Jump to content

Stargazers Lounge Uses Cookies

Like most websites, SGL uses cookies in order to deliver a secure, personalised service, to provide social media functions and to analyse our traffic. Continued use of SGL indicates your acceptance of our cookie policy.

sgl_imaging_challenge_banner_lunar_landings.thumb.jpg.b50378d0845690d8a03305a49923eb40.jpg

Mak the Night

Sky-Watcher Ultrawide Eyepiece Series?

Recommended Posts

Overhyped advertising blurb though :rolleyes2:

The WO UWAN's are really good eyepieces but the SWAN's are quite run of the mill but with a nice glossy exterior.

http://www.firstlightoptics.com/william-optics-eyepieces/william-optics-uwan-eyepiece.html

The UWAN's do look nice. Unfortunately, the 4 and 7mm are too short a f/l to be of any use to me. The 16mm looks very capable, but at 200g is about the same as my Nagler T5 (201g) which gives 400g (0.9lb approx) with a pair. I could buy a second Nagler for less than the cost of two 16mm UWAN's. 

Which raises some interesting questions. Both the Nagler and UWAN's have 82° AFOV's but I'm not sure whether I will be able to get more than 66° with the limits of the WO bino prisms. I think when I get a bigger SCT, I may eventually, and at a later date, buy a TV bino and a second Nagler T5 for it. I plan to acquire a 9.25" Celestron NexStar Evolution in late February/early March next year. I've decided to get the bigger scope then as 'a' it's near my birthday lol and 'b' it will be four months from now.

Four months ago I could hardly move my right leg, arm and hand because of paralysis induced by a stroke/brain bleed due to high blood pressure. I'm comparatively young to have a stroke and I was very fit beforehand, didn't smoke and only drank socially. It took me four months in hospital to learn to speak and walk again. In May this year I decided to buy a 102mm Mak as I thought the 127mm Mak would be as difficult to manipulate as my 130mm Newtonian. Since I bought the 4" Mak I've made enormous progress with my physiotherapy and feel confident I could assemble and operate the NexStar 9.25" now, but I'd like to give it at least another four months of physio first to further develop range, strength and dexterity in my arm and fingers.

As a consequence, any equipment I buy now I want to potentially use on both the Mak and the NexStar, so I calculate things like eyepiece magnification for both OTA focal lengths. The 19mm Panoptic pair I have should easily give me the magnification range (with or without nosepiece Barlows) with a 235mm f/l OTA. The extra weight of the Pan's in a bino used on a telescope with an alt-az GOTO shouldn't be a problem with the limited use I have in my right arm and hand either. However, I imagine this is a different experience to using my small Mak on an EQ 2 mount. I definitely notice the extra weight of a single 3/4lb Celestron Luminos for instance. The Nagler on top of a Powermate is fairly manageable and is under 500g (combined) I believe. So I'm a tad apprehensive about how a bino complete with EP's will be to manipulate considering I will have to predominantly utilise my left (non-dominant hand/arm) to control the OTA and mount. 

I also plan to acquire a much simpler grab'n'go mount for the little Mak in the future so it will still see some use even after I get the NexStar. So, choosing eyepieces has become unexpectedly complex ROTFLMAO.

If I buy a second TV 11mm Plossl I can get close to the magnifications I want, but with limited FOV and eye relief. The UWAN's, beautiful as they look, don't seem a viable solution primarily due to weight considerations and it would be cheaper just to purchase another Nagler. The SWAN's may be lame ducks as WO are possibly exaggerating their actual abilities and specifications. The Sky-Watcher 9mm is possibly the best of the series but has its limitations and the TS Optics equivalent isn't that far off the SWAN 9mm in price. 

Hmmm ... must think .... 

Edited by Mak the Night

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

There are / were some bargains in the classified here; TV plossls included, maybe if you could pick up an 15mm TV Plossl?

I don't recall noticing how much wider the field of view was at the eyepiece. You could of course get another Panoptic and have really great binoviewers!  :grin:

In case you cannot see the classified yet, Moonshane has a 15 and 11 TV plossl at £48 not the wide field of view, but you'd not lose much on resale at that price?

I may get another 15mm TV Plossl when I get a bigger SCT, I already have two 19mm Panoptics, but I am concerned about the combined weight on a small Mak. The 9mm SWAN's look OK to me at the moment as a light alternative with the f/l I need. At 59 quid apiece they can't be that bad, admittedly, I'm not expecting Panoptics but I should have thought they would be usable. 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Mak, good luck , and so pleased to read you are making a good recovery too  :grin:

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Mak, good luck , and so pleased to read you are making a good recovery too  :grin:

Thanks, my doctors are now convinced astronomy is good therapy lol. 

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Mark,

My approach is using GPC/barlow to get high mag I want to use, after reading Glenn's comments here.

I was planning on using the WO 1.6x Barlow nosepiece anyway.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'm not too sure what design the SWAN are though, it might be a modified Erfle.

WO%209mm%201_zpsfwmxd6xy.jpg

WO%209mm%202_zpsf1vcousi.jpg

The 9mm and 20mm appear to be the same design, although that isn't surprising lol.

WO%2020mm%201_zpsfbvhsobp.jpg

WO%2020mm%202_zpsvxgr7ukd.jpg

Probably influenced by everything from a Nagler or an Erfle to a Kellner. 

EyepiecesDiagram_zps0so8ivh8.jpg

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Looks like a modified Erfle design. Most SWA eyepieces use something along those lines. As said before fine in slower scopes, the edge correction struggles when the focal ratio drops below around F/7.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Looks like a modified Erfle design. Most SWA eyepieces use something along those lines. As said before fine in slower scopes, the edge correction struggles when the focal ratio drops below around F/7.

Yeah, the edge of field deterioration is mentioned a lot in reviews about the SWAN's, Sky-Watcher and similar. Hopefully this won't bother me too much in a bino pair predominantly used for planetary/lunar at a 140 - 200+ magnification.

The variety of eyepiece designs has always fascinated me. Apparently Plossls were originally difficult to manufacture and the subsequent unit price was too expensive until the 1980's. 

Although I'm fairly sold on the SWAN 9mm pair I'll probably get one other 15mm TeleVue Plossl to (make a bino pair) as well. On my Mak they will give me 87x and 140x (173x with 2x Barlow nosepiece) as another magnification combination.

The 8mm and 11mm TV Plossls are a bit too restrictive with their field stop size and ER.  The 15mm TV Plossl has a decent 12.6mm field stop with a 10mm eye relief yet is only 74g which should make a pair of them good bino material for use with my Mak.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

.....The variety of eyepiece designs has always fascinated me. Apparently Plossls were originally difficult to manufacture and the subsequent unit price was too expensive until the 1980's....

I've been fascinated with eyepieces since I started in the hobby in the 1980's :smiley:

I've lost count of the number I've owned, which is a bit embarrassing :embarrassed:

My 1st "proper" eyepieces, that is 1.25" ones as an upgrade from the .965" things that came with the scope, were 3 Tele Vue plossls bought for £50 each back in the late 1980's. That seemed a lot of money back then !

There is so much variety available now it's rather bewildering. Who would have thought that there would even be 100 degree eyepieces let alone a choice of half a dozen brands who do them to choose from ?

I think the general optical quality has improved overall though, which is a good thing for the amateur astronomer :smiley:

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I have the 6mm which is very close to the two scopes maximum magnification (200P dob / 76x700 cheap 3" refractor)

I found it to be an awful eyepiece.

However, I keep trying it again and again in case I missed something first time around.

It might work well in slow scope - but it struggles at F5.9 in the dob (saying that, the Delos struggles sometimes).

Maybe I'm just a fussy type of old bloke, or maybe the 6mm is bit of a dud.

The benefits are good eye relief, wide views, solid construction.

They are worth a try for £16 each from Ebay HK.

They are not so good value at £32 via a UK supplier.

The Delos struggles???, I have used a 6mm at F4.3 and I am very fussy, it is as sharp as a razor and only shows coma, of course with the Paracorr it does not. 

Alan

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I've been fascinated with eyepieces since I started in the hobby in the 1980's :smiley:

I've lost count of the number I've owned, which is a bit embarrassing :embarrassed:

My 1st "proper" eyepieces, that is 1.25" ones as an upgrade from the .965" things that came with the scope, were 3 Tele Vue plossls bought for £50 each back in the late 1980's. That seemed a lot of money back then !

There is so much variety available now it's rather bewildering. Who would have thought that there would even be 100 degree eyepieces let alone a choice of half a dozen brands who do them to choose from ?

I think the general optical quality has improved overall though, which is a good thing for the amateur astronomer :smiley:

I remember getting an optical 'Meccano' set one Xmas when I was little. I think it was German, which is why I know what bedienungsanleitung (operating instructions) means to this day lol!

It was incredibly educational and you could make things like a telescope, microscope, opera glasses inter alia with combinations of the parts and lenses. One thing that I learnt from that set was that almost all optical devices are a compromise of sorts.

Nowadays there seems to be a plethora of superb eyepieces on the market together with competitively priced telescopes. I became a bit of a TeleVue fanboy by accident after ordering their 3x Barlow and realising that it was such good quality I just had to get some of their Plossls at least. 

I'm in the process of acquiring a second TV 15mm Plossl for the bino. I'm going to buy the 9mm SWAN's as well, but I like the 15mm f/l for medium high magnifications. It is a nice compromise between field stop size and f/l. The 15mm TV Plossl was my favourite eyepiece more or less until I acquired the 16mm Nagler and it's a shame the 15mm Plossl just sits in my eyepiece case now virtually unused. So it will be nice to give it a new lease of life in a bino pair. 

I think with a pair of 9mm SWAN,15mm TV Plossl and 20mm SWAN eyepieces I should be well covered for a range of targets and conditions with the Mak/bino. The 19mm Panoptics will come into their own when I get the 235mm SCT.

And of course, there is the 10mm and 25mm Sky-Watcher MA's ... I'm gonna have to try them at least! 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'm not keen on the term "Fanboy". It implies a sort of mindless following of something. I choose Tele Vue because they are the best that I can afford but I've had to try a lot of alternatives to find this out !

I like Pentax for the same reason :smiley:

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Yeah, 'fanboy' is a bit derogatory lol. I agree TeleVue are quite well priced for the top end of the market, which is why I mostly use them. Some of the Pentax's look very good and I've heard perform superbly. I've seen some Explore Scientific EP's for over a grand each! I believe the TV 24mm Panoptic is their best selling EP. It wouldn't surprise me, that and the 32mm TV Plossl are my two main low power EP's. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The Delos struggles???, I have used a 6mm at F4.3 and I am very fussy, it is as sharp as a razor and only shows coma, of course with the Paracorr it does not. 

Alan

I should have clarified.

If the seeing is bad - it struggles.

The Skywatcher 66 degrees has poor sharpness whatever the seeing conditions are.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'm not keen on the term "Fanboy". It implies a sort of mindless following of something. I choose Tele Vue because they are the best that I can afford but I've had to try a lot of alternatives to find this out !

I like Pentax for the same reason :smiley:

I think many of us share this opinion, buying something because of right quality and costs doesn't make one a fanboy. You can easily see some fanboys on the other forum, those who jump on others when there's slightest implication that their stuffs are not perfect. :smiley:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Mak, hats off to you for getting over such traumatic events:-).

Have you considered a pair of Baader 18mm? Optically very good indeed, eye relief on the 18 is fine, very light in weight and with a x2 Barlow would give you the 9mm performance you seek. Very comfortable for extended viewing too.

All the best

Dave

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Mak, hats off to you for getting over such traumatic events:-).

Have you considered a pair of Baader 18mm? Optically very good indeed, eye relief on the 18 is fine, very light in weight and with a x2 Barlow would give you the 9mm performance you seek. Very comfortable for extended viewing too.

All the best

Dave

Thanks Dave, I've made a lot of progress, even in the past few months. I don't know which Baaders you mean exactly as they have some new eyepieces out now. The Hyperions are probably as heavy as the Celestron Luminos EP's. I actually have a 10mm Luminos, but two together would put one and a half pounds (680g?) on the weight of the 500g bino.

I have two TeleVue 19mm Panoptics and they would still come to about 400g together. FLO said they can get me the WO 2x nosepiece Barlow (WO bino's come equipped with a 1.6x) but I may have to wait a few weeks, which is fine, but the idea is that I could use either Barlow on the 9mm SWAN. I think using a nosepiece Barlow is probably the best option with a binoviewer. 

So far, I think two 9mm SWAN's, two 15mm TeleVue Plossls and the 20mm SWAN's that are included with the bino unit should be both light enough for me to manipulate on the 102mm Mak whilst giving me a decent range of magnifications from 65x to 231x.

This looks interesting though: http://www.firstlightoptics.com/baader-planetarium/baader-hyperion-zoom-barlow.html

Edited by Mak the Night

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Sorry Mak, I meant to say the Baader CLASSIC orthos..but with a 50 degree field of view, larger than normal orthos. And they are much lighter than Pans!

The Baader 2.25x Barlow you linked to is superb and should work well with your Binoviewers.

Good luck whichever way you choose:-)

Dave

Edited by F15Rules

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Sorry Mak, I meant to say the Baader CLASSIC orthos..but with a 50 degree field of view, larger than normal orthos. And they are much lighter than Pans!

The Baader 2.25x Barlow you linked to is superb and should work well with your Binoviewers.

Good luck whichever way you choose:-)

Dave

Found them! http://www.firstlightoptics.com/baader-planetarium/baader-classic-ortho-bco-eyepiece.html

They look pretty good actually, especially the 10mm. I'm spoilt for choice now lol!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Thanks Dave, I've made a lot of progress, even in the past few months. I don't know which Baaders you mean exactly as they have some new eyepieces out now. The Hyperions are probably as heavy as the Celestron Luminos EP's. I actually have a 10mm Luminos, but two together would put one and a half pounds (680g?) on the weight of the 500g bino.

I have two TeleVue 19mm Panoptics and they would still come to about 400g together. FLO said they can get me the WO 2x nosepiece Barlow (WO bino's come equipped with a 1.6x) but I may have to wait a few weeks, which is fine, but the idea is that I could use either Barlow on the 9mm SWAN. I think using a nosepiece Barlow is probably the best option with a binoviewer. 

So far, I think two 9mm SWAN's, two 15mm TeleVue Plossls and the 20mm SWAN's that are included with the bino unit should be both light enough for me to manipulate on the 102mm Mak whilst giving me a decent range of magnifications from 65x to 231x.

This looks interesting though: http://www.firstlightoptics.com/baader-planetarium/baader-hyperion-zoom-barlow.html

Baader Zoom barlow attached to binobody, give 4.08x magnification, and image is great. I measure and test all that.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Baader Zoom barlow attached to binobody, give 4.08x magnification, and image is great. I measure and test all that.

Wow! 4.08x, that's some magnification. Thanks for the info. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Reeny,

I will call off the Spanish Inquisition. two nights back I thought I had terrible seeing even at X50 or so. It turned out that where I keep the 18 inch the sun is now in a position where it can shine in the door (which was open) and hit the mirror box part. after an hour the seeing got very good indeed.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I have given up trying to cool the scope down Alan.

British weather at dusk - clear skies, good forcast = scope outside for an hour or two (sometimes under a barbecue cover).

1-hour later - hazy skies, lots of dew, dark clouds on the horizon = no decent viewing, go back to the TV.

2-hours later - patch cloud, lots of mist in the streetlights = no viewing, take the scope back inside to warm up and dry off.

Those hazy nights are when the 6mm Delos fails to deliver, but the lower magnifications can sometimes cut through the invisible moisture in the air.

6mm is an unforgiving eyepiece size in the 200P dob.

The skywatcher 66 degree just doesn't work for me, with my scope

(Disclaimer - other combinations of people / scope / or eyepiece may perform better)

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Oddly, I have two Celestron 6mm Plossls that came in different sets, it's highly unlikely I'll try them in the bino lol! I think with Plossls at least, 8mm is the smallest usable focal length.

Edited by Mak the Night

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.


  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

By using this site, you agree to our Terms of Use.