of it.

Derek

Edited by Physopto
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7 minutes ago, Physopto said:

Yes I'm contemplating it. But admit I was disappointed in the rather curt response.

Derek

Yes - I can understand that.    However, over the years I've come to the conclusion that short e-mails can be very poor vehicles for conveying attitudes.   She's probably just trying to quickly clear her e-mail stack before the weekend.

SR. 

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It's probably a reply from someone who's job is to deal with FAQs and make sure enquiries get sent to the most appropriate place. You may be better off having a named contact to go back to than having your email passed on. Don't lose heart.

 

A point I have thought of - the petition is worded perfectly as it doesn't make a specific ask, BUT the rules don't allow multiple petitions on the same subject, so we HAVE to make sure this one works.

 

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12 minutes ago, Stub Mandrel said:

It's probably a reply from someone who's job is to deal with FAQs and make sure enquiries get sent to the most appropriate place. You may be better off having a named contact to go back to than having your email passed on. Don't lose heart.

 

A point I have thought of - the petition is worded perfectly as it doesn't make a specific ask, BUT the rules don't allow multiple petitions on the same subject, so we HAVE to make sure this one works.

 

However, should the petition reach the threshold the plan should be to circulate evidence to MPs of the multiple benefits of reducing light pollution including saving taxpayers money by not paying for excess lighting and dispel any risks they will identify such as associating reduced lighting with crime or accidents. We're asking to reduce the lights polluting the sky not reduce the lighting of pavements or roads. 

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30 minutes ago, Stub Mandrel said:

It's probably a reply from someone who's job is to deal with FAQs and make sure enquiries get sent to the most appropriate place. You may be better off having a named contact to go back to than having your email passed on. Don't lose heart.

 

A point I have thought of - the petition is worded perfectly as it doesn't make a specific ask, BUT the rules don't allow multiple petitions on the same subject, so we HAVE to make sure this one works.

 

I can understand the rules being drafted to prevent repeated petitions on the same subject every 6 months, though I can't see anything on it on the 'how petitions work' page, but presumably the issue can be re-introduced after a certain time?  

I note the number is now 2032, so at this rate it might get to 10000 in time.

SR 

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As I said earlier there are over 50.000 of us ! We need it broadcast on the front of the SGL Home Page. But I agree there is still time.

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2 hours ago, Stub Mandrel said:

....

A point I have thought of - the petition is worded perfectly as it doesn't make a specific ask, BUT the rules don't allow multiple petitions on the same subject, so we HAVE to make sure this one works.

I have seen very similar petitions running simultaneously (e.g. Hunt and Junior Drs dispute resulted in quite a few petitions, though each asking for something slightly different).

However, having two running simultaneously would detract from both.  People being made aware of the 2nd would think they had already signed it when they had only signed the 1st and vice versa.  I would think a 2nd petition would need to be several months after the end of the current one to avoid then detracting from each other.

That said, I personally don't believe the nature of the "ask" is too important.  What any final outcome would be should (if out governance system work) be pretty much the same when an issue is raised - i.e. identify a problem and the legislators/regulators should implement an appropriate change to address that problem.  And I can continue to delude myself about our governance systems working.

I don't believe any one action or campaign will resolve anything.  But each petition and campaign raises the awareness a bit more, makes our politicians appreciate public concern, etc. until things do start to improve.

I think in addition to signing petitions, individuals can do a lot with minimal effort.  e.g. e-mail your Council/Councillors when your area starts switching off street lights (if only to counter the objections raised by the local press and to make politicians feel that there are votes in switching lights off).  Small things like that all help, and I suspect improvements will be a lot of small steps rather than one giant leap forward.

Ian

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