ASI1600mm cool

[MattJenko]

I am using an old driver. Thought it was a much later one, but the one installed is old. I will take some darks with the old one installed (so I can calibrate images taken so far) and then upgrade and test again. I too am liking this camera a lot. I have managed a total of around 100 x 5 min Ha subs of the heart nebula over the last 2 nights and the initial results (processed on my morning commute ) look extremely good, and virtually noise free with some very good dynamic range. Very happy. 

Glad I have a new laptop though. Pre-processing these large fit files would be next to impossible on my old macbook.

[wimvb]

Gina, I believe the slightly brighter right corners and bottom can be amp glow. You can probably confirm or refute this by taking a few darks at long exposure time.

As I wrote before, ZWO have addressed this issue, so it maybe (almost) something of the past.

[Gina]

I will take a set of darks.  So far I've only taken lights.  Now trying to get to grips with imaging after a break of a year or two.

[Jokehoba]

2 hours ago, MattJenko said:

I am using an old driver. Thought it was a much later one, but the one installed is old.

Despite uninstalling/re-installing all the camera software and drivers, Windows 10 still reports v1.0.0.3 rather than 1.0.2.13.

However, the ASCOM configuration dialog for the camera shows v6.0.2.13. So does this mean I have the latest version? The ZWO ASCOM installer puts DLLs in C:\Program Files (x86)\Common Files\ASCOM\Camera\ZWO, which seem to be the latest ones. Confusing.

[Gina]

It may depend on whether you've got the latest version of the camera with the USB hub (which I have) - they may have made other improvements as well as adding the USB hub.

[Jokehoba]

Gina, mine has the USB hub too. Out of interest, what version does Device Manager report for your camera? And the ASCOM dialog? I may be fretting over nothing.

[Gina]

Can't get the darks to work in FITS Liberator but here is a screenshot from APT which might show a slight lightness in the bottom right corner but not easy to see.

[Jokehoba]

On 17/08/2016 at 13:10, Jokehoba said:

Despite uninstalling/re-installing all the camera software and drivers, Windows 10 still reports v1.0.0.3 rather than 1.0.2.13.

However, the ASCOM configuration dialog for the camera shows v6.0.2.13. So does this mean I have the latest version? The ZWO ASCOM installer puts DLLs in C:\Program Files (x86)\Common Files\ASCOM\Camera\ZWO, which seem to be the latest ones. Confusing.

I posed the question on the ZWO forum and was told to ensure the ASCOM driver is the latest. I re-installed an earlier driver (v1.0.2.9) and ASCOM reported it as v6.0.2.9. Then I ran the v1.0.2.13 update and ASCOM now states v6.0.2.13. So forget what Windows indicates - ASCOM is the key version, despite the '6' and is the most up-to-date driver. Phew!

[Jokehoba]

Here's the result of my second night out with the ASI1600MM - the Bubble nebula in Ha. I've been experimenting with shorter subs and the 'unity gain' setting. This is 58 x 120s at -10C and calibrated with a BPM and no flats. (Due to a problem in my imaging path, the flats had a nasty central ring artefact, ruining the calibration. Sorted now.) There's no post-processing other than cropping and stretching.

[Gina]

Great image   I'm waiting for a gap in the clouds to have another go with mine.  Look like this camera is going to be winner

[Allinthehead]

I'm about to buy this camera but i can't afford the electronic filter wheel and filters yet. Would i still be able to use the camera and just shoot mono for now with the camera connected directly to my scope? 

[Guest]

I got my scope all balanced in preparation for what looks like delivery of my ASI1600 tomorrow or the day after (see below)

I'm new to LRGB imaging* so I've been having fun digging around all the forums to find out how and where to start.

From what I've read people are really pleased with its performance. I opted for the manual filter wheel and ZWO filter set as I needed to keep the costs down - but they're so inexpensive that replacing them later shouldn't hurt too much :-) .....and the fact that I'll probably put my thumb on one of them before it even gets to the filter wheel....I'm not kidding....this will happen....lol

 

 

*you can buy my QHY8 and QHY6 - they're in the classified section :-)

David

 

[sloz1664]

12 hours ago, Allinthehead said:

I'm about to buy this camera but i can't afford the electronic filter wheel and filters yet. Would i still be able to use the camera and just shoot mono for now with the camera connected directly to my scope? 

Yes you can and it will give you a good grounding on how to set up, fine tune and use the camera prior to obtaining the filterwheel & filters. The big advantage is you can use your mono subs as (L) luminance in a set of LRGB subs.

 

Steve 

[nightster]

22 hours ago, Allinthehead said:

I'm about to buy this camera but i can't afford the electronic filter wheel and filters yet. Would i still be able to use the camera and just shoot mono for now with the camera connected directly to my scope? 

You will most likely develop a strong appreciation of black and white astro images, if you don't already. Learning to get all that amazing detail that the mono sensor allows is just a joy. And it will allow you to focus on how your new camera works with the software you've chosen. It is actually a smart way to learn mono imaging. 

[Allinthehead]

Thanks for the advice. Ordered the camera. Now for the agonising wait for my new toy, and then the agonising wait for clear skies to play with it. Stupid hobby

[wimvb]

25 minutes ago, Allinthehead said:

Thanks for the advice. Ordered the camera. Now for the agonising wait for my new toy, and then the agonising wait for clear skies to play with it. Stupid hobby

Number of cloudy nights is proportional to money spent.

And from personal experience: cloudy nights only occur when it's dark (the cloud gods keep  score)

 

[Guest]

34 minutes ago, Allinthehead said:

Thanks for the advice. Ordered the camera. Now for the agonising wait for my new toy, and then the agonising wait for clear skies to play with it. Stupid hobby

My wait is over - FLO delivered my gear today (excellent supplier)......but now for the agonizing search for answers on how to use it lol

Reminds me of when I bought the QHY8...virtually no useful guidance from the manufacturer (the user manual supplied with the ASI1600 doesn't contain any specific user guidance for it), joined the user group and found very few answers there but this forum and others are proving useful - but a general "getting started" thread alludes me :-)

I will find it, and probably learn much more because I had to search.

David

[wimvb]

Looks like a great opportunity for a write-up once you've figured it out

[Guest]

2 minutes ago, wimvb said:

Looks like a great opportunity for a write-up once you've figured it out

I said I would do that when I bought the QHY8 and struggled to find guidance (I think the posts are still in SGL) 

This time I might actually do it :-)

First stop was the power supply requirements: One ZWO manual says 2 amp max; another says 2.5, the back of the unit says 2 amp, ZWO user group response ....from ZWO...says "....suggest more than 3 amp" :-)

So what am I doing about that? Plugging it into my 12v power supply switch box and letting the gods sort it out har har (I've got a 3 amp fuse on the power switch ...I think lol) 

David

 

[Gina]

SharpCap is a good imaging app for these cameras.  APT also works with the ZWO ASCOM driver installed.  Both are for Windows.

[Guest]

3 minutes ago, Gina said:

SharpCap is a good imaging app for these cameras.  APT also works with the ZWO ASCOM driver installed.  Both are for Windows.

That's great advice - thank you :-)

I was reading up on APT following an earlier post by you so thanks for that too Gina 

I have Nebulosity 4 and it connected easily with the camera so that's going well for now - but APT looks amazing so I'm going to check that out once I get the 1600 under control lol

David

[Guest]

First start up was pretty easy :-)

After downloading the lastest ASCOM and camera drivers I mounted everything on the scopes, connected all the cables required

I connected the ASI1600 to Nebulosity 4 by selecting "ZWO Cameras" from the bottom of the list

I connected an ASI120MC guide camera to the ASI1600 on-board hub and then to PHD2 - no problems

Before I switched on the power I took a quick preview in Nebulosity 4 and got the image below - it shows me what it looks like when the manual filter wheel isn't advanced correctly ....and what it looks like inside a photocopier when someone takes a "cheeky" picture at the office Christmas party....

I finally switched on the power and all seems to be working well.

Of course I have 4 pressing questions

1. How do I determine set point temperature based on ambient (I can see where to set it in Neb4)

2. What gain should I use - I've heard 70-100 is a good start and unity gain = 139 - Neb4 set it at 50 and it says "8%" to the left of that so a bit of reading to do...

3. What offset should I use - I've heard 10 used quite a bit, and Neb4 set that as default

I understand that it will be trial and error with the luminance  filter requiring different settings to the RGB......so much to learn and, if the forecast for Friday night is correct for my area....so little time to learn it :-)

David

 

 

[Gina]

I can't comment on Nebulosity. 

1. The limit on cooling is 35-40°C below ambient
2. Low gain such as 100 or less will give low noise but I've used up to 500.  Around 300 seems a good compromise.  The gain is a logarithmic scale with 0 representing a gain of 1.
3. Not sure what you mean by "offset" (black level?)

So far I have only tried it with Ha filter and briefly with Luminance which was not very successful but bear in mind I'm just starting imaging with this camera and suffering from very little clear night skies.  Plus software and my astro laptop running Win7 have been playing up.

[Guest]

37 minutes ago, Gina said:

I can't comment on Nebulosity. 

1. The limit on cooling is 35-40°C below ambient
2. Low gain such as 100 or less will give low noise but I've used up to 500.  Around 300 seems a good compromise.  The gain is a logarithmic scale with 0 representing a gain of 1.
3. Not sure what you mean by "offset" (black level?)

So far I have only tried it with Ha filter and briefly with Luminance which was not very successful but bear in mind I'm just starting imaging with this camera and suffering from very little clear night skies.  Plus software and my astro laptop running Win7 have been playing up.

Thanks Gina - that's interesting about the gain - I've always been afraid to increase it due to what I thought was the introduction of noise (it was set at zero with the QHY8) but it's time I read about it to understand its use :-)

I found this article concerning gain and offset on Craig Starks page - it will be a good start as I don't know how offset works either, just that there is normally a standard setting - there was for the QHY8 (124) so I assume there is for the 1600 (it appears to be 10)? But now, for the first time in 6 years of astrophotography I'm going to read about these things to really understand them, finally, hopefully :-) When I've tried before I found the detail I was getting into wasn't improving my images though. I'm sure it probably won't now but I'll understand what the camera is doing a bit better.

David

 

[Jokehoba]

15 hours ago, David_L said:

I have Nebulosity 4 and it connected easily with the camera so that's going well for now - but APT looks amazing so I'm going to check that out once I get the 1600 under control lol

Though I have Nebulosity (I use it for calibration), I've always used APT for camera control since Neb seemed very basic, especially in respect to DSLR control. APT has always been great, very flexible and the ASI1600 just works! So thumbs up for APT.

13 hours ago, David_L said:

Of course I have 4 pressing questions

1. How do I determine set point temperature based on ambient (I can see where to set it in Neb4)

2. What gain should I use - I've heard 70-100 is a good start and unity gain = 139 - Neb4 set it at 50 and it says "8%" to the left of that so a bit of reading to do...

3. What offset should I use - I've heard 10 used quite a bit, and Neb4 set that as default

I understand that it will be trial and error with the luminance  filter requiring different settings to the RGB......so much to learn and, if the forecast for Friday night is correct for my area....so little time to learn it :-)

David

APT has a useful Cooling Aid (and Warm up aid) allowing full control over the set-point temperature.

The offset ensures that the low end of the dynamic range is not lost (i.e., low values register and don't get rounded down to zero). At least that's my understanding.

I'm also new to LRGB imaging and got the ASI1600MM to:

• get higher resolution Ha/O3 NB images (having been doing this with the DSLR up to now)
• get L to combine with my existing RGB images from the DSLR and hopefully bring out more detail
• perhaps later invest in a filter wheel/RGB filters to be able to do true LRGB imaging (or maybe a second ZWO cooled OSC camera...or maybe not - that sounds expensive!)

So far using the camera has been trial and error. But I've found the built-in presets are as a good a starting point as any. I've used 'unity gain' with 2min subs but felt they were a bit noisy; I've tried 'highest dynamic range' and 5min subs but signal is a bit too low. Looking at the charts on the ZWO website (https://astronomy-imaging-camera.com/products/asi-cooled-cameras/asi1600mm-cool/), I'm going to try a gain of 50 with 5min subs (when skies clear) and see how that turns out. Plus I've only cooled to -10C, so not sure how much less noisy subs will be if I push the temperature way down.

However, ultimately actual settings will be dictated by sky darkness, target brightness and imaging/guiding/mount rig.