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malnuman

Skywatcher Heritage 130p. Eyepiece for close Moon viewing?

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Yep another question from me,  I have the two standard eyepieces  that came with my Heritage 130p,  the 10 and 25mm..  I am looking for two more, mainly for getting good close ups of the moon and also one for further away planets..  I saw a video clip on youtube,  where a guy,  with a Heritage 130p has a great close up view of the moon using a 9.7mm eyepiece,  but that don't seem much more difference than my 10mm.     I am looking to spend around £20/£25 for each eyepiece.. thanks    

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This is a pretty decent Barlow for the money and would double the magnification of both your eyepieces: http://www.firstlightoptics.com/celestron-eyepieces/celestron-2x-universal-125-barlow.html

synta1fx.jpg

Mine was from the AstroMaster Kit and I believe they're Synta made. It would give your 10mm EP 130x on your scope. With a focal length of only 650mm I would opt for a 3x Barlow personally for lunar/planetary, but they can be expensive.

TS mine.jpg

This Revelation 2.5x apochromatic Barlow is pretty good, I have the TS Optics version. It is originally Guan Sheng Optical: http://www.telescopehouse.com/barlows/revelation-barlows/revelation-astro-2-5x-barlow-lens.html

It would give your 10mm EP a 162.5x, which is a good planetary lunar/magnification.

Edited by Mak the Night
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thanks Mak,  is this the same as the 2xbarlow deluxe, as I have one of those..   I havnt been able to use my scope yet due to bad weather since it arrived on Monday,     another guy on youtube was using a 4mm for moon viewing with his Heritage 130p,  but the eyepiece viewer was like a pinhole,  

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I'd certainly wait until you have explored the options which come with your telescope. In theory, your supplied 10mm with x2 Barlow should give you x130 magnification which will work well for both the Moon and planets such as Jupiter and Saturn.

If you see astronomy as being a long-term hobby, rather than buying two EPs for 50 pounds, I would buy only one but of better quality. If you upgrade your telescope in the future, your EPs will work with the new one. Higher magnification Plossl-design EPs tend to have very short eye relief which can be uncomfortable, and impossible if you need to wear glasses to observe. More recent designs, however, are greatly improved. BST Explorer EPs are well recommended for value. This link shows the complete line, but they are of course available individually:

http://www.365astronomy.com/BST-Explorer-ED-Eyepiece-KIT-3.2mm-5mm-8mm-12mm-15mm-18mm-and-25mm-Eyepieces.html

 

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11 minutes ago, malnuman said:

thanks Mak,  is this the same as the 2xbarlow deluxe, as I have one of those..   I havnt been able to use my scope yet due to bad weather since it arrived on Monday,     another guy on youtube was using a 4mm for moon viewing with his Heritage 130p,  but the eyepiece viewer was like a pinhole,  

Yeah, I'm pretty sure it's the same as the Sky-Watcher Deluxe, they are made by Synta. They are pretty good quality for what they cost. I'd much rather 'Barlow-up' a longer focal length eyepiece than use a smaller. A 4mm sounds like you'd need a gnat's eyeball to use it. The smallest I'll use is an 8mm. I do have a couple of Celestron 6mm Plossls and they're hard work!

6mm pair side.jpg

I have a 10mm Baader Eudiascopic that I've been using a bit on my 90mm Mak. It's around the same physical size as the 10mm Modified Achromat that came with your scope. Combined with the Deluxe Barlow you should get 130x on the Moon. The Moon looks pretty good at that magnification. You should be able to push that Heritage to 250x - 300x with the Moon though. I have a 130mm Explorer (900mm f/l), to get a decent magnification for lunar/planetary I ended up buying a TeleVue 3x Barlow.

LuminosTV3x.jpg

With this and a 10mm EP (Celestron Luminos) I could achieve 270x for lunar viewing. I used the 3x with a variety of eyepieces above 10mm and even with these Celestron 15mm and 20mm relatively inexpensive eyepieces.

Celestron Kellner and Erector.jpg

I think you would be better off using a more powerful Barlow with a larger focal length eyepiece with a scope of 650mm f/l. Very small eyepieces may give you the magnification but any target will rapidly move out of frame due to Right Ascension. The larger the eyepiece, the larger the FOV and field stop usually.

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thanks for the helpful replies, wow,  so many variations you can use,  bit daunting to a total newcomer like me..  would a  1.25" 8mm BST Explorer Dual ED eyepiece Branded "Starguider"   be any good instead of buying two cheaper eyepieces?    they sell these on ebay for £50.. but I will wait first until I use my scope a few times

Edited by malnuman
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1 hour ago, malnuman said:

thanks for the helpful replies, wow,  so many variations you can use,  bit daunting to a total newcomer like me..  would a  1.25" 8mm BST Explorer Dual ED eyepiece Branded "Starguider"   be any good instead of buying two cheaper eyepieces?    they sell these on ebay for £50.. but I will wait first until I use my scope a few times

I'm pretty sure the BST Starguiders are Barsta made: http://www.barsta.com/show_hdr.php?xname=MDA8V11&dname=OPFOR71&xpos=13

My Omegon 2x apochromatic Barlow is Barsta.

Omegon Barsta.jpg

The Explorer/Starguiders are highly rated I believe and are good value for the money. My Omegon Barlow is very good quality I think.

I found this (below link) for £46.40.

http://www.365astronomy.com/8mm-BST-Explorer-ED-Eyepiece.html

It has a decent eye relief and a 60° field of view, and I’m guessing a pretty generous field stop measurement, so it will certainly be better than a normal Plossl in many respects. It should be good in a fast scope as well.

Edited by Mak the Night
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I would buy a good 12-16mm eyepiece, my 16mm is used loads and good on dso don't always want to get too close. You already have a barlow so 16mm become higher than 10mm when used with a barlow.

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I think the OP wanted eyepieces for lunar/planetary though. Even a 13mm would only give 50x with a 650mm f/l scope. DSO's will be easy enough I reckon in an f/5 scope but realistic planetary magnifications, around 100x - 150x at the lowest, will be more difficult. The Moon can look pretty stunning at around 50x though.

A 2x Barlow effectively turns a 10mm eyepiece into a 5mm one. A 16mm eyepiece will only ever become an 8mm eyepiece with a 2x Barlow.

Edited by Mak the Night

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Then the bst 8mm would be useful on days where the seeing means you can't barlow it further.

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Basically, the 8mm Barsta will give 81.25x without a Barlow, which isn't bad for lunar viewing, and a 162.5x with the 2x Barlow. Personally, I reckon at least 270x can be achieved for lunar viewing on a 130mm scope. I can easily get 203x on the Moon with my 16mm T5 Nagler and a 2.5x Powermate on a 102mm Mak.

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thanks Happy-Kat,   them 16mm can get expensive,  I found one at £55,     a 16mm or a  8mm BST Explorer ED Eyepiece?.. choices choices!.....   think I need a few weeks just looking up at the skies with what I have before I decide on other eyepieces and investing more money..

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Good idea, the 25mm with barlow would give you a mid range so try that. The 10mm is the weaker eyepiece and if you love the Moon a better high powered could be great.

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take your time with your scope and see how much detail you get with your existing combinations. Bear in mind that as you crank up the magnification you also dim the view which becomes susceptible to atmospheric haze and a loss of sharpness to the image. I have a 90mm refractor supplied with the same eyepieces. Barlows are a personal preference, I rarely use mine and I wouldn't rush to upgrade yours any time soon. I bought 6.4mm, 12.4mm and 32mm plossls second hand. To be honest I prefer lower mag on the moon as it I like the view of the whole thing, especially when it's such a nice sharp image at low magnification. Using very high mag on the moon can become a bit disorientating as the features become dimmer and harder to define with no other reference points in the field of view. That said it's still fun to refer to a moon map and go looking for things.

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I didn't particularly find the Moon dim at 270x on a 5.1" scope! In fact it was often too bright to observe for prolonged sessions. I find it a little more manageable on a 4" scope. On my 3.5" (90mm) though, anything between around 50x and 140x is good. I've even pushed that to 166.6x with good results. I was using some high end Plossls/orthoscopics though.

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Brilliant thread OP, and a ton of great info in the replies.  I have the same scope and have been wondering the same myself after viewing Jupiter through the 10mm EP tonight.  Seen some nice bands at 65x and I'm just wondering how great it would look at 130x or greater, and the best way to achieve that (Barlow or higher mag EP).

Really looking forward to viewing the moon too but again, I think I'll get more pleasure when I can ramp up the magnification a bit.

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I'd probably look at a good 2x Barlow and 6/7/8mm for lunar and planetary viewing if I had a 130p.

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With only a 650mm f/l I personally would look at a good 3x Barlow (preferably TeleVue) or even 5x. That way you would ensure quality high magnifications with even average quality eyepieces. I had some spectacular planetary (Jupiter especially) views with my 900mm f/l scope using fairly standard but decent Celestron eyepieces in a TeleVue 3x Barlow. The only downside was that the quite aggressive draw tube undercut on most of my (Guan Sheng Optical) Celestrons would make extraction difficult as the TV has a brass compression ring. As I upgraded my Plossls and other eyepieces I replaced the Celestrons with other TV's, smoothies, or tapered draw tubes.

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12 hours ago, BeerMe said:

Brilliant thread OP, and a ton of great info in the replies.  I have the same scope and have been wondering the same myself after viewing Jupiter through the 10mm EP tonight.  Seen some nice bands at 65x and I'm just wondering how great it would look at 130x or greater, and the best way to achieve that (Barlow or higher mag EP).

Really looking forward to viewing the moon too but again, I think I'll get more pleasure when I can ramp up the magnification a bit.

Just remember that it's the aperture and not the magnification that resolves detail, if you don't have the light gathering cpapbility to see the detail in the first instance, then no amount of maginification will reveal it. A good barlow will serve you well if you find you are using the one supplied a lot then have a look at a better one, but spend some time with the scope and what you have first. I was about to spend money on a new barlow, but found that when it came to lunar and planetary viewing I preferred to put an eyepiece in that gave the best views that seeing conditions would allow and then just try and chill out and actually observe, rather than frantically reaching for the barlow every 5 minutes to see if I could see any more detail. The same goes for filters. If you're aching to buy something (I know the feeling), look out for something like a 6.4mm Meade plossl on ebay. I got one for under £20 and is my go-to eyepiece for planets when seeing is ok, although a lot of the time it's not great and hence I am looking for something around 8mm which would give me just over 100x mag . The 6.4mm gives me around 140x mag and would give you just over 100x. As you 'ramp up' the magnification remember the image will dim and start to loose contrast and sharpness. Astronomy is a game of compromises, sometimes frustrating and always making you wonder if there's anything else you can do or buy to overcome them. But now and again when seeing is good it can all 'come together'.

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On 06/04/2016 at 14:31, Mak the Night said:

A 4mm sounds like you'd need a gnat's eyeball to use it.

I have one these (an Omni) and have actually grown to quite like it. I need to take my glasses off, and the first few times I used it I suffered from eye strain and headaches for a while afterwards. But I did eventually get used to it and have to say it gives a very clear, high-contrast image with little internal reflection. It's not my "go to" eyepiece for high mag observing but it gets more than occasional use. It's better on the planets than the moon, since it's hard to get close enough to see the whole of the field stop, which is no big deal for a planet in the centre of the FOV but is less pleasing when you're losing lunar features.

If I had my time again, though, I'd probably go for something like a Vixen lanthanum - a similar level perfomance, but a lot more comfortable.

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54 minutes ago, billyharris72 said:

I have one these (an Omni) and have actually grown to quite like it. I need to take my glasses off, and the first few times I used it I suffered from eye strain and headaches for a while afterwards. But I did eventually get used to it and have to say it gives a very clear, high-contrast image with little internal reflection. It's not my "go to" eyepiece for high mag observing but it gets more than occasional use. It's better on the planets than the moon, since it's hard to get close enough to see the whole of the field stop, which is no big deal for a planet in the centre of the FOV but is less pleasing when you're losing lunar features.

If I had my time again, though, I'd probably go for something like a Vixen lanthanum - a similar level perfomance, but a lot more comfortable.

Oh no, you make me want to get a 4mm Hutech now just to see what it's like lol.

http://www.firstlightoptics.com/clearance/hutech-orthoscopic-eyepiece.html

A 4mm would give me 250x on my 90mm Mak, which is about 70x above its resolving power!

That 6mm looks tempting though ....

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1 hour ago, Mak the Night said:

Oh no, you make me want to get a 4mm Hutech now just to see what it's like lol.

Funny you should say that as I have actually considered it! The 6mm is  a lovely eyepiece, and the narrower field of view helps with eye relief. Not so sure about a 6mm EP in an F14 scope though ... shame the 7mm is not in stock, or in the sale.

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51 minutes ago, billyharris72 said:

Funny you should say that as I have actually considered it! The 6mm is  a lovely eyepiece, and the narrower field of view helps with eye relief. Not so sure about a 6mm EP in an F14 scope though ... shame the 7mm is not in stock, or in the sale.

The 6mm AH is looking really good to me now. I noticed the 7mm wasn't in stock too. Those AH are superb EP's, I have several. They are actually the reason I got converted to orthoscopics in the first place! The 6mm would give me 166.6x on my 90mm f/11 Mak.

I'm going to have to buy the 6mm now you've recommended it. lol

http://www.sciencecenter.net/hutech/vis-acc/ep/index.htm

Edited by Mak the Night

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a BIG thanks for all the very helpful advice and opinions,  there is a lot to wade through,  I have been reading and re reading the replies and pricing up  all the various the eyepieces,    there is a few weeks till payday so will take my time and try and figure out what is best, .. most frustrating part is I still have not been able to use my scope :(  been nowt but raining and cloudy here past few nights..

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Please just make sure you don't start throwing big bucks at stuff before you get a chance to sit down (or stand up) and actually spend some decent time observing various things and getting used to your scope.

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