Attaining alignment accuracy with Lodestar X2 C

[Astrith]

Hello All.

Would you have any tips on attaining  image centre of Starlight Live . I am using a Syn scan AZ  go to . The mount is leveled off with a spirit level . Then go through the standard procedure of 2 star alignment . I initially use a 30mm eye piece then centre more ( accurately ) with a 6mm eye piece on both stars. Frustration sets in when the image is nowhere on the screen .  I then take the  Lodestar out and have a quick check with the 30 mm again and the image is in the FOV . However not centered . I realise this is the crux of the problem , hence then image is not centred on screen  . I had a little better luck tonight . I took the laptop out doors and tried 2 star alignment with the lodestar in place  after centering with the 6mm eye piece  .  But again images where on edge of screen.  I then attempt to use the hand controller direction keys to centre image . However image tends to whiz off the screen or sometimes I strike it lucky.  I know I have to go through a rite of passage  a  steep learning curve . But its sooooo frustrating.  So do any of you have any tips or tricks to make life easier....i am not asking for any trade secrets ,but anything to stop the frustration.

PS. Lat/Long current time and date are all set correctly on hand controller. Best regards. Alan. 

[Martin Meredith]

Hi

I also use SynScan in AZ mode, 2-star alignment etc. I always use StarlightLive to centre the image and never rely on eyepieces (I think I tried that once but it is just too painful to swap the eyepiece and camera). The answer to your first implicit question as to why the image is not centred or perhaps even on the screen may lie in using an accurately aligned finderscope to get the star in the right place to start with? For the other question of why it shoots off, have you tried reducing the slew rate? Once I have the object on the screen I reduce it to 2 for the final centering. I also zoom in on the cross hair using StarlightLive's zoom feature (just select a rectangle with the mouse) and align as accurately as I can with the slow controls.

Hope this helps!

Martin

 

[Martin Meredith]

Hi Alan

Just to add also that when you get the mount aligned and still find objects not where you expect them to be, you can use PAE (positional accuracy enhancement, I think it stands for) to update the mount's accuracy at any point. Once you have the DSO on screen, press and hold ESC for 2 seconds (or go via the UTILITY/PAE submenu); the console will ask you to centre the object; do that, ending with the right and up together (to prevent backlash) and press enter.

I take a different approach most nights. I do a quick initial alignment, and then find that most DSOs are nowhere near centred, and sometimes (many times) not on the screen. But no matter, because I really enjoy field-identification problems and use the mount to start-hop to my destination. Occasionally I spot something more interesting in the vicinity -- an interesting multiple star, a faint galaxy cluster, who knows…. I often spend all night in a smallish part of the sky anyway so it doesn't really matter too much. If I were going for a Messier marathon it would be a different story.

Anyway, I hope you get up and running and enjoying SL/Lodestar soon.

Martin

[Astrith]

1 hour ago, Martin Meredith said:

Hi Alan

Just to add also that when you get the mount aligned and still find objects not where you expect them to be, you can use PAE (positional accuracy enhancement, I think it stands for) to update the mount's accuracy at any point. Once you have the DSO on screen, press and hold ESC for 2 seconds (or go via the UTILITY/PAE submenu); the console will ask you to centre the object; do that, ending with the right and up together (to prevent backlash) and press enter.

I take a different approach most nights. I do a quick initial alignment, and then find that most DSOs are nowhere near centred, and sometimes (many times) not on the screen. But no matter, because I really enjoy field-identification problems and use the mount to start-hop to my destination. Occasionally I spot something more interesting in the vicinity -- an interesting multiple star, a faint galaxy cluster, who knows…. I often spend all night in a smallish part of the sky anyway so it doesn't really matter too much. If I were going for a Messier marathon it would be a different story.

Anyway, I hope you get up and running and enjoying SL/Lodestar soon.

Martin

Thanks for prompt reply Martin.   Very good tips . Will apply next time I set up. Thats interesting....right and up together .  Again many thanks.

[HiloDon]

Hi Alan,

What focal length do you have?  If it's over 1000mm, the FOV with a LS will be very narrow, and would be more difficult to get a star on the screen.  I do the same as Martin and get the finder accurately aligned with the scope and don't even use an eyepiece.  You can get a precise alignment between the finder and scope in daylight by viewing a distant terrestrial object.   

Also so as Martin indicated, once you get the star on the screen, reduce the slew speed to get it to the center of the crosshairs.

Don

[Astrith]

4 hours ago, HiloDon said:

Hi Alan,

What focal length do you have?  If it's over 1000mm, the FOV with a LS will be very narrow, and would be more difficult to get a star on the screen.  I do the same as Martin and get the finder accurately aligned with the scope and don't even use an eyepiece.  You can get a precise alignment between the finder and scope in daylight by viewing a distant terrestrial object.   

Also so as Martin indicated, once you get the star on the screen, reduce the slew speed to get it to the center of the crosshairs.

Don

Hello Don

Scope has a focal length of 750 mm , a Star Discovery 150 p.  I do get the star on the screen . However not centered . This with the above tips , will help greatly . ( fingers crossed ).  I do a rough alignment on roof ariels 200 metre distance tops.  My viewing site has limited horizons . I also need to slow down a little ...my enthusiasm in getting good to go .  I am Just trying  to get to a level that yourself and a lot of members are on this site . However still learning and enjoying the ride !!

Many thanks for the reply Don.

[RobertI]

Just to add to all this good advice, for me the accurate alignment of finder and lodestar is critical to reducing the pain of setting up at the start of a session. On my C8 I have a second finder (the original 6x30) as a back up to the main 10x50 finder just in case I knock the main finder out of alignment. Probably overkill but I have wasted valuable observing time with misaligned finders and don't care to repeat it!

Rob

[stash_old]

15 hours ago, Martin Meredith said:

Hi Alan

Just to add also that when you get the mount aligned and still find objects not where you expect them to be, you can use PAE (positional accuracy enhancement, I think it stands for) to update the mount's accuracy at any point. Once you have the DSO on screen, press and hold ESC for 2 seconds (or go via the UTILITY/PAE submenu); the console will ask you to centre the object; do that, ending with the right and up together (to prevent backlash) and press enter.

I take a different approach most nights. I do a quick initial alignment, and then find that most DSOs are nowhere near centred, and sometimes (many times) not on the screen. But no matter, because I really enjoy field-identification problems and use the mount to start-hop to my destination. Occasionally I spot something more interesting in the vicinity -- an interesting multiple star, a faint galaxy cluster, who knows…. I often spend all night in a smallish part of the sky anyway so it doesn't really matter too much. If I were going for a Messier marathon it would be a different story.

Anyway, I hope you get up and running and enjoying SL/Lodestar soon.

Martin

Just to add I have found that on some handsets(s/w versions 3.35,3.36) you have to press esc then press esc again for 2 secs to get the system to ask to recentre the object.

[aparker]

16 hours ago, Astrith said:

Hello All.

Would you have any tips on attaining  image centre of Starlight Live . I am using a Syn scan AZ  go to . The mount is leveled off with a spirit level . Then go through the standard procedure of 2 star alignment . I initially use a 30mm eye piece then centre more ( accurately ) with a 6mm eye piece on both stars. Frustration sets in when the image is nowhere on the screen .  I then take the  Lodestar out and have a quick check with the 30 mm again and the image is in the FOV . However not centered . I realise this is the crux of the problem , hence then image is not centred on screen  . I had a little better luck tonight . I took the laptop out doors and tried 2 star alignment with the lodestar in place  after centering with the 6mm eye piece  .  But again images where on edge of screen.  I then attempt to use the hand controller direction keys to centre image . However image tends to whiz off the screen or sometimes I strike it lucky.  I know I have to go through a rite of passage  a  steep learning curve . But its sooooo frustrating.  So do any of you have any tips or tricks to make life easier....i am not asking for any trade secrets ,but anything to stop the frustration.

PS. Lat/Long current time and date are all set correctly on hand controller. Best regards. Alan. 

Hi there,

I don't have any experience with your particular brand of mount.  However, I've struggled through and pretty much solved this with my Celestron EQ mount.  The main steps I took were 1) set up a permanent pier in the backyard so polar alignment is reproducible (not relevant for your Alt-AZ mount), 2) get a 50mm short FL finder/guider scope and equip it with a cheap Orion guide cam (no need to waste a Lodestar on e-finder duties), 3) download free PhD Guiding and set it up to connect to the Orion cam, 4) as others have noted, CAREFULLY get the finder and main telescope pointed perfectly coaxially (this was painful but only needs done once unless you bump something).  Now when I go to observe, I fire up PhD, put a crosshair on the window, and connect it to the Orion, which has a huge ~4 degree FOV through the finder, then start SLL with the Lodestar and set it to frame/focus mode.  I run through the 2-star alignment, doing coarse align with the PhD window and final alignment with the SLL window.  It's quick because both have a crosshair for exact centering, and it pays to be EXACT on the final align in the SLL window.  I'll do 2-star plus usually three additional "Calibration" stars (a nice feature the Celestron system permits) with the last one being right near where I want to start observing.  Typically this will get me to where DSOs will show up close to dead center in the fairly small FOV of the Lodestar (main scope is ~1250mm FL).

Hope this is useful

 

[Astrith]

1 hour ago, aparker said:

Hi there,

I don't have any experience with your particular brand of mount.  However, I've struggled through and pretty much solved this with my Celestron EQ mount.  The main steps I took were 1) set up a permanent pier in the backyard so polar alignment is reproducible (not relevant for your Alt-AZ mount), 2) get a 50mm short FL finder/guider scope and equip it with a cheap Orion guide cam (no need to waste a Lodestar on e-finder duties), 3) download free PhD Guiding and set it up to connect to the Orion cam, 4) as others have noted, CAREFULLY get the finder and main telescope pointed perfectly coaxially (this was painful but only needs done once unless you bump something).  Now when I go to observe, I fire up PhD, put a crosshair on the window, and connect it to the Orion, which has a huge ~4 degree FOV through the finder, then start SLL with the Lodestar and set it to frame/focus mode.  I run through the 2-star alignment, doing coarse align with the PhD window and final alignment with the SLL window.  It's quick because both have a crosshair for exact centering, and it pays to be EXACT on the final align in the SLL window.  I'll do 2-star plus usually three additional "Calibration" stars (a nice feature the Celestron system permits) with the last one being right near where I want to start observing.  Typically this will get me to where DSOs will show up close to dead center in the fairly small FOV of the Lodestar (main scope is ~1250mm FL).

Hope this is useful

 

Thanks for your reply aparker . Much appreciated.

[Astrith]

2 hours ago, RobertI said:

Just to add to all this good advice, for me the accurate alignment of finder and lodestar is critical to reducing the pain of setting up at the start of a session. On my C8 I have a second finder (the original 6x30) as a back up to the main 10x50 finder just in case I knock the main finder out of alignment. Probably overkill but I have wasted valuable observing time with misaligned finders and don't care to repeat it!

Rob

Hello Rob

This is what is driving me . I want to get set up, so I am good to go. Lesson learnt is spend time on correct alignment procedures. Many thanks. Alan.

[jam1e1]

couple of pointers from experience:

- ive aligned using illuminated reticule to get best accuracy, its around ~8mm

- the alignment stars need to be a certain angular distance apart e.g. altair-mirfak, vega mirach, deneb-hamal,navi-albireo to give an idea (see manual for guidance)

- ensure scope level and i turn on mount at AZ pointing towards polaris, Alt 0 deg (i.e. horizontal) - im not sure if this is necessary but i do this to keep as many factors consistent. to get polaris accurate i unlock, manually slew then lock AZ, then level off to 0 deg and lock Alt

- when slewing for aligning, just rotate round one way e.g clockwise

- use latest firmware for handset and motor controllers

hope this helps!

Jamie

-   

[stash_old]

Warning dont use V3.37 on your handset if you gave a AZ Goto Synscan it has a bug that affects SW AZ SynScan goto - "No response from motors ra/dec" or something like that - lots of threads plus one retailer had warning .