Frustrating Celestron 4se Setup

[Mache]

My o my am i having a frustrating time trying to get my 4SE to sit still on Jupiter...

Ive setup the scope level (with the type button level) on the mount and also on the scope itself with no luck atall.

Ive also tried different settings for 'Tracking Rate' Solar, Sidereal(?) and Lunar. Also have settings for 'Tracking Mode', EQ-North, EQ-South, Alt-Az and Off. Im pretty sure ive tried every combination [emoji22]

At the moment its on Jupiter with Solar and EQ-North.

Up to my wites end on what to do. Ive even contemplating selling it [emoji30]

What do i do?

Thanks

[ronin]

Mount is Alt/Az.

Tracking should be Sidereal - it's as good as anything.

Level is good (usually)

Longitude is -000  18' or 000  18'W

Latitude is +51  57' or  51  57'N

Your time zone is UTC or 00.

DST is On or Yes.

Date is 04/05/2015 (it is US format not UK)

What alignment stars did you use?

What eyepiece and magnification are you using?

[Mache]

Alignment stars are odd with the goto... half of them arent even in the goto, even Polaris (unless its called something else?)

Currently trying again with two star align one is Regulus 9oclock of jupiter and something else... this is the other thing with goto half of the stars in my sky (england) arent even on the goto's list. It wouldnt show venus in the sky as a option earlier... weird.

Im currently using a 3xbarlow and 25mm ep.

[Mache]

Alignment failed with the star above regulus. I understand i should align two stars either side on the sky but i just want to try getting it working for now.

Trying auto two star align now and Regulus isnt comming up in the selection. What a pain in the jeebies...

[ronin]

Trouble is the alignment stars for Celestron/SW is just about every half significant stars in the sky, every star in Leo is in as an option.

Algieba should be the one above Regulus.

Meades have a lesser number and only pick the lone bright ones, yours would I suspect be better if it had just Regulus and Denebola in from Leo and left the rest out.

Never fully followed the Celestron and SW alignment. If it is what I suspect I question it being 2 star alignment. I don't think the first star means much in one aspect.

All the Leo stars are given as March stars in the alignment stars, with it being April I suspect that the Leo ones are being "phased out".

Would have thought that Capella, Castor or Pollox were reasonable for the West side of the sky, not sure what is on the East as I cannot be bothered to walk out to the road and look back over the house. Arcturus and Spica seem OK for the Eastern side. Spica is marked as "April".

[Gazabone]

They are a bit of a pain. Sometimes I find Stellarium on my phone helpful to identify which stars to select. Another really important thing I've found on my 6se is the power supply; mine works so much better with the Badaar outside mains power supply than from a power tank.

I hope this doesn't sound like salt in the wound but I hooked my 6se up to starsense last night and it worked wonderfully.

In the meantime, can you get it to align to stars (forget planets for alignment purposes for the moment)?

Things to check are;

Is the location right?

Is the date right? Nb in American format, not British.

Is the mount level and tightened up securely?

Is the mount moving at all?

It is worth persevering with

I was a bit bemused last night to find that whilst M82 is in the starsense database, seemingly M81 isn't!

[Hyperion76]

If I am on a solar system object I do a solar system align it's good enough on objects like Jupiter used it tonight

[Backscatter]

Im currently using a 3xbarlow and 25mm ep.

Just a suggestion, I found it easier to use my largest eyepiece (32mm) to locate any 2 bright stars, regardless of sky location. Are you using the Barlow to locates your A.S.?   Just asking, I used to use a 12mm to see how good the system could work, but easier the larger  (FOV) IMO.

Once A.S.  obtained and centered, I'll throw a Barlow in and further center before saving alignment and going to the next of 2 stars (never had to do 3 star). 

Any 2 of the brightest stars (when "viewing",  clearly the brightest) ,  regardless of sky location should be enough to lock in tracking to get to Jupiter,  then further centering and tracking lock.

Hope things work out.

[orley]

If I am on a solar system object I do a solar system align it's good enough on objects like Jupiter used it tonight

Yes. Did exactly that last night. Jupiter in the eyepiece for over an hour at 105x. All it requires is a good polar alignment. A while ago I fully extended the legson the mount, positioned it facing north and drilled holes in the patio so that each time I could place the mount in exactly the same spot and height, then drift aligned. Now all I have to do is plonk the mount down in its spot and the initial positioning is good enough for a solar system alignment, or, like last night 15min guided subs until the fog rolled in.

Take things slowly and one at a time. Spend some time making sure the mount is in a good initial position. Patiently align each star, it helps if you have an illuminated reticle eyepiece. Don't use the barlow when aligning, you'll find it really difficult to get the star in view.

I used to worry about only using alignment stars that I knew. These days I just use whichever stars the handset picks, they're usually brighter than the surrounding stars.

I realise that it isn't always possible or practicle to place the mount in the same place each time. I did it initially to help isolate another issue, buf found it helped overall.

Orley

[ronin]

Occasionally using Jupiter etc goes a bit wrong.

The corrections determined and applied can be a little off.

Reason is that the stars have fixed positions (RA+Dec) the planets do not.

Therefore the scope has to compute the position of the planet for that date.

As the planets do not "move" uniformly at a constant spped, they slow down, go backwards, stop, go forward. It is a bit of a mess and inaccuracies can or will occur.

So if you use a planet then at some time the accuracy of the goto when it goes to something afterwards may be a little off. (Wide view eyepiece).

Just be aware that using a planet can lessen the accuracy, it will not destroy it however.

[Mache]

They are a bit of a pain. Sometimes I find Stellarium on my phone helpful to identify which stars to select. Another really important thing I've found on my 6se is the power supply; mine works so much better with the Badaar outside mains power supply than from a power tank.

I hope this doesn't sound like salt in the wound but I hooked my 6se up to starsense last night and it worked wonderfully.

In the meantime, can you get it to align to stars (forget planets for alignment purposes for the moment)?

Things to check are;

Is the location right?

Is the date right? Nb in American format, not British.

Is the mount level and tightened up securely?

Is the mount moving at all?

It is worth persevering with

I was a bit bemused last night to find that whilst M82 is in the starsense database, seemingly M81 isn't!

What i tend to do is use Google Sky, find a star in the sky with it then find it on thw Goto. But usually its not on there.

Think its going to be clear again tonight ill try writing down two stars that are on there and use them for the time being.

Also i didnt have the legs fully extended, i wouldnt have thought it mattered but ill extend them next time.

Fully charged my power supply, maybe i need a new one its fairly old(ish), i got it with the scope. Ill try mains fed aswell

[Mache]

Trouble is the alignment stars for Celestron/SW is just about every half significant stars in the sky, every star in Leo is in as an option.

Algieba should be the one above Regulus.

Meades have a lesser number and only pick the lone bright ones, yours would I suspect be better if it had just Regulus and Denebola in from Leo and left the rest out.

Never fully followed the Celestron and SW alignment. If it is what I suspect I question it being 2 star alignment. I don't think the first star means much in one aspect.

All the Leo stars are given as March stars in the alignment stars, with it being April I suspect that the Leo ones are being "phased out".

Would have thought that Capella, Castor or Pollox were reasonable for the West side of the sky, not sure what is on the East as I cannot be bothered to walk out to the road and look back over the house. Arcturus and Spica seem OK for the Eastern side. Spica is marked as "April".

I did recently follow a Youtube video doing a auto two star align which worked well a few weeks back. I was able to track orion nebulae with the camera attached and take some decent exposures up to 20 secs. Upon that i think i may of changed some setting in regards to post 1.

Its a shame that when you change from sidereal to solar viewing the setting dont automatically change for you. As a beginner this can be alot to take in.

[Mache]

They are a bit of a pain. Sometimes I find Stellarium on my phone helpful to identify which stars to select. Another really important thing I've found on my 6se is the power supply; mine works so much better with the Badaar outside mains power supply than from a power tank.

I hope this doesn't sound like salt in the wound but I hooked my 6se up to starsense last night and it worked wonderfully.

In the meantime, can you get it to align to stars (forget planets for alignment purposes for the moment)?

Things to check are;

Is the location right?

Is the date right? Nb in American format, not British.

Is the mount level and tightened up securely?

Is the mount moving at all?

It is worth persevering with

I was a bit bemused last night to find that whilst M82 is in the starsense database, seemingly M81 isn't!

Sorry for the long quotes cant quite get tapatalk to edit bits of the comment.

Ive put in US, date and time not sure what daylight saving (and the other other one is from the top of my head) is for. Is it for summer/winter times?

Tried the Lat and Long not sure if i was doing that right either.

The mount was level and tight but not extended. Is there another method to level? The mount also seemed sturdy.

What is Starsense? Is it something you connect via laptop? Easier to align?

[Mache]

Yes. Did exactly that last night. Jupiter in the eyepiece for over an hour at 105x. All it requires is a good polar alignment. A while ago I fully extended the legson the mount, positioned it facing north and drilled holes in the patio so that each time I could place the mount in exactly the same spot and height, then drift aligned. Now all I have to do is plonk the mount down in its spot and the initial positioning is good enough for a solar system alignment, or, like last night 15min guided subs until the fog rolled in.

Take things slowly and one at a time. Spend some time making sure the mount is in a good initial position. Patiently align each star, it helps if you have an illuminated reticle eyepiece. Don't use the barlow when aligning, you'll find it really difficult to get the star in view.

I used to worry about only using alignment stars that I knew. These days I just use whichever stars the handset picks, they're usually brighter than the surrounding stars.

I realise that it isn't always possible or practicle to place the mount in the same place each time. I did it initially to help isolate another issue, buf found it helped overall.

Orley

When you say positioned it north, are you pointing the scope at north direction with the scope on Index? Silly question probably [emoji1]

[Gazabone]

Sorry for the long quotes cant quite get tapatalk to edit bits of the comment.

Ive put in US, date and time not sure what daylight saving (and the other other one is from the top of my head) is for. Is it for summer/winter times?

Tried the Lat and Long not sure if i was doing that right either.

The mount was level and tight but not extended. Is there another method to level? The mount also seemed sturdy.

What is Starsense? Is it something you connect via laptop? Easier to align?

Easy bit first; starsense is a device Celestron have developed. It's basically a camera which fits where your Finder scope normally sits. You replace your normal handset with the handset that comes with starsense, connect the camera to the aux port on your mount, switch on and the confirm date, time and location. The scope then sweeps around the sky and in less than 3 mins its aligned. The first time you use starsense, you may need to calibrate the camera (quite easy to do) and thereafter shouldn't need realigning on that scope/mount combo.

Daylight saving is summer/winter times so daylight saving "yes" is summer time and "no" is winter time.

Are you in the US? making sure your location is reasonably accurate is vital. As an experiment a while ago I tried telling my scope I was in the US (I'm really in the UK). Whilst I could get the stars moderately aligned, Jupiter was about 30 degrees out; if you're in the UK and telling the scope you're in the US that will explain your problem finding Jupiter.

Hope this helps, and good luck, you'll love it when you've got it working right and I fully understand your frustrations; been there myself!

[Mache]

The starsense sounds pretty cool.

Im in the UK. On the daylight saving bit, which one do i choose as were sortof inbetween winter summer? Or doesnt it matter at this point.

[Gazabone]

The starsense sounds pretty cool.

Im in the UK. On the daylight saving bit, which one do i choose as were sortof inbetween winter summer? Or doesnt it matter at this point.

If you're in the UK but the scope thinks you're in the US that will explain why it won't align.

As far as the time is concerned you can put in either, you just need to tell the scope which it is that you're inputting. I'm typing this reply at 10:30 am summertime so if I was setting up the scope right now I either put in the time as 10:30 and say yes to daylight saving or say the time is 09:30 and say no to daylight savings, it's not really to do with the season, it's all about whether we're on British Summer Time (the clocks "went forward" last weekend so we're now on Summer time) or Grenwich Mean Time (GMT).

I would suggest that before you try aligning again, go into the utilities menu and do a couple of factory resets. The mount should build up information about how it's set up over time to improve accuracy but if its holding "bad" information at the moment, it's accuracy is already impaired. Factory reset will reset this.

Yes, starsense is cool, I had my doubts as I couldn't get it to work terribly well on my AVX mount but I read on another SGL forum it tends to work better on AltAz mounts (like the se series) than EQ mounts and my experience a couple nights ago bears this out very well.

Good luck :-)

[Mache]

Ahh i see now thanks buddy.

Ill give it another shot tonight weather permitting.

Thanks everyone

[orley]

When you say positioned it north, are you pointing the scope at north direction with the scope on Index? Silly question probably [emoji1]

Not a silly question at all. I looked for Polaris, placed the mount facing it, got it visible in the eyepiece and used that as a starting point. Made marks on the floor to drill holes into the next day. Drilled holes, next time out placed mout legs in the holes and drift aligned. Works a treat