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Revisiting the Flame, Flaming Star, Rosette etc

jetstream

By jetstream
in Observing - Deep Sky

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jetstream

jetstream

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The forecast looked excellent last night so off I go...took a coffee break first and started to dark adapt. The more my eyes adjusted the greyer the sky got :shocked: What the heck I'll try anyway... a few show case objects, Veil, NA neb etc revealed something was amiss. The view was really good actually, just not excellent.

Always near the "jetstream" I'm used to changing skies- but why did my North East sky wash out worse than the rest? Off to the dock for a better look... ah yes! the aurora was giving just enough light to mess up my DSO work.

So... out with the camera...

After the aurora died down, back to the VX10- what a change!! :grin:

M42 was fabulous, huge, 3 shades of green and with many sharp edges. I then snuck up to Alnitak, approaching this foe carefully... BAM! the Flame was bright, no filter- a quick eyepiece change was then carefully executed... the sharp, faint line of the HH home was easily visible, and there was the notch, in all its underwhelming glory :smiley: Last years obs of it has helped the object recognition, making it perhaps easier than before...

The UHC went through some more trials, revealing large nebulosity everywhere it was pointed, the Monkey Head, the Flaming Star (very large), Pacman and its dust lanes, the NA neb with its second gulf and nearby "hole", the large tracks of IC1318, the Lobster Claw.......

and finally the Rosette... a favorite of mine, this thing keeps getting bigger the more finesse that is applied (equipment wise, dark adaptation). The thing is too big for the 21E, but it still shows well, out came the 30ES 82.... the view was superb.

So thats my story of last night.... :grin:

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YKSE

YKSE

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That's a great night :smiley:  I would be extremely satisfied if I can get a clear night with half of your activities....

Any magic eyepiece(s) for HH?

Seems to me that the extra brightness of 30mm is of advantages for Rosette.

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John

John

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Amazing report Gerry :smiley:

I've still to see more than the vaguest traces of the Flame so no suprises that the HH has eluded my 12" as well, despite my Lumicon HB filter :rolleyes2:

It's great to read reports like this though, to act as an incentive :grin:

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jetstream

jetstream

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That's a great night :smiley:  I would be extremely satisfied if I can get a clear night with half of your activities....

Any magic eyepiece(s) for HH?

Seems to me that the extra brightness of 30mm is of advantages for Rosette.

Magic... one thing that is hugely important is true dark adaptation, I'm still working on this, thanks for the link Yong (Vogel). The 25TV plossl works as does my 25-6.8 zoom, the zoom showed just how fussy my set up is. Zooming in more than just a squeak and the whole thing disappears... I didn't check mag as I didn't want to wreck my eyes... The narrow TFOV of this zoom is a big asset..... My Astronomik filter works well.

The Flame is easily visible in my 17E, 18ES no filter even with Alnitak in the centre of view, thats my sky test for this.

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jetstream

jetstream

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Between the new (old house), the new scope and my fledgling photography hobby- I'm broke :sad: but happy :grin: But like I told a couple of others, once the place is fixed up wander by! Do you ever make it to the States Steve? Much easier to get into this area that way.

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bomberbaz

bomberbaz

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Never been to the states I am afraid Gerry, nearest i have ever been is the Dom republic. One day who knows but if I do, I shall be sure to try and factor a visit to yours into my plans  :cool:

Oh with the Nikon assuming you don't already have one by then  :laugh:

Steve

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pipnina

pipnina

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That's a great night :smiley:  I would be extremely satisfied if I can get a clear night with half of your activities....

Any magic eyepiece(s) for HH?

Seems to me that the extra brightness of 30mm is of advantages for Rosette.

From my experiance so far... 3.5 exit pupil has shown the most of any other exit pupil i've used.

For example: in my scope with 3.5mm exit pupil, M42 stood out like a sore thumb and showed nebulosity at least half way down, in my bins (5mm) the top arc was easy, lower than that was dificult, in my finder (6mm+) almost completely washed out and the sky looked bright grey (new white-light LEDs).

Similar experiance with other objects. But I guess it depends on your sky quality. Mine isn't the best bur certainly not the worst (mag 3.5 i'd guess at the location of those observations)

Really, trying multiple size exit pupils and seeing which one gets you furthest under your skies is the best option.

But anyway. It sounds like you had a very good session, Jetstream, I could only dream of skies as dark as that. Now you need to try barnard's loop ;)

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YKSE

YKSE

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From my experiance so far... 3.5 exit pupil has shown the most of any other exit pupil i've used.

I hope that you can make a couple of trips to a dark site, and take a look at these large nebulas again, you may draw other conclusions. :smiley:

Gerry can surely share his experience with us about Rosette nebula (1.3°), how it looks like through 21Ethos (1.75°AFOV) and 30ES (2.05°AFOV), both should frame the nebula well, main difference is the brightness (exit pupil 4.4mm in 21E, 6.3mm in 30ES).

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jetstream

jetstream

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I've noticed that these nebula can "grow" in the eyepiece, under dark skies.... the UHC grows some nebula substantially, the Rosette included. I'm not so sure that the quoted size of some nebs is accurate, at least as far as visual goes. The North American is another one...

Some of these nebs respond to large exit pupils and large TFOV, the Rosette is an example of one, the larger exit pupil will help bring out extended or underlying faint nebulosity that is not seen at lower exits.

Now some are going to say just use the lower FL scope to increase the FOV and enjoy the view... my fracs don't give the same faint detail as the VX10...

Both the 21E and the 30ES should frame the Rosette with the UHC, both don't.... the larger exit pupil of 6.3mm is, I believe the main difference in image brightness as Yong correctly (IMHO) states. What works best is object dependent, but from my experience something in the 5mm exit pupil range with an OIII is in the ball park, the UHC can go lower, but not all the time and the Hb is fussy, mine wants at least 5mm exit.

Pipnina, I would keep trying different mags, from numerous skies and see if anything works better, or the same... you may will be surprised. Keep up the good work.

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Stu

Stu

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Great stuff Gerry, any idea what the sky brightness was? Must have been pretty spectacular and with excellent transparency too.

I think Pip's comments reflect the different skies we operate under. More LP and the tighter exit pupil helps to darken the background, but under truly dark skies you can really open things up.

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John

John

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I've noticed that nebulae and galaxies can "grow" the longer you observe them. Just like planetary observing, I believe your eye gradually adjusts and starts to tease out more subtle details as time goes by.

I also feel that frequent observation of objects brings a familiarity which helps get the best from them the next time you view them. I worry slightly when folks seem to tick something off their list as "done". It's always worth several return visits to objects - they can be a little "shy" at first acquaintance :smiley:

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jetstream

jetstream

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Hi Stu, the sky was 21.5 mag and transparent, not as good as in the winter, still really good though. Yes, I also use a 3.5mm exit under lighter skies, but even then some objects like different stuff, espc with an OIII (IMHO). That dark Lumicon OIII works great from lighter skies...

John, you are absolutely right, frequent observing keeps bringing out more detail, more of everything actually.Great comment.

I'm thinking that individuals brains may be better suited for different objects... in my case I seem to do better on nebulae than galaxies :embarrassed: then there's Mark who can pull out the faintest, threshold galaxies every time!

I'm hoping Pip takes my comments as encouragement :smiley: and keeps trying everything he has to match his skies.

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Stu

Stu

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I've noticed that nebulae and galaxies can "grow" the longer you observe them. Just like planetary observing, I believe your eye gradually adjusts and starts to tease out more subtle details as time goes by.

I also feel that frequent observation of objects brings a familiarity which helps get the best from them the next time you view them. I worry slightly when folks seem to tick something off their list as "done". It's always worth several return visits to objects - they can be a little "shy" at first acquaintance :smiley:

What is this frequent observing you speak of? [emoji6][emoji6]

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pipnina

pipnina

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Hi Stu, the sky was 21.5 mag and transparent, not as good as in the winter, still really good though. Yes, I also use a 3.5mm exit under lighter skies, but even then some objects like different stuff, espc with an OIII (IMHO). That dark Lumicon OIII works great from lighter skies...

John, you are absolutely right, frequent observing keeps bringing out more detail, more of everything actually.Great comment.

I'm thinking that individuals brains may be better suited for different objects... in my case I seem to do better on nebulae than galaxies :embarrassed: then there's Mark who can pull out the faintest, threshold galaxies every time!

I'm hoping Pip takes my comments as encouragement :smiley: and keeps trying everything he has to match his skies.

Oh, I have a list of things I'm going to try, and anything that goes on the list doesn't come off of the list until i've either seen it or determined it impossible under my skies.

If I end up seeing it, it goes on a different list of things to look at again  :tongue: 

What is this frequent observing you speak of? [emoji6][emoji6]

11 days since last clear sky. And the forecast is cloud cloud cloud cloud and more cloud.

Average month in Britain, really.

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