How to polar align the avx mount quickly?

[jason32]

Hey guys,

Last night I tried my new setup avx + 130pds, but it took me 2 hrs to align the scope and I think that too with luck.

So is this the correct way to do it?

1. Point the mount to north, get both ra and Dec to the start position.

2. Look through the finder scope and get as close to Polaris as possible.

3. Do the 2 star alignment and add 1 calibration star

4. All star polar alignment

When I tried the 2 star alignment the first star it showed me was vega but when the mount slewed to it, it was just way way off but anyway in entered it and then moved to the next star and it was again way too far away from the finder scope anyway after I did all the above and pointed it to Polaris and the star wasn't even in the finder scope, so I started all over again and it took me 6-7 tries before I got good enough alignment to take some photos.

Am I doing something wrong here? Any other quicker way to do this? Any tips?

Help please.

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[Steve Ward]

http://www.celestron-nexstar.de/advanced_VX-Manual-F.pdf

[jason32]

Haha I read that and tried to follow but still struggled [emoji15]

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[PeterCPC]

First, make sure that you are using the latest firmware - you can download from the Celestron site. Make sure that your time and location data has been input correctly.

Set up to point North as you say but don't try to align the finderscope with Polaris. Point 3 above - correct. Point 4. - correct.

I do this and can be Polar Aligned in about 30 mins or so.

Peter

[jason32]

First, make sure that you are using the latest firmware - you can download from the Celestron site. Make sure that your time and location data has been input correctly.

Set up to point North as you say but don't try to align the finderscope with Polaris. Point 3 above - correct. Point 4. - correct.

I do this and can be Polar Aligned in about 30 mins or so.

Peter

I haven't checked the firmware but have done all the other things. Location is correct I got it from Google and gps.

Should I buy a polar scope? Would hat speed things up?

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[Sanity3d]

Hi, get the star sense and pole master and u will be polar aligned and goto aligned within 10 mins max.i could never get a good polar alignment using the all star polar align in the hand set no matter how many times i tried even with the latest firmware.

Got my pole master last week one of the 199$ pre sales and had the first clear night since September two days after it arrived (unbeleiveable but true).

So set up just to try it out and within 5mins was polar aligned then did a auto align with the star sense and was ready to go after 3 mins,plugged in the ipad and aligned sky safari booted up the laptop ready, ok the laptop booted up as star sense was doing its thing do'nt think you can get any quicker than that.

As i only wanted to test test pole master i rushed my balancing and could only get about 120 s but here is a single shot with my nikon 7000d using byn on a avx and skywatcher 130 pds with skywatcher Coma correcter.

Toni

[ecuador]

Have you tried the iOS app Polar Scope Align? It should allow you to do a very quick polar alignment (especially from the second time, after you have stored your reticle zero position, it should be a minute or two), with a precision that varies with the reticle. If you have the old-style reticle with the constellations and the polaris reticle, it could get you to within 3-4 arcmins, but if you have the new style reticle (and it is centered) you should get to within a couple of arcmins. The procedure is different for each reticle, so read the help after selecting the one you have.

[PeterCPC]

I haven't checked the firmware but have done all the other things. Location is correct I got it from Google and gps.

Should I buy a polar scope? Would hat speed things up?

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I don't use a Polar scope. I find that ASPA is very easy to use. Last night I aligned and Polar Aligned in 20 mins. It's just a case of following the instructions. Do check the firmware - the latest release has definitely improved the GOTO.

Peter

[jason32]

Hi, get the star sense and pole master and u will be polar aligned and goto aligned within 10 mins max.i could never get a good polar alignment using the all star polar align in the hand set no matter how many times i tried even with the latest firmware.

Got my pole master last week one of the 199$ pre sales and had the first clear night since September two days after it arrived (unbeleiveable but true).

So set up just to try it out and within 5mins was polar aligned then did a auto align with the star sense and was ready to go after 3 mins,plugged in the ipad and aligned sky safari booted up the laptop ready, ok the laptop booted up as star sense was doing its thing do'nt think you can get any quicker than that.

As i only wanted to test test pole master i rushed my balancing and could only get about 120 s but here is a single shot with my nikon 7000d using byn on a avx and skywatcher 130 pds with skywatcher Coma correcter.

image.jpg

Toni

Wow seems like this polemaster thing is really cool will check that out and will also update the firmware [emoji14]

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[jason32]

Have you tried the iOS app Polar Scope Align? It should allow you to do a very quick polar alignment (especially from the second time, after you have stored your reticle zero position, it should be a minute or two), with a precision that varies with the reticle. If you have the old-style reticle with the constellations and the polaris reticle, it could get you to within 3-4 arcmins, but if you have the new style reticle (and it is centered) you should get to within a couple of arcmins. The procedure is different for each reticle, so read the help after selecting the one you have.

Ok great thanks I've downloaded the app but it needs the polar scope so will buy one. What is reticle? Sorry for asking a silly question [emoji15]

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[jason32]

I don't use a Polar scope. I find that ASPA is very easy to use. Last night I aligned and Polar Aligned in 20 mins. It's just a case of following the instructions. Do check the firmware - the latest release has definitely improved the GOTO.

Peter

I'll check the firmware and update if required thanks

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[ngwillym]

When it is 'way off' - how far off -  15 degrees or thereabouts or more -  half way across the sky? Usually this is because some of the starting parameters haven't been set up correctly. Are you sure that you are entering lat/long (longitude especially - as west rather than east?), date (month/day/year) and time  in correct format - and that Daylight Saving time is off?

[ecuador]

Ok great thanks I've downloaded the app but it needs the polar scope so will buy one. What is reticle? Sorry for asking a silly question [emoji15]

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Ah, I keep forgetting the AVX does not come with a polar scope standard.

Not a silly question, reticle is the engraving/pattern on the sight of the polar scope. If you look at the list of reticles in the app you downloaded it shows a "Classic" for Celestron and a "New" one. If you buy a polar scope now, make sure it is of the new stock which is much more precise (look through it and compare).

You can do without a polar scope, but having one sure speeds things up. 

[jason32]

Ah, I keep forgetting the AVX does not come with a polar scope standard.

Not a silly question, reticle is the engraving/pattern on the sight of the polar scope. If you look at the list of reticles in the app you downloaded it shows a "Classic" for Celestron and a "New" one. If you buy a polar scope now, make sure it is of the new stock which is much more precise (look through it and compare).

You can do without a polar scope, but having one sure speeds things up.

Ok thanks ... Will look for the new design

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[jason32]

When it is 'way off' - how far off - 15 degrees or thereabouts or more - half way across the sky? Usually this is because some of the starting parameters haven't been set up correctly. Are you sure that you are entering lat/long (longitude especially - as west rather than east?), date (month/day/year) and time in correct format - and that Daylight Saving time is off?

By way off I mean I could tell the telescope was not pointing correctly by looking at the star and where the scope was pointing (by standing 3 feet away) ...that happens for the first star it goes to for aligning.

Yes I m entering the correct data. It took me 2 hrs to make it work [emoji15]

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[jason32]

Ah, I keep forgetting the AVX does not come with a polar scope standard.

Not a silly question, reticle is the engraving/pattern on the sight of the polar scope. If you look at the list of reticles in the app you downloaded it shows a "Classic" for Celestron and a "New" one. If you buy a polar scope now, make sure it is of the new stock which is much more precise (look through it and compare).

You can do without a polar scope, but having one sure speeds things up. 

Last night the sky was clear so I took my telescope out and pointed it roughly to polaris, the app showed where to point it in case I had a polar scope but I used my finder scope and eyepiece to point it roughly where the app was telling me to...and wow...that worked great, it took me a total of 20 mins to get it aligned (aspa) with 0 errors...that app helped alot. I think I'll keep using this method

[PeterCPC]

If you got 0 errors I would suggest that is not correct. If you asked for the error straight after doing an ASPA it will always show 0 errors and is meaningless. You have to update the Star Alignment, after the ASPA, as per the manual before you check alignment and get the correct errors.

Peter

[jason32]

If you got 0 errors I would suggest that is not correct. If you asked for the error straight after doing an ASPA it will always show 0 errors and is meaningless. You have to update the Star Alignment, after the ASPA, as per the manual before you check alignment and get the correct errors.

Peter

What do you mean update star alignment? how to do that?

[Steve Ward]

Are you adjusting the alignment using the mount adjusters or just recentering the star with the handset each time. 

You CANNOT adjust polar-alignment using the handset controls , they do not move the mount relative to the "north celestial pole" , just the telescope.

[ecuador]

Last night the sky was clear so I took my telescope out and pointed it roughly to polaris, the app showed where to point it in case I had a polar scope but I used my finder scope and eyepiece to point it roughly where the app was telling me to...and wow...that worked great, it took me a total of 20 mins to get it aligned (aspa) with 0 errors...that app helped alot. I think I'll keep using this method

Eh, it can't have helped this way. If you have a polar scope it helps you polar align in 1-2 minutes (you use the mount altitude-azimuth screws to point the RA axis), but I don't see how it can be useful without a polar scope.

[jason32]

I pointed the scope roughly to polaris then I used the Polar scope align app, it showed me where to point the scope if you have a polar scope. Then what I did was just used my finder scope and positioned it roughly where the app told me to using the screws on the mount not the buttons. That helped me when I started the 2 star alignment, the first star it went to was very close to the center, then the second start was again close but obviously not perfect, then I did 2 calibration stars by that time both the stars were pretty close to center, then I started ASPA and adjusted the mount with the screws again. Then after finishing that I used the goto and pointed it towards some stars and everytime it was dead center...then I placed my camera on and started taking some photos. Without guiding I was able to get up to 70-80 seconds expsoures.

yes a polar scope would make this process even quicker and I might it soon.

[PeterCPC]

What do you mean update star alignment? how to do that?

You are not following the instructions in the manual. Have you read the manual? If you follow the instructions to the letter you will get a good PA using ASPA without the need for a Polar Scope.

I have produced a checklist which I use to set up and this is it:

Initial Alignment

1. Level, point North, set to Home position.
2. 2 star align with calibration steps

Polar Alignment

1. Slew to bright star high and near meridian.(not overhead)
2. Press Align – Polar Align – Align Mount.
3. Scope will slew away and back.
4. Centre star in finder – Enter – centre star in EP. Scope will sync.
5. Enter – Use Lat and AZ bolts to centre star – Enter

Updating Star Alignment

1. Press Align – Undo sync – Enter
2. Slew to one of the original alignment stars.
3. Press Align – alignment stars – select star.
4. Centre star – Enter- Align.
5. Repeat for other Alignment star.
6. Slew to bright star on opposite side of Meridian.
7. Press Align – Calib stars – Enter.
8. Centre star – Enter – Align.
9. Press Back – Align – Polar Align – Display Align. (this will show your actual PA error)

This is exactly what the manual says but reduced down. I do this and will be ready to image in about 30 mins. With this method I can get 4 mins unguided.

You are trying to align your telescope rather than the mount. It's the mount that needs to be aligned.

Peter

[jason32]

You are not following the instructions in the manual. Have you read the manual? If you follow the instructions to the letter you will get a good PA using ASPA without the need for a Polar Scope.

I have produced a checklist which I use to set up and this is it:

Initial Alignment

1. Level, point North, set to Home position.
2. 2 star align with calibration steps

Polar Alignment

1. Slew to bright star high and near meridian.(not overhead)
2. Press Align – Polar Align – Align Mount.
3. Scope will slew away and back.
4. Centre star in finder – Enter – centre star in EP. Scope will sync.
5. Enter – Use Lat and AZ bolts to centre star – Enter

Updating Star Alignment

1. Press Align – Undo sync – Enter
2. Slew to one of the original alignment stars.
3. Press Align – alignment stars – select star.
4. Centre star – Enter- Align.
5. Repeat for other Alignment star.
6. Slew to bright star on opposite side of Meridian.
7. Press Align – Calib stars – Enter.
8. Centre star – Enter – Align.
9. Press Back – Align – Polar Align – Display Align. (this will show your actual PA error)

This is exactly what the manual says but reduced down. I do this and will be ready to image in about 30 mins. With this method I can get 4 mins unguided.

You are trying to align your telescope rather than the mount. It's the mount that needs to be aligned.

Peter

Ok so basically you are saying once I do the aspa then do the 2 star alignment again with 2 calibration stars right?

Ok thanks for clearification, I'll do this next time

[PeterCPC]

Ok so basically you are saying once I do the aspa then do the 2 star alignment again with 2 calibration stars right?

Ok thanks for clearification, I'll do this next time

Once you do the ASPA you slew to your first alignment star and then do 3 and 4 above then repeat for the second star that you used for the original alignment. Then go from 6. Once done you can do Display Align and get your error. I only have to do this once but it depends how accurate you are in centering the stars in the EP. I use an illuminated reticule 12mm EP. Also, don't reposition your EP once you start the process as this may introduce an error. Good luck!

Peter

[Nuka]

On 14/01/2016 at 07:58, PeterCPC said:

You are not following the instructions in the manual. Have you read the manual? If you follow the instructions to the letter you will get a good PA using ASPA without the need for a Polar Scope.

I have produced a checklist which I use to set up and this is it:

Initial Alignment

1. Level, point North, set to Home position.
2. 2 star align with calibration steps

Polar Alignment

1. Slew to bright star high and near meridian.(not overhead)
2. Press Align – Polar Align – Align Mount.
3. Scope will slew away and back.
4. Centre star in finder – Enter – centre star in EP. Scope will sync.
5. Enter – Use Lat and AZ bolts to centre star – Enter

Updating Star Alignment

1. Press Align – Undo sync – Enter
2. Slew to one of the original alignment stars.
3. Press Align – alignment stars – select star.
4. Centre star – Enter- Align.
5. Repeat for other Alignment star.
6. Slew to bright star on opposite side of Meridian.
7. Press Align – Calib stars – Enter.
8. Centre star – Enter – Align.
9. Press Back – Align – Polar Align – Display Align. (this will show your actual PA error)

This is exactly what the manual says but reduced down. I do this and will be ready to image in about 30 mins. With this method I can get 4 mins unguided.

You are trying to align your telescope rather than the mount. It's the mount that needs to be aligned.

Peter

This is Spot on Peter!

I was struggling to get anymore than about 30 secs @ 585mm (130PDS) but after reading the manual carefully and doing the ASPA twice, I'm now hitting 60secs ish. Significant improvement

Still not sure how to use the "Display Align" I may be reading it at incorrect times, but the error seems bigger now the mount is more accurately aligned lol? Must be something i'm not doing right.