Petition to regulate light pollution

[mapstar]

11 minutes ago, caracol_uk said:

Great work Derek. I hadn't realised there was already a link on the astrobuysell website. I contacted them yesterday asking if they could put a link in place. I sent quite a few mails to local organisations yesterday too but so far haven't heard much back. I added a post on some old stargazing like announcements in the hope that some of the many people that posted comments on those groups will see the update and perhaps sign the petition. 

I think we've probably close to reached the number of "easy" signatures, those of amateur astronomers. We really need to attract the attention of those with no more than a passing interest in astronomy to boost the numbers.

Simon

Shamefully it means that out of a country of millions,  there are only 5k astronomers in media contact to notice this. 

[Physopto]

I am running out of ideas and time I'm afraid. I know one email has been read today as got a confirmation of that but nothing else.

Nice one Damian. I forgot about Green Witch, I had emailed Telescope House but no reply. Ian King did reply saying he had had another email much the same, but no definite help offered.

I think I have contacted over twenty papers so far, I have also sent the article to Steve here on FLO but so far nothing. I suppose with the Bank Holiday and business time is short. So just waiting. We just hit 4,700 votes

But that is only about 60 since the same time yesterday!

[caracol_uk]

I've just discovered it's space week on Children's TV. It might be worth our while trying to find some social media groups that are following this to drum up some interest.

Simon

[Physopto]

On e other point is that Astronomy Forum, (not Astronomy Shed) is causing me some problems. I keep on getting locked on the page somehow. I end up having to reboot the computer. Finding it very hard to post there. It is the same with I.E and Firefox. No problems any where else!

Derek

[Galactic Wanderer]

On ‎5‎/‎22‎/‎2016 at 15:45, StuartJPP said:

There is a distinct difference between turning off all street lighting and having legislation for the prevention of erecting unnecessary lights that point upwards or for light escaping their own property (light trespass). Especially the up-lighting of buildings...just to show them off.

We aren't going to get people to turn off all the lights...it just isn't going to happen. Someone will be murdered/raped/etc. and instantly the lack of lights will be blamed and hence turned straight back on. Doesn't matter if the poor 8 year old was walking home alone at 2am...

I would be fairly okay with having street lights on, which I currently have already since I live in an urban area (some do get turned off 12pm to 5am though). There there isn't much we can do about this, as this petition and others prove. And even if on wet nights light is reflected back into the sky those aren't always ideal nights to image/observe anyway, but even if they were it would be a compromise I would be willing to make.

If you ever fly over any modern city/town at night there is so much light pointing upwards it is untrue. When we flew in to Manchester airport in March there were some lights that were pretty much blinding to look at, even though we were at about 3,000 feet in the air, and they weren't the runway landing lights or laser pointers! There were areas though where you could see the lights were pointing downwards and shielded because there was just a small dim disc of light on the road, not like some other areas where there would be a distinct beam of light facing upwards which I can only assume were probably from old style street lights or new ones without shielding.

 

Yes, I was once looking up at the cloudy sky when I saw a light circling the sky. I realised it was a shard floodlight!

Seb

[mapstar]

Still creeping up steadily and another 20 sigs added since Derek last posted the numbers 

[Physopto]

We need 100 per day average. Less than that we are in trouble.

[Physopto]

The article

"Why do we need to Introduce legislation to combat light pollution?

Surely we have enough rules and regulations! "

Has now been posted on UK Astronomy Forum. It is under:  Astronomy Community Forum/Astronomy Article Forum.

If anyone is interested.

If more people read it and vote all the better.

Derek

[mapstar]

Nice efforts Derek 

[StuartJPP]

Reading the responses from completed petitions, even those that achieved > 100k signatures, doesn't fill me with confidence. Even if we had 1 million signatures the government would do diddly-squat.

A more appropriate title for the petition should have been "Petition To Impose A Tax For Every Lumen Directed Into The Night Sky".

[Alien 13]

I noticed that Springwatch starts tonight if only.......

Alan

[caracol_uk]

I just posted on the BBC SpringWatch Facebook visitor page. It's a very busy page at the moment but I think my post will just be lost amongst all the others.

Simon

[caracol_uk]

Might help if others on here like and comment on the post as it will keep it nearer the top of the page and people are more likely to sign if they notice it has attracted attention.

Simon

[mapstar]

Since midday sunday the petition has attracted approx 150 signatures so still on target for 10k if it continues.

[Physopto]

Another 60 visited Astro Buy and Sell advert since yesterday as of 12:45 this afternoon, bringing the total views to 706.

Petition now at 4,818 that is an average of 96 per day over the last two days. 4,760 votes since we all got wind of it on the 11th May.

 

 

[caracol_uk]

I'm sure there must be a lot more than 5,000 amateur astronomers across the UK. Even if there were only double that number I find it hard to believe that the various companies catering for amateur astronomers could sustain themselves. I wonder whether some of these companies would consider mailing their customer list. I've never been a big fan of companies mailing me with adverts after I've placed an order with them, but in the case of this petition I certainly would not have a problem with it at all. That would make for a very targeted list of people, the vast majority of which would probably sign.

Simon

[Physopto]

Already been tried. But you have to abide by the privacy of customers, or they may not be customers for much longer.

There are enough here on SGL to get to 50,000 . UK Astronomy forum I think has about 10,000 and Astronomy shed the same.

 

 

 

[mapstar]

I left a message with telescope house and also geeen witch. No reply from TH but greenwitch have signed it. I'm not sure they are actively supporting it though? 

[caracol_uk]

I just sent a mail to a list of about 15 astro companies I can think of based in the UK asking if they would mind sending out a mail-shot to a list of their recent customers. I can understand why they may not wish to do this, but there would be no loss of privacy since they wouldn't me making the list of email addresses available to anyone. It doesn't hurt to ask I suppose, and even if only one of them decides to take any action it could make a big difference.

Simon

[John]

42 minutes ago, caracol_uk said:

I just sent a mail to a list of about 15 astro companies I can think of based in the UK asking if they would mind sending out a mail-shot to a list of their recent customers. I can understand why they may not wish to do this, but there would be no loss of privacy since they wouldn't me making the list of email addresses available to anyone. It doesn't hurt to ask I suppose, and even if only one of them decides to take any action it could make a big difference.

Simon

They probably can't do that under data protection regulations.

My understanding is that you can only use the data you collect for your business for the purposes you registered for. If you do something else with it and someone complains you can get in trouble with the Information Comissioners Office.

I don't know about you but when I sign up for things I'm carefull to tick the boxes that prevent my data being used for anything other than the limited purpose relating to the transaction etc.

 

[psamathe]

25 minutes ago, John said:

They probably can't do that under data protection regulations.

My understanding is that you can only use the data you collect for your business for the purposes you registered for. If you do something else with it and someone complains you can get in trouble with the Information Comissioners Office.

I don't know about you but when I sign up for things I'm carefull to tick the boxes that prevent my data being used for anything other than the limited purpose relating to the transaction etc.

 

I agree and I'm somebody who always says "no" to any e-mails (beyond the immediate transaction).

But there are alternatives.  I'd expect many retailers to have a Blog/News section where they post e.g. info on selected product, general news, etc..  There would be nothing against a Blog/News entry on their web site about the petition.  And if they do have agreements for marketing/news mailshot use, there is no reason why they can't add a bit to the marketing mail "See out Blog/news <link> to keep up to date with what is happening: Latest topic: Petition over Light Pollution Needing Support".

But retailer do have to be careful even over agreed use of e-mails.  When you tick (or leave ticked) the "Keep me up-to-date" check box on entering your details you would soon be unsubscribing if you get what you consider too many e-mails from them.

And I've just had a look and First Light Optics do have a Blog section and the latest entry is "Light Pollution Petition".  And another retailer I checked has a blog and no similar entries.  I think it's down to pushing it to customers as I'd expect the "blog" section of these retail sites are not inundated with visits.

Ian

[sooot]

Just asked Damian peech the planetary imager to tweet the link........and he did ;very fast also

[FLO]

On 30 May 2016 at 14:23, Physopto said:

I think I have contacted over twenty papers so far, I have also sent the article to Steve here on FLO but so far nothing.

I promised my wife and kids I wouldn't check email over the bank holiday weekend  

Your article has been added to our blog: More on Combating Light Pollution 

Hope it helps, 

Steve 

[Physopto]

Thank you Steve. I just hope it makes some one think and possibly put mouse to pad.

Derek

[sooot]

a response from a baa council member and writer, I'm not into politics but does he have a point? how exactly do government respond to petitions that don't ask for specifics?